Very obscure question about historic ride firmness

[Engadine]

This is a very obscure question but if anyone's view on this matters, it's someone here.

Back in the early 1990s when I was a kid, an uncle of mine bought a new W124 220 CE Coupe with Sportline suspension. The facelift had just taken place and I thought the car looked very cool, although kept wondering why he hadn't bought a 6 Cyl version. He drove me across Belgium in it, and I remember thinking the Sportline ride (with shorter, stiffer springs) was amazingly uncompliant and quite uncomfortable; while the car also didn't seem very agile (in my view from the passenger seat).

My question is: how firm would that car's Sportline suspension on 15 inch wheels and higher profile tyres feel now, in the context of AMG-line, as well as the full AMG, suspension? If I time travelled, would it feel soft and smooth compared to my W204 C63 estate (which feels brittle on its 19s)? Cars did ride more softly and roll more in those days, but also technology has moved on to such an extent that you can now have cars that ride well and handle flat.

No reason for wanting to know, apart from the fact that I would like some views. No point either in seeking out a 30 year old 220 CE Sportline to try now, as the suspension will be far from brand new!

 

[Spider10]

I had the mk2 golf gti 16v in 1990 from new and probably felt the same as the w204 c63 in theory but probably wasn't I do know the pre facelift c63 pp car had extremely harsh suspension hence why it was dropped from the ppp facelift ((things felt different when i was 18)

 

[Steve84N]

Suspension has been ruined somewhat since the turn of the millennium. Lots of cars end up with something that is undersprung and then overdamped to compensate. This means the dampers don't let you use enough of the travel on sharp bumps as they're tuned to provide support in the corners, which should mainly come from the springs, or you end up with big ARBs that bring their own problems.

It's definitely possible to be sporty and compliant, Alpina come to mind as an excellent example. They have cars with rubber band tyres, not much suspension travel yet they are comfy and sporty on the road.

I'm not a fan of adjustable dampers either. All the cars I've tried the difference from one extreme to the other isn't worth it and then you're often (if not always) on a setup where the springs don't perfectly match the dampers, unless it's air sprung... The best road cars I've tried are fixed suspension setups, or at least adjustable dampers that you set once to your taste and then leave alone.

My S204 C63 feels like it has too much low speed compression damping as it's jarring over speed bumps or similar. Up to speed it's fairly well judged. The more expensive dampers (beyond what you find fitted OEM) have more diversity and sophistication in their damping effects.

 

[190]

My question is: how firm would that car's Sportline suspension on 15 inch wheels and higher profile tyres feel now, in the context of AMG-line, as well as the full AMG, suspension? If I time travelled, would it feel soft and smooth compared to my W204 C63 estate (which feels brittle on its 19s)?

My guess is that it would feel comfortable compared to a W204 C63 but less controlled.

A standard W124 was one of the benchmarks for ride comfort in it's class and if the sportline had been excessively firmer it would have attracted severe criticism at the time. My recollection is it didn't.

 

[ChrisHGTV]

Suspension has been ruined somewhat since the turn of the millennium. Lots of cars end up with something that is undersprung and then overdamped to compensate. This means the dampers don't let you use enough of the travel on sharp bumps as they're tuned to provide support in the corners, which should mainly come from the springs, or you end up with big ARBs that bring their own problems.

It's definitely possible to be sporty and compliant, Alpina come to mind as an excellent example. They have cars with rubber band tyres, not much suspension travel yet they are comfy and sporty on the road.

I'm not a fan of adjustable dampers either. All the cars I've tried the difference from one extreme to the other isn't worth it and then you're often (if not always) on a setup where the springs don't perfectly match the dampers, unless it's air sprung... The best road cars I've tried are fixed suspension setups, or at least adjustable dampers that you set once to your taste and then leave alone.

My S204 C63 feels like it has too much low speed compression damping as it's jarring over speed bumps or similar. Up to speed it's fairly well judged. The more expensive dampers (beyond what you find fitted OEM) have more diversity and sophistication in their damping effects.

I think very similar. The over-damping i think is the real culprit (on compression). My E250 small bump compliance is pretty poor, especially for the type of car it is. I also think the degradation of road surfaces doesn't help. I had a Fiat Coupe 20V Turbo and apparently for the UK market the suspension and damping was made softer to accommodate. (I ruined it by changing to Eibach and Bilstein)

I spent countless hours researching the suspension on my Alfa GTV to find the optimum set up and that's been quite interesting. It's now on new standard springs but Koni adjustable shocks. Ive been playing with the rebound damping and the sweetspot for me is having it set near the minimum, which is slightly above stock. Increasing the damping further quickly upsets the balance. When i did a road trip in it through Europe i added two clicks on the damping and it was brilliant because the roads were generally smoother. Even my wife noticed when we got back to Dover that it was just horrid so i went back to my "UK" setting! The only thing im not sure of is how the rear wheel steering is affected but i would think on standard springs it should be the same.