The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[m80]

Just saw this:

Hospitality bosses battle to fill 355,000 roles before fully reopening

Restaurants in Britain are facing a recruitment crisis as they gear up to fully reopen in three weeks' time, after more than 350,000 jobs were lost in the hospitality industry during the pandemic.

mol.im

I see a rise in buffet style eateries. I'll have to get Mrs Me to go up for me, she is an immigrant after all.

 

[st13phil]

Other than cheaper vegetables in our shops perhaps.

Do we need cheaper vegetables?

(BTW, I lived for 14 years in P‘boro, and developed a reasonable understanding of how the gang master controlled agricultural labour sector works).

 

[st13phil]

Eliminating it (voluntarily, or via legislation) will have a very significant impact on our economy

That is not necessarily a bad thing. There are many countries across the globe that can run successful hospitality businesses without relying on (cheap) imported labour. The real question that needs to be addressed is why can’t we?

 

[markjay]

That is not necessarily a bad thing. There are many countries across the globe that can run successful hospitality businesses without relying on (cheap) imported labour. The real question that needs to be addressed is why can’t we?

I don't have a string opinion either way, my point it that a complex economy is a bit like a house of cards, it's easy to point at any single card and say 'let's pull this one out', but if we do so without proper planning we risk unexpected consequences.

 

[GeeJayW]

That is not necessarily a bad thing. There are many countries across the globe that can run successful hospitality businesses without relying on (cheap) imported labour. The real question that needs to be addressed is why can’t we?

Because there is a decreasing interest amongst the shirking classes in our self-interested society to take on menial tasks that provide a service to others, perhaps?

Gordon Ramsay: 'British workers are lazy'

The foul-mouthed star, 50, who has 31 restaurants, said that any curb on EU migrant labour, with Brexit, could be a wake-up call

www.birminghammail.co.uk

 

[ChipChop]

Maybe what is thought of as a menial task should be rethought.

Providing fresh nutritious produce to your local area is far from a menial task. The populations health and wellbeing depends on such things. A menial task could be redefined as something like a TV presenter or newsreader. Most people can read bullpoop from a script easily enough so pay the TV presenter minimum wage instead of the farmer or crop picker.

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[davymead]

Maybe what is thought of as a menial task should be rethought.

Providing fresh nutritious produce to your local area is far from a menial task. The populations health and wellbeing depends on such things. A menial task could be redefined as something like a TV presenter or newsreader. Most people can read bullpoop from a script easily enough so pay the TV presenter minimum wage instead of the farmer or crop picker.

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Couldn’t agree more.

 

[grober]

ANOTHER TRAVESTY---apparently its OK to sell honest hardworking people dangerous property- and when the defects are discovered expect them to pay for the remediation - not the people who built them!

Grenfell: Survivors condemn new fire safety laws

Campaigners say "a generation of homeowners" face financial ruin after protections are left out of new laws.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Dryce]

ANOTHER TRAVESTY---apparently its OK to sell honest hardworking people dangerous property- and when the defects are discovered expect them to pay for the remediation - not the people who built them!

Grenfell: Survivors condemn new fire safety laws

Campaigners say "a generation of homeowners" face financial ruin after protections are left out of new laws.

www.bbc.co.uk

The article is a bit confusing but it seems to suggest that a huge wodge of public money is being provided.

Perhaps the solution is for people to be able to offset the costs in the form of profit sharing. Public assistance is provided for remediaton on the basis that it is paid back out of increases in value when the property is subsequently sold or otherwise passed on or if it is rented - with that liability passing to successive owners until the assistance is repaid..

 

[GeeJayW]

ANOTHER TRAVESTY---apparently its OK to sell honest hardworking people dangerous property- and when the defects are discovered expect them to pay for the remediation - not the people who built them!

Grenfell: Survivors condemn new fire safety laws

Campaigners say "a generation of homeowners" face financial ruin after protections are left out of new laws.

www.bbc.co.uk

The companies/officials that signed off on the dodgy cladding, should foot the bill for putting their mistake right.

 

[grober]

Why should the taxpayer or property owner have to bail out dodgy building companies for constructing substandard properties? Afaik the government scheme only covers property 18 metres and above. While a scheme which depends on increased PROPERTY values with time to repay the debt seems OK on paper- with the increased regulatory burdens and debt, mortgage and insurance difficulties and many flats in a high rise complex simply abandoned by their owners [who have declared themselves bankrupt] realising any future equity on these properties is going to be very problematic.

Fire Safety Bill: Consideration of the Lords amendments, House of Commons, 24 February 2021

We welcome the introduction of the Fire Safety Bill and hope it will be an important step in the right direction. We are concerned about some of the practicalities of the Bill, how it aligns with the building safety proposals the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government (MHCLG) is...

www.local.gov.uk

 

[markjay]

I think that the obvious issue here is that most construction companies will be Ltd or Plc, and if faced with a gigantic bill will simply fold-up, leaving landlords without financial remedy (and, even sole traders or owners of small businesses can declare personal bankruptcy).

It would be interesting to know if this could be claimed off the companies' Product and Public Liability policy, but even so, the amount of cover available under the policy might not be sufficient given the potential size of the claims.

 

[Fununcle]

Why should the taxpayer or property owner have to bail out dodgy building companies for constructing substandard properties? Afaik the government scheme only covers property 18 metres and above. While a scheme which depends on increased PROPERTY values with time to repay the debt seems OK on paper- with the increased regulatory burdens and debt, mortgage and insurance difficulties and many flats in a high rise complex simply abandoned by their owners [who have declared themselves bankrupt] realising any future equity on these properties is going to be very problematic.

Fire Safety Bill: Consideration of the Lords amendments, House of Commons, 24 February 2021

We welcome the introduction of the Fire Safety Bill and hope it will be an important step in the right direction. We are concerned about some of the practicalities of the Bill, how it aligns with the building safety proposals the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government (MHCLG) is...

www.local.gov.uk

In many cases it isn't "dodgy" construction firms it is poor building control regulations which is set by government so they should be paying in many cases. I do however agree that the one group that shouldn't pay is blameless homeowners.

 

[markjay]

...I do however agree that the one group that shouldn't pay is blameless homeowners.

Agreed. In normal circumstances, this will be a cost to the landlord, which will be passed-on to leaseholders, but these are not normal circumstances.

 

[Piff]

So in the construction industry, I have an interest.
Firstly, a change in the building regulations many years ago from set definitions to open "requirements" to achieve standards allowed anyone to declare their product was fit for purpose.
Manufacturers pushing their products which they claimed met the required standards.
Building inspectors/inspection now a competitive market, with the introduction of private companies alongside the local authorities. I now find the local authority inspectors asking if I'm happy with their comments as if customer service is more important then set standards.

In my opinion, the manufacturers of the sub-standard cladding should be first in line for the costs of putting this right, with the specifiers (architects and may be local authorities) next, followed by the developers. In no way should it fall on the building owners or leaseholders unless they were involved with the specification process.

Surely the manufacturers insurance, specifiers insurance, developers insurance (products liability) should have this covered - if not, what is the purpose of insurance?
I can see insurers washing their hands if their customers were found to be telling fibs about the products they were supplying. Then the blame/cost must be with the fib tellers.

 

[mattc]

I wonder if we took away the licence of the manufacturers to operate in the UK completely they would be more interested in doing the right thing"? They clearly knew there was an issue.

 

[neilrr]

Why do buildings use cladding? Is it purely decorative or does it serve another purpose?

 

[mattc]

Why do buildings use cladding? Is it purely decorative or does it serve another purpose?

Decorative and weatherproofing I believe

 

[grober]

Cladding (construction) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Piff]

Decorative and weatherproofing I believe

Could also add insulation properties & fire protection properties (but obviously not in this case)