W124 1991 500E Suspension

paddy@polyposta

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OK so took all four wheels off today to give them a good clean and clean all calipers!!

Noticed this on front suspension!!

Now my car has obvioulsy been lowered at the front:

lowered at front.JPG

but whats going on here?

DSC03894.JPG

DSC03896.JPG

Paddy
 

Uberwagon

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Your car was lowered by someone who didn't know what they were doing.

When these are lowered you need to remove part of the bump stop on the shock itself, if not you hit a bump, which mashes up the bump stop, which is the chewed up piece around the shaft in your picture.

Also, on genuine shocks they have an internal bump stop so when the wheel leaves the ground the shock isn't transmitted through the body of the shock itself.

You need to remove the shock, fit some standard shock bump stops and then cut one of the 3 rubber sections away.

Dave!
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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You mentioned about getting the suspension set up properly by someone who knows what they are doing in one of my other posts! Will have to get that done.....

Paddy
 

Uberwagon

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You may need camber correction top mounts fitted. They are doing a deal on them on 500ecstasy.com at the minute.

Mine is on the No1 spring cups and I will see what my camber figures come out like by the end of the week hopefully.

Dave!
 

kth286

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with that amount of lowering on that car, you need to have shorter dampers (if they are not already) or they WILL bottom out and get ruined.

If those are standard dampers my guess is that they are probably not fit for purpose already.

You need to remove them and test them to see if they mtch the Mercedes spec for pressure force on rod.

Also test whether the rod travel is smooth, both compressing and extending.

If there is any stickiness AT ALL the damper is faulty and neds to be repaired or replaced.
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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Your car was lowered by someone who didn't know what they were doing.

When these are lowered you need to remove part of the bump stop on the shock itself, if not you hit a bump, which mashes up the bump stop, which is the chewed up piece around the shaft in your picture.

Also, on genuine shocks they have an internal bump stop so when the wheel leaves the ground the shock isn't transmitted through the body of the shock itself.

You need to remove the shock, fit some standard shock bump stops and then cut one of the 3 rubber sections away.

Dave!

Hi Dave, did you get those camber figures then chap?

Paddy
 

talbir

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Hi Paddy

Absolutely lovely 500E...looks the cats knackers !

You referred me to this link....i think Dave (Uberwagon) has given you best advice already.

My black 500E is lowered as aggresively as can be - H&R with 1 nib spring cups, probably sitting almost 1/2 inch lower than yours ! I am running adjustable Koni shocks which are absolutely superb. They work perfectly with the H&Rs.

No reason you cannot run your stock 500e shockers with this set-up, but as Dave set, you need to cut one section of the bump stop off. AMG did this on their system designed for the w124 E60. The shocks were the same length as the stock item, i had a full set but sold it.

Another shock you can rely on to do well with this set-up is the Sachs item, labeled 'Super-sport', fitted standard item to al 190E 2.3-16s.

I think the starting point would be to renew both the upper mounts (3 bolts hold this onto the frame at the top of the strut in the engine bay)...these upper mounts are crucial for correct functionality of the shocks. i would then replace both the wood look stop pieces but cut one section off as Dave highlighted, replace both rubber boots and ideally a set of Koni adjustables should provide perfect setup.

cheers
talbir
 

500E

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What an awesome Brabus styled 500E! Is this the one you imported from Japan?
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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What an awesome Brabus styled 500E! Is this the one you imported from Japan?

It is indeed, have had her just over a year now, recently had wheels refurbished and colour coded to car in 199 Paint, will post pictures soon

Paddy
 

500E

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Nice...do you still want to sell it? Or decided to keep her?

I know how hard it is to let go, when we sold our 93 E500 back in 05'...I can still remember that day!
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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What I have had done since posting this thread!

Hi Paddy

Absolutely lovely 500E...looks the cats knackers !

You referred me to this link....i think Dave (Uberwagon) has given you best advice already.

My black 500E is lowered as aggresively as can be - H&R with 1 nib spring cups, probably sitting almost 1/2 inch lower than yours ! I am running adjustable Koni shocks which are absolutely superb. They work perfectly with the H&Rs.

No reason you cannot run your stock 500e shockers with this set-up, but as Dave set, you need to cut one section of the bump stop off. AMG did this on their system designed for the w124 E60. The shocks were the same length as the stock item, i had a full set but sold it.

Another shock you can rely on to do well with this set-up is the Sachs item, labeled 'Super-sport', fitted standard item to al 190E 2.3-16s.

I think the starting point would be to renew both the upper mounts (3 bolts hold this onto the frame at the top of the strut in the engine bay)...these upper mounts are crucial for correct functionality of the shocks. i would then replace both the wood look stop pieces but cut one section off as Dave highlighted, replace both rubber boots and ideally a set of Koni adjustables should provide perfect setup.

cheers
talbir

Ummm.......

Well I did take some of that advice and had the following work done recently by Auto Elite in Hull!..........http://www.autoelitehull.co.uk/index.html

RECENT WORK

1. Renewed Steering Damper
2. Renewed Steering Idler Bush
3. Renewed Ball Joint off side
4. Renewed 2 x Track Rod Ends
5. Flushed out and replaced SLS Fluid
6. Flushed out and replaced Brake Fluid
7. Inspected Engine Mounts - OK
8. Inspected Rear Strutt Rubber - OK
9. Inspect Wiring Harness - OK
10. Inspect Water Pump/Radiator/Thermostat - OK
11. Fitted new pair of front clear indicators genuine merc
12. Fitted new pair UK spec headlamp lenses - (Has just faild MOT this weekend on these!!)
13. Fitted Clear Side Repeaters
14. All four alloys refurbushed and painted in 199 to match body work leaving polished rims
15. Drivers electric seat fixed as not all functions working correctly
16. Inspected front suspension/springs/dampers. Car has been lowered as low as it can go and has no option now to be raised. Would need new springs to raise ride height! Car sits almost dragster like
17. Parrot Hands Free Kit installed

RESULTS FROM THIS WORK

The serious wheel wobble problem that the car had developed has almost completely gone, but you can still feel a slight wobble in the wheel...although she does drive a lot better

Auto Elite then advised that I change both front tyres.......so fitted a pair of Vredestein Sessanta's

RESULTS FROM CHANGING FRONT TYRES

Again a bit more of an improvement, but still feel a slight wobble

Auto Elite then advised I also change both rears......so fitted some more Vredestein Sessanta's 265/35/18

RESULTS FROM CHANGING REAR TYRES

Much more grip, but still have slight wheel wobble

I think the next stage then would be to change the set up of the suspension itself, take the front up a bit and see how we go.

When I first bought the car, the front tyres had severe wear on the insides of the tyres and the back had wear also on the insides but not s bad as the fronts.

If I decided to change the dampers and springs....what would be the best set up to go?

I have found a set of Brabus Springs W124 500E/E500 new for 490 Euros?

Is that a good price and would these be ideal?

Paddy
 

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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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More Pics...............

More Pics.........

Paddy
 

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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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Nice...do you still want to sell it? Or decided to keep her?

I know how hard it is to let go, when we sold our 93 E500 back in 05'...I can still remember that day!

Keeping her now........just spent another 1400.00 on her recently

Paddy
 

Dieselman

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Those inner front suspension bushes look past their best and was the car lowered before the tyres wore the inner shoulder out, do you have any reference to the camber setting.?
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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Those inner front suspension bushes look past their best and was the car lowered before the tyres wore the inner shoulder out, do you have any reference to the camber setting.?

Couldnt tell you that as I imported the car from Japan and that sort of information is not possible to get hold off.

I do have results from camber alignment once all the work above was carried out, but have misplaced the paperwork, will post when I get another copy tomorrow from autoelite

Paddy
 

talbir

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Paddy

Clearly alot of work done on the car.

Before splashing out further dollars and given the symptoms you describe, i'd run one test, if you haven't already.

Fit a set of stock MB 16" or 17" 1-piece wheels and tyres and see if that carries the same issue. In many instances, such symptoms can arise due to wheels not being 'true' and when dealing with multi-piece wheels like the Brab ones on yours, the issue can be magnified. What balancing weights are there on the front wheels...if there are alot adding up to over 30g, then the wheel maybe warped/untrue.

I don't see that this issue is related to ride height. The tyre wear is likely a result of bad camber/castor alignment. My black 500E is lowered more than yours and doesn't have the tyre wear issues that many think must occur with low ride height.

You can raise your car without changing the springs, simply fit thicker spring pads, they come in 1 nib to 4 nib on the w124. 3 nib might be the best bet if you want to carry some margin, although 2 nib pads will raise the car materially. I think the car looks nicely poised, and changing ride height is unlikely to resolve the issue.

A couple of items that can make a substantial difference :

- rear torque arms
- roll bar bushes (front and rear)


But my first suggestion would be to drive the car with simple stock wheels. I have a set that i know are true, if you wish to borrow, you are welcome anytime.


cheers
talbir
 

Uberwagon

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Also make sure that the place you had your tyres fitted can balance the wheel correctly. It took a couple of places till mine were properly balanced and I still don't know why this was an issue.

Car really does look nice :cool:

Dave!
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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Also make sure that the place you had your tyres fitted can balance the wheel correctly. It took a couple of places till mine were properly balanced and I still don't know why this was an issue.

Car really does look nice :cool:

Dave!

Thanks dave, nice to hear from you again. Yes I think I will book it in with Mercedes Lincoln and get them to check out the wheels

Paddy
 
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paddy@polyposta

paddy@polyposta

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Paddy

Clearly alot of work done on the car.

Before splashing out further dollars and given the symptoms you describe, i'd run one test, if you haven't already.

Fit a set of stock MB 16" or 17" 1-piece wheels and tyres and see if that carries the same issue. In many instances, such symptoms can arise due to wheels not being 'true' and when dealing with multi-piece wheels like the Brab ones on yours, the issue can be magnified. What balancing weights are there on the front wheels...if there are alot adding up to over 30g, then the wheel maybe warped/untrue.

I don't see that this issue is related to ride height. The tyre wear is likely a result of bad camber/castor alignment. My black 500E is lowered more than yours and doesn't have the tyre wear issues that many think must occur with low ride height.

You can raise your car without changing the springs, simply fit thicker spring pads, they come in 1 nib to 4 nib on the w124. 3 nib might be the best bet if you want to carry some margin, although 2 nib pads will raise the car materially. I think the car looks nicely poised, and changing ride height is unlikely to resolve the issue.

A couple of items that can make a substantial difference :

- rear torque arms
- roll bar bushes (front and rear)


But my first suggestion would be to drive the car with simple stock wheels. I have a set that i know are true, if you wish to borrow, you are welcome anytime.


cheers
talbir

Thats very good of you to offer Talbir, I am going to check weights first and also confirm with Autoelite in Hull ref the front spring pads as I am sure he said they were already on the highest setting on the pads.

I have to call them today anyway regarding the headlamp lenses they have fitted to my car as they failed me on an MOT this Sat!

Paddy
 

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