Thinking 'M3 CSL'....am I mad?

[tlbham]

High mileage Lotus Elise S1 are still £8-10k - at least that could still be used often.

Really? I thought their Rover engines were notoriously unreliable?
This aside, I'm more of a "POWERRRRRRR!" type of guy than a looking for a nimble lightweight car.

 

[wemorgan]

Really? I thought their Rover engines were notoriously unreliable?

It's gossip often repeated as fact. Yes head gasket failures are more common than seen on other engines, but the gossip is more widespread than the reality.

HGF is cheaper to repair than rust

 

[Dand]

This appeals but apparently 2nd hand prices are silly for the airbox and exhaust; whilst BMW won't sell you one without a CSL V5

Thats kind of pooed on the parade a bit but i bet the likes of AC schnitzer, Hartge, and eisenmann have made products with a similar out come.

I have to confess as much as i like the CSL i would never want one as a daily drive. Because it would fail the would i be happy driving it home after a cra*py day at work when im cold, hungry, and tired test.

I havent been lucky enough to have a go in an M3 but imo alot of scare mongering has gone on with the SMG systems and the likes. If you have confidence in it from yours and your friends experiences with it, you shouldnt let its reputation get in the way of you buying a car with SMG if its what you want. If you like power have you considered a C55?

 

[c_200k]

Go for it mate, Owning an ///M car is special just like AMG

i got 2 cos one is never enough:bannana:

 

[Dand]

Its no CSL but the upgrades to the e46 M3 engined e36 have made it sound pretty juicy.

[YOUTUBE]AZTANLOkWM0[/YOUTUBE]

 

[gIzzE]

2 cars out of 27 over the last 15 years I have regretted selling, my E320cdi estate and my M3 CSL.

I sold my CSL in under an hour on the M3 forum, in fact it wasn't even an advert, I mentioned I might sell it and got 3 PM's, the guy who I replied to first called me that night, flew down from Edinburgh the next night and we shook on it, he transfered the money the next morning and a trailor picked it up at 1pm the same day.

They will always sell, and quickly.

However.......

You say the seats may get tiresome as a daily driver?
So how many miles are you going to do in it?

Mine had 16k miles on it when I sold it, it was a second car, although I used it alot.

A 50k miles car that is doing 12k miles a year will be nearly a 90k mile car in 3 years time, that will not appreciate imho.

Buy a 30k mile car and do 5k miles a year if you want to 'not loose money' on one.


But definitely buy one, truly stunning machines, so much more than a 911, they are like a baby GT3 than a basic 911.

I sold that car 3 years ago now for £31500, I bet if it has only done 5k miles a year since it is still worth that, maybe more.

 

[gIzzE]

Don't think they're cheap to run.

The reason I sold it was I got jarred off with the costs.

I hit a hare on the back road and ripped the bumper apart, carbon fibre job at £2800.
The insurance for it was up that month too, £1200 (was £345 for the 535d sport touring I had at the same time btw.).
Then the warranty came up as well, £1050.
Then 3 days after I put the new bumper on I hit a cone in the middle of the dual carrigeway, another £2800.
Including fuel etc. that month that car cost me around £7500, so although they are down do the £20-30k mark if you want to look after them properly and not be worried about engine failures etc. they do cost a few quid to keep spot on.

 

[c_200k]

looks stunning mate, not jealous one bit

 

[scillyisles1]

CSL are great cars - I have had one since new.
Provided you do not need replacement body parts - they are cheap to run. Insurance is now £539 per year - they are very good on fuel for the performance 23-24 mpg average plus normal servicing is very reasonable. I have not bothered with a warranty as I have had the car since new.
For the first 18 months of owning the car I used to commute in and out of London in it - I changed the standard seats to Recaro Style seats which suited me better than the OEM Recaro Pole Position derivatives.
Good ones are becoming much scarcer and are retaining their value or appreciating. Mine has now done 29K and given the history, immaculate condition and provenance would probably be worth approaching £34 -35K.

 

[Doodle]

This is something that I always found ironic. Everyone goes on about x or y being such a great drivers car, but then in the same breath the perceived value is ruined if you actually drive it anywhere.

Just seems a bit pointless really...

 

[gIzzE]

This is something that I always found ironic. Everyone goes on about x or y being such a great drivers car, but then in the same breath the perceived value is ruined if you actually drive it anywhere.

Just seems a bit pointless really...

But with a track car you can't expect to do put 100k miles on it and it still appreciate.

It is a drivers car, and I bet you could put 8k miles a year on it and it would still hold its value.

 

[AMG Steve]

Being a EX CSL owner I would have to say buy the car.....
Its twice the price BUT half the deprecition, make sure it has FULL history and quality tyres fitted, the Michelin Cups fitted to the CSL from new are fabulous BUT crap if the road is damp....and only about 5mm of tread when new OUCH !!!
Black is the rarest colour, some say only 122 units were made in Black from a total of 422.. inported into the UK
I have a few pictures of my old CSL in members albums, if you fancy a peep
http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/members/amg-steve-albums-2004-bmw-e46-m3-csl-sapphire-black.html
Good luck finding a nice one mate HISTORY HISTORY HISTORY is what you have to have

Steve

 

[Doodle]

But with a track car you can't expect to do put 100k miles on it and it still appreciate.

It is a drivers car, and I bet you could put 8k miles a year on it and it would still hold its value.

I'm not sure even that...most of the high value CSL's I've seen do 3k a year at most. For example, I spotted a pair of 2004 CSL's at the same dealer. Otherwise identical, one's done 24k, the other 50k. The 2nd car is going for over £6k less.

Hence my postulation over which is better. A handful of miles in a CSL, or buy something that's nearly as good that allows you to get a load more wheel time? I guess therein lies the difference between a track hack and something that's more of a collector's piece.

 

[gIzzE]

I also had a regular M3, this one.....

Also a very nice car, however....it is not a CSL.
They are so different to live with.

Personally though I would buy the CS and just enjoy it knowing if you loose 50% in 2 years so what!!?

 

[Doodle]

Personally though I would buy the CS and just enjoy it knowing if you loose 50% in 2 years so what!!?

That was exactly my thought

 

[tlbham]

Thanks for all the comments guys. It seems the overall consensus has moved from 'house' to 'M3', and moreover 'M3 CSL'...

A couple of you asked how much I'd use it and what for. My daily commute is a 21 mile round trip. With personal use and random work jollies to the North I tend to rack up 10-12k a year. The M3 (whichever one I get) would be my only car so I'd probably be shooting myself in the foot if I got a low mileage one - my useage would kill its resale value.

The carbon fibre horror stories certainly raised my eyebrows. I'd be temped to fit a spare standard M3 bumper with a cold air hole cut into it (for the CSL airbox) for daily use!

Something else which you have to consider too when weighing this decision up are the chaps in their M3-lookalike 330cis who refer to each other as "blud". I suspect a lot of those M-badges and trim come from M-cars left in lonely multi-storey car parks (and occasionally I can't park under my office and have to use just such a car park with no CCTV). In fact, I've seen a cat D M3 on Autotrader before, written off due to someone nicking most of removable M stuff. I suspect the risk of this is even bigger with a CSL. Insurance would pay for it, but just the fact you'd need to really think about where you leave the car, plus the potential ball-ache when it gets vandalised, doesn't sound like a fun proposition.

A high mileage but well looked after M3 (or M3 CS), with some 'alterations' to get that raw CSL sound I fell in love with, probably makes the most sense considering the amount I'd be using it and my unwillingness to suck up sudden £2500 bumper repair bills.

 

[gIzzE]

I am sure the bumpers etc. can be repaired or replaced with a 3rd party one these days, just back then there was little option in that regard.

 

[John]

Something else which you have to consider too when weighing this decision up are the chaps in their M3-lookalike 330cis who refer to each other as "blud". I suspect a lot of those M-badges and trim come from M-cars left in lonely multi-storey car parks (and occasionally I can't park under my office and have to use just such a car park with no CCTV). In fact, I've seen a cat D M3 on Autotrader before, written off due to someone nicking most of removable M stuff. I suspect the risk of this is even bigger with a CSL. Insurance would pay for it, but just the fact you'd need to really think about where you leave the car, plus the potential ball-ache when it gets vandalised, doesn't sound like a fun proposition.

A timeless issue for anyone with a car like this unfortunately.

I wouldn't want to leave a CSL around in a multi-storey.

When I had the afore-mentioned M3 Evo, I had to leave it in a multi-storey in Leicester whilst visiting a customer.

As it happens it was fine (except I scraped the bumper on a black plastic bit as the turns were tight and the M3 low!) but that grim feeling of prospective vandalism haunted me for a while as a walked away.

I know of some people who have more than one car - you could buy and run two cars - that M3 CS and say an older 'banger' for less money than the CSL but then you have the issue of possibly never using the M3.

It's a tough decision but if it is something that is going to concern you - you have to question whether it is worth it or not.

 

[tali]

Being a EX CSL owner I would have to say buy the car.....
Its twice the price BUT half the deprecition, make sure it has FULL history and quality tyres fitted, the Michelin Cups fitted to the CSL from new are fabulous BUT crap if the road is damp....and only about 5mm of tread when new OUCH !!!
Black is the rarest colour, some say only 122 units were made in Black from a total of 422.. inported into the UK
I have a few pictures of my old CSL in members albums, if you fancy a peep
http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/members/amg-steve-albums-2004-bmw-e46-m3-csl-sapphire-black.html
Good luck finding a nice one mate HISTORY HISTORY HISTORY is what you have to have

Steve

106 Black ones. I think Black better investement than Silver despite daft claims of Silver being quicker and better looking.

 

[rothbury]

Thanks for all the comments guys. It seems the overall consensus has moved from 'house' to 'M3', and moreover 'M3 CSL'...

A couple of you asked how much I'd use it and what for. My daily commute is a 21 mile round trip. With personal use and random work jollies to the North I tend to rack up 10-12k a year. The M3 (whichever one I get) would be my only car so I'd probably be shooting myself in the foot if I got a low mileage one - my useage would kill its resale value.

The carbon fibre horror stories certainly raised my eyebrows. I'd be temped to fit a spare standard M3 bumper with a cold air hole cut into it (for the CSL airbox) for daily use!

Something else which you have to consider too when weighing this decision up are the chaps in their M3-lookalike 330cis who refer to each other as "blud". I suspect a lot of those M-badges and trim come from M-cars left in lonely multi-storey car parks (and occasionally I can't park under my office and have to use just such a car park with no CCTV). In fact, I've seen a cat D M3 on Autotrader before, written off due to someone nicking most of removable M stuff. I suspect the risk of this is even bigger with a CSL. Insurance would pay for it, but just the fact you'd need to really think about where you leave the car, plus the potential ball-ache when it gets vandalised, doesn't sound like a fun proposition.

A high mileage but well looked after M3 (or M3 CS), with some 'alterations' to get that raw CSL sound I fell in love with, probably makes the most sense considering the amount I'd be using it and my unwillingness to suck up sudden £2500 bumper repair bills.

Yes go for the car! There is no guarantee that it will be a given that your house price will increase as it has always tended to do in the past bar the odd temporary slump or two. Everything is so uncertain at the moment . No country in Europe has a housing market like ours where for years people have got considerably richer from their property alone. Renting is more common in Europe. The current Euro crisis could spell a disaster for our housing market with much higher mortgage interest rates loads of repossessions and a general malaise in our economy. I was one of the lucky ones to buy years ago but I dion't think the future will be like the past so enjoy the car enjoy the flexibility of renting and wait to see what happens!