The UK Politics & Brexit Thread

[davymead]

Mixture of local politics - what people are against as well as for. The SNP gets a proportion of the incumbent vote that used to go to Labour in Scotland. People don't punish political parties in a consistent way - we have naional examples of this. And single issues can complicate things - as witnessed by Brexit and the Labour party - it was played as a Conservative 'thing' but it seems to have impacted Labour's core vote in parts of England.

And a lack of oversight. This comes in two forms. The weakness of the Scottish parliament as an institution and weakness of coherent opposition. And the lack of oversight by press and public because Holyrood sits below the level of the UK national press and media.

As an example - the unresolved scandal of Ferguson Marine seems to have done almost no tangible damage to the incumbent SNP. It continues to fester with the occasional mention in the press - but no real holding to account as regards to responsibility and decision making.

Informed and interesting reply, many thanks.
Intriguing to me then, that Sturgeon would seem to get a completely disproportionate opportunity by the English media to spout her lies.

 

[m80]

Well read the article on India,and right at the start of it the author ignored what went wrong,a lock down was called for and as so often happens in that part of the world it was mostly completely ignored,

I felt his valid point on the India lockdown was that in the over populated areas it caused the disease to propagate. The effect there being the more affluent were better for the strategy, while the poorer suffered increased cases of covid and also lost the revenues that made life minimally possible.
The stories of the new immigrant unemployed attempting to travel 00's and ,000's of miles to return the where they may get some support was something I hadn't considered.

Our one size view of how things must be done is shown to be inappropriate in other regions.

It seems to me that w/o massive world support many of these regions are screwed.

 

[m80]

I was expecting the SNP to suffer due to v recent events, but the electorate of Scotland are still supporting them and Sturgeon.

Sadly I don't see the reduced appetite for independence that I anticipated.

 

[markjay]

I was expecting the SNP to suffer due to v recent events, but the electorate of Scotland are still supporting them and Sturgeon.

Sadly I don't see the reduced appetite for independence that I anticipated.

I think that it shouldn't be taken for granted that everyone who voted SNP are in favour of Scottish Independence. And vice versa, not everyone who didn't vot SNP is necessarily opposed to Scottish Independence.

Polls suggest that the population of Scotland is split 50%-50% on the topic.

 

[m80]

I think that it shouldn't be taken for granted that everyone who voted SNP are in favour of Scottish Independence. And vice versa, not everyone who didn't vot SNP is necessarily opposed to Scottish Independence.

Polls suggest that the population of Scotland is split 50%-50% on the topic.

Applying that as a vague principle there are as many not in favour but voting for, as in favour but not voting for.

I view that if independence would be increasingly distasteful to the populace the election results for the SNP would be a reasonable barometer to see that. Some swing away from SNP was as I expected, largely due to they sharing my perception that the SNP demonstrate an inability to govern honestly and effectively.

But how much of the Westminster corruption influences that (as their alternative to independence) I can't quantify.

 

[Swotty]

 

[Bellow]

Maybe now is the time for the UK Government to carry out a full audit of the COVID monies given to the previous administration ?

Maybe now is the time for the UK to carry out a full audit of the COVID monies given to the UK Government's friends - which Scotland has to pay for?

 

[Bellow]

Polls suggest that the population of Scotland is split 50%-50% on the topic.

And what of the Scots?
(Eg, the English voted for Brexit - not the population of England).

 

[markjay]

And what of the Scots?
(Eg, the English voted for Brexit - not the population of England).

I don't think we have these distinctions in electoral register...

 

[markjay]

Maybe now is the time for the UK to carry out a full audit of the COVID monies given to the UK Government's friends - which Scotland has to pay for?

Valid point.

But is this really the reason why those in favour of Scottish Independence are supporting it?

Or is it rationalisation? I.e. they started with the conclusion, and are now looking (selectively?) for facts to support it?

 

[C240Sport97]

Looking at votes in Scotland, no of votes for Unionists is (albeit by not much) greater than independence parties

Unionists: 1,353,377
Nationalists: 1,326,204

 

[GeeJayW]

Maybe now is the time for the UK to carry out a full audit of the COVID monies given to the UK Government's friends - which Scotland has to pay for?

Absolutely. Any and all monies from the tax payer distributed in response to the Covid pandemic or indeed anything else should be transparently accountable and in compliance with the prevailing rules.

 

[Benzowner]

Looking at votes in Scotland, no of votes for Unionists is (albeit by not much) greater than independence parties

Unionists: 1,353,377
Nationalists: 1,326,204

View attachment 112813

So on the map as shown, if Scotland vote for independence, does the England/Scotland border move farther north assuming the tory seats vote against it?

 

[GeeJayW]

So on the map as shown, if Scotland vote for independence, does the England/Scotland border move farther north assuming the tory seats vote against it?

Bunch of sassenachs anyway, good riddance…

Scots Word of the Season: 'Sassenach' - The Bottle Imp

Sassenach adj. and n. English; an English person Sassenach is derived from the Scottish Gaelic word sasunnach, literally meaning ‘Saxon’, and originally used by Gaelic speakers to refer to non-Gaelic speaking Scottish Lowlanders. Scots, after all, is descended from northern varieties of the...

www.thebottleimp.org.uk

 

[pmcgsmurf]

Looking at votes in Scotland, no of votes for Unionists is (albeit by not much) greater than independence parties

Unionists: 1,353,377
Nationalists: 1,326,204

Don't let that get in the way of the cry for "democracy".

 

[Fununcle]

Why does anyone care about Scottish independence, if they want to go fair enough let them, no point in getting uptight. In five years time we can all laugh behind our hands and say I told you so.
Reminds me of another stupid decision, can't think what though.

 

[Dryce]

I think that it shouldn't be taken for granted that everyone who voted SNP are in favour of Scottish Independence. And vice versa, not everyone who didn't vot SNP is necessarily opposed to Scottish Independence.

Polls suggest that the population of Scotland is split 50%-50% on the topic.

The media played Brexit as being one fixed side against another.

The reality is a spectrum of views.

Even the quesrion about indepedence (yes or no) is subject to interpretation.

My anger about the situation in Scotland is that the political situation and regional government is dominated by the independence question as if it were one thing and SNP are in a position to drive it from a position of being in power as opposed to justify it as a non-government campaign. Scotland is now in a rut with only one exit with the SNP dominating Holyrood. It is too easy for the SNP to take a contrarian path on issues for their own sake at Scotland's expense rather than being constructive - because profit an approach that seeks to grind out more and more division even if it hurts Scotland. And they can show largesses with taxpayers' money because they are not held accountable for the fiscal arithmetic and can spend money raised elsewhere in the UK.

The structure of the UK with the UK parliament and English parliament being the same thing doesn't help matters. A reorganisation with devolved administration of English regions along with Scotland, Wales, and NI under a federal UK parliament would be much healthier.

I'm deeply uncomfortable that as a British citizen that Ms Sturgeon has stated at times that I can travel with freedom within Scotland but not to the rest of the UK - and particularly England. My view is that we need a sort of Magna Carta type declararion of UK rights that curtails this sort of arbitrary petty control on public freedom by Holyrood and that the authority over where as a citizen I can travel is a matter for Her Majesty's Government and not some toxic separatist martinette in Holyrood trying to demonstrate power over me to establish division in the UK.

 

[Dryce]

Looking at votes in Scotland, no of votes for Unionists is (albeit by not much) greater than independence parties

Unionists: 1,353,377
Nationalists: 1,326,204

The total of about 2.7 million represents about half the Scottish population.

 

[zipdip]

Well scottish independence is ok but all th scottish people holding high office in our parliament will have to return over the border,after all we would not want a french or german person in charge of the treasury or defense

 

[LTD]

How can the SNP claim any ground regarding an Independence referendum when they neither got an overall majority at the election for MSPs at Holyrood nor a considerable majority of cast votes ?

More sabre-rattling to keep her nose in the trough.

Remember, this is a ruling administration where the Minister for Justice holds no Law Degree and the Finance Minister holds no Financial Degree.

They have a mandate for nothing