VW lying about 'cleaned diesel'...

[nico2014]

Hi folks,

Just thought if you have not seen this news lately, you might be interested in knowing what has happened lately in the US with VW cars faking the test results with cleaned diesels...

VW ?Clean Diesel? Scheme Exposed as Criminal Charges Weighed - Bloomberg Business

VW now facing £18 billion dollars in fine... Ouch that hurts...

 

[Mr Kripling]

Hmm... I can't help wondering whether the EPA was passed some documents by a certain Herr Piech.

 

[nico2014]

This is quite a shocking news. Now they are talking about potentially recalling all VW cars in Europe...

This could have a knock on effect if vehicles are proven to be driving illegally and maybe other car manufacturers also do the same thing as what VW did...

 

[MikeHartley]

This is quite a shocking news. Now they are talking about potentially recalling all VW cars in Europe...

This could have a knock on effect if vehicles are proven to be driving illegally and maybe other car manufacturers also do the same thing as what VW did...

And I just bet they do.........
Watch this space, as they say.

 

[Steveml63]

Hi,
You would be surprised what goes into modern diesel and petrol car ECU software.
Anecdotely, cars for many years have behaved as if on a fuel consumption test - if started from cold at a certain outside temperature and then driven in a certain way - the ECU then goes into "fuel saving mode" - to enhance consumption.
This is allegedly one reason why you can never replicate manufacturers fuel consumption figures.
Crash structures are designed to perform well in crash tests - why wouldn't the fuel injection system be designed to perform well in fuel and emission tests?
IMHO - this is the tip of the iceberg!
Cheers
Steve

 

[Ted]

I wonder what the road fund licence implications would be...

 

[Tim203]

Maybe they'll have to upgrade Grams of co2 / km to Kg.

 

[clk208]

This perhaps explains some of the crazy Audi drivers you see. Inhaled too much of their own NOx emissions perhaps..

 

[Crazyfool]

VW aren't having a good run at the moment. They are having to resolve oil issues on all their 2.0T engines between 2009 and 2012 by means of a £5.5k engine rebuild!

VAG were sued in the US and have agreed to repair all engines for free where as in the rest of the world negotiations are still ongoing.

 

[automaniaman]

Shocking..

 

[Steveml63]

They certainly seem to have upset somebody in high places!

 

[bh13coupe]

The EPA are now targeting other brands to see if this is not just a VW related issue.
I wonder how many cars can have the software flashed remotely to remove any evidence??

 

[Mr Kripling]

It's telling that Daimler's response to the news about VW was a rather flimsy "The issue described by the press does not apply to Mercedes-Benz Cars" instead of an outright denial that MB uses any sort of "defeat device".

As I mentioned above, I don't think it's hugely surprising that this issue has blown up a couple of weeks before the VW AG Supervisory Board meeting where Winterkorn was supposed to get his contract extended. Something tells me that he's now going to be defenetrated in the same way as Pischetsrieder, Pfaegen, Wiedeking and everyone else who disappoints Ferdl.

 

[Dryce]

The EPA are now targeting other brands to see if this is not just a VW related issue.
I wonder how many cars can have the software flashed remotely to remove any evidence??

I think that if there's a large gap between emissions performance under test and in actual use with one brand (ie. VW in this case) then they'll question any other manufacturer with diesels who are anywhere close to the numbers that VW had under test.

I think it may also raise supplementary questions about manufacturers supplying diesel cars with AdBlue SCR systems to reduce NO and the real use of AdBlue as opposed to its use when the emissions test takes place. Are these systems there more for show?

 

[Driver15]

Thread already started here - http://www.mbclub.co.uk/forums/general-discussion/197695-vag-recall-half-million-cars-us.html

 

[Dryce]

The EPA are now targeting other brands to see if this is not just a VW related issue.
I wonder how many cars can have the software flashed remotely to remove any evidence??

I meant to add to my other reply to your post.

Flashing the software doesn't necessarily solve the emissions numbers problem - and would in principle mean the cars no longer perform as tested.

That's potentially a huge problem.

This is why a 'recall' may not actually have any practical use.

 

[The _Don]

Vw shares -20% at present.

 

[Driver15]

Thing is, its not a case of a device, its surely just a set of parameters within the ecu which when triggered do x changes to get the best MPG, ie turning Air con off, reducing throttle response etc etc..

Its a known fact that the EPA and EU Emissions are all not real world tests.

 

[theogeor]

.

Its a known fact that the EPA and EU Emissions are all not real world tests.

Which I think is one of the main root causes of this problem/issue we see. I dont see how a rolling road fuel/emission test can represent the reality. Saying that is one of the only ways that actual comparison can be done as it keeps all external conditions constant

I think a combination of testing will be more suitable and more close to reality

TG

ps: I can bet that the problem we see with VW is more widespread

 

[DrNick]

So what will a recall actually achieve?

Will it just remove the offending part of the software, which will make no practical difference as it is never used in normal usage?

Or will it force the ECU to use the super efficient testing parameters all the time, thus rendering the performance useless (presumably).

Given that these cars (in the UK anyway) will have to pass an MOT, will that make a difference? Does the car detect when its undergoing an MOT and switch parameters accordingly?
Or is the MOT such a slack test that the MOT limits are so far in excess of what the engine emissions should be, and again it won't make a blind bit of difference?

What difference would a remap make to all of this?


I suppose the best we can hope for is that the VW technology actually cannot meet emission standards because it is different from other peoples technology, which can, and so requires them to doctor the software.
The alternative is that no-ones technology can meet the standards, in which case they are all in trouble!

(If I had one of these dodgy VWs, I don't think I'd be responding to the recall!)