Word of Warning

[MeanRedSpider]

None of this will come as a surprise but I just wanted to flag here about my experience of buying an “Approved Used Mercedes”, Mercedes UK customer services and Mercedes factory follow-up.

I’ve posted elsewhere on here about my bitter experience with my W213 E400d All-Terrain model and my 2.5 year, ultimately unsuccessful, battle to get this car fixed.

Short summary: from the time I bought it (about 3 years old) from the dealership that had serviced it its entire life, it had an issue of gear-change judder after about 1.5 to 2 hours of driving. Nearly 2 years into the investigation, it was discovered that the vacuum pipe to the turbo was melting because it runs too close to the DPF. Eventually Mercedes factory created a fix that solved that problem but didn’t fix the gear-change issue (they thought the gearbox was not changing properly because the car wasn’t seeing the torque it was expecting).

I rejected the car and I’m now driving a 530d. Here’s why:

1. Mercedes took almost no interest in the problem. Even though they implemented a factory fix on my car for the design flaw, they have done nothing to any other 400d All-Terrain - nor is there any technical note on the MB system (I have checked). They’ve effectively “buried” the issue despite the service manager agreeing with me that they will probably all have this issue.
2. Approved Used means nothing. MBUK wanted nothing to do with the ongoing gear-change issue - just pointing me back to the dealer.
3. Within days of rejecting the car, it was for sale on an independent dealer in Manchester’s website and already “reserved”. Some poor soul has bought the car with the “irreparable” fault with the explicit knowledge of the Mercedes main dealer and MBUK. The reg is YK19USJ for reference.

After 25 years continuous Merc ownership, I’ve moved to the Dark Side (the BMW drives better but isn’t as comfortable or as sophisticated in many ways. BMW UK customer service and tech support is infinitely better though).

For the time being we still have the A200 but my wife’s next car won’t have the 3-pointed star.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

None of this will come as a surprise but I just wanted to flag here about my experience of buying an “Approved Used Mercedes”, Mercedes UK customer services and Mercedes factory follow-up.

I’ve posted elsewhere on here about my bitter experience with my W213 E400d All-Terrain model and my 2.5 year, ultimately unsuccessful, battle to get this car fixed.

Short summary: from the time I bought it (about 3 years old) from the dealership that had serviced it its entire life, it had an issue of gear-change judder after about 1.5 to 2 hours of driving. Nearly 2 years into the investigation, it was discovered that the vacuum pipe to the turbo was melting because it runs too close to the DPF. Eventually Mercedes factory created a fix that solved that problem but didn’t fix the gear-change issue (they thought the gearbox was not changing properly because the car wasn’t seeing the torque it was expecting).

I rejected the car and I’m now driving a 530d. Here’s why:

1. Mercedes took almost no interest in the problem. Even though they implemented a factory fix on my car for the design flaw, they have done nothing to any other 400d All-Terrain - nor is there any technical note on the MB system (I have checked). They’ve effectively “buried” the issue despite the service manager agreeing with me that they will probably all have this issue.
2. Approved Used means nothing. MBUK wanted nothing to do with the ongoing gear-change issue - just pointing me back to the dealer.
3. Within days of rejecting the car, it was for sale on an independent dealer in Manchester’s website and already “reserved”. Some poor soul has bought the car with the “irreparable” fault with the explicit knowledge of the Mercedes main dealer and MBUK. The reg is YK19USJ for reference.

After 25 years continuous Merc ownership, I’ve moved to the Dark Side (the BMW drives better but isn’t as comfortable or as sophisticated in many ways. BMW UK customer service and tech support is infinitely better though).

For the time being we still have the A200 but my wife’s next car won’t have the 3-pointed star.

Sorry to hear of your problems. How did you reject the car after more than 2 years?

 

[DesireeE]

None of this will come as a surprise but I just wanted to flag here about my experience of buying an “Approved Used Mercedes”, Mercedes UK customer services and Mercedes factory follow-up.

I’ve posted elsewhere on here about my bitter experience with my W213 E400d All-Terrain model and my 2.5 year, ultimately unsuccessful, battle to get this car fixed.

Short summary: from the time I bought it (about 3 years old) from the dealership that had serviced it its entire life, it had an issue of gear-change judder after about 1.5 to 2 hours of driving. Nearly 2 years into the investigation, it was discovered that the vacuum pipe to the turbo was melting because it runs too close to the DPF. Eventually Mercedes factory created a fix that solved that problem but didn’t fix the gear-change issue (they thought the gearbox was not changing properly because the car wasn’t seeing the torque it was expecting).

I rejected the car and I’m now driving a 530d. Here’s why:

1. Mercedes took almost no interest in the problem. Even though they implemented a factory fix on my car for the design flaw, they have done nothing to any other 400d All-Terrain - nor is there any technical note on the MB system (I have checked). They’ve effectively “buried” the issue despite the service manager agreeing with me that they will probably all have this issue.
2. Approved Used means nothing. MBUK wanted nothing to do with the ongoing gear-change issue - just pointing me back to the dealer.
3. Within days of rejecting the car, it was for sale on an independent dealer in Manchester’s website and already “reserved”. Some poor soul has bought the car with the “irreparable” fault with the explicit knowledge of the Mercedes main dealer and MBUK. The reg is YK19USJ for reference.

After 25 years continuous Merc ownership, I’ve moved to the Dark Side (the BMW drives better but isn’t as comfortable or as sophisticated in many ways. BMW UK customer service and tech support is infinitely better though).

For the time being we still have the A200 but my wife’s next car won’t have the 3-pointed star.

That makes for very sad reading indeed MeanRedSpider and I I'm really gutted for you.

I certainly can't blame you for jumping ship and trying out another marque, although one bad apple does not not necessarily spoil the bunch, as you already know, having owned MB for 25 years solid.

The funny thing is, I had a lovely BMW back in the day, and took it to D*ck Lovett in Bristol, the service I received there was abysmal, so much so I wrote to BMW UK, something I have never done before or since, i.e. I mean to contacted a HQ. I got a phone call back from them, message left on my answerphone, called them back and told them exactly what had happened and no embellishment as that is not in my nature. I was asked by the gentleman what outcome I would like from there on and I simply said such like, for it to not happen to any other customer in a similar situation that I had found myself to be in. His reply was that he would make sure that changes would take place, I could not ask better than that, but needles to say, I never bought a BMW again and never will, and I jumped ship to Mercedes-Benz

 

[MeanRedSpider]

Sorry to hear of your problems. How did you reject the car after more than 2 years?

Quite simple really - I was able to demonstrate that the problem had been there from the time I’d bought it and that they’d had ample opportunity to fix it and were unable to do so. The law gives them one opportunity. It took over 3 months to actually get ti the point that I got my money back and I had to haggle over the value - I just insisted that I should be able to buy a car if the same spec and mileage. The car was up for sale again for about £900 more than I got so I wasn’t far off.

 

[MeanRedSpider]

That makes for very sad reading indeed MeanRedSpider and I I'm really gutted for you.

I certainly can't blame you for jumping ship and trying out another marque, although one bad apple does not not necessarily spoil the bunch, as you already know, having owned MB for 25 years solid.

The funny thing is, I had a lovely BMW back in the day, and took it to D*ck Lovett in Bristol, the service I received there was abysmal, so much so I wrote to BMW UK, something I have never done before or since, i.e. I mean to contacted a HQ. I got a phone call back from them, message left on my answerphone, called them back and told them exactly what had happened and no embellishment as that is not in my nature. I was asked by the gentleman what outcome I would like from there on and I simply said such like, for it to not happen to any other customer in a similar situation that I had found myself to be in. His reply was that he would make sure that changes would take place, I could not ask better than that, but needles to say, I never bought a BMW again and never will, and I jumped ship to Mercedes-Benz

I needed to contact BMW customer services because I was struggling to get Apple CarPlay to install (it was just very slow it turns out) and they were soooo much better than when I’ve ever needed support for similar things from Mercedes. It’s fair to say that, in my 25 years, I’ve generally loved the products but absolutely HATED Mercedes customer services. They are, in my experience, both arrogant and incompetent - always have been. When I contacted them about some sort of compensation for the turbo issue that I’d had for TWO years before the factory fix for the design flaw, they said I should be satisfied because that had “fixed it for free” and they had “kept me mobile”. I responded that, if that’s the standard of care, I’d be buying a BYD next time.
I miss the comfort and sophistication of my E-Class but I’m enjoying the handling of the BMW - it behaves much better when pushed along (I’ve raced for a hobby for the last 15-20 years so I know of what I speak). I wouldn’t say one was better than the other - just different emphasis.

 

[DesireeE]

*I needed to contact BMW customer services because I was struggling to get Apple CarPlay to install (it was just very slow it turns out) and they were soooo much better than when I’ve ever needed support for similar things from Mercedes. It’s fair to say that, in my 25 years, I’ve generally loved the products but absolutely HATED Mercedes customer services. They are, in my experience, both arrogant and incompetent - always have been. When I contacted them about some sort of compensation for the turbo issue that I’d had for TWO years before the factory fix for the design flaw, they said I should be satisfied because that had “fixed it for free” and they had “kept me mobile”. I responded that, if that’s the standard of care, I’d be buying a BYD next time.
I miss the comfort and sophistication of my E-Class but I’m enjoying the handling of the BMW - it behaves much better when pushed along (I’ve raced for a hobby for the last 15-20 years so I know of what I speak). I wouldn’t say one was better than the other - just different emphasis.

I can't fault you there as first hand experience out ways hearsay every time.

I like that bit about being 'satisfied', darn cheek of it and a wonder they didn't say 'delighted' ha-ha. I think that because these folks work in a area of a prestigious Marque, they take on the airs of that said marque and forget themselves as they are no better than the rest of us.

Reminds me of the time we shot down to a local garage in the Forest of Dean that happened to be selling electric bikes that were a new thing at the time, and a pretty penny too I might add. Now we turned up in our old togs and really didn't give it a thought, well until the young sprog of a sales assistant came over to us and started to talk the talk as it were. Then he proceeded to give us a look up from feet to head and that was the BOTH of us mind ... hmmmm, that set me right off and well and truly pushed my button. So I thought I would give him a dose of his own medicine and very slowly like, started at his head, looked down to his feet and back up taking a nice long pause at his tackle shop, after which he turned a lovely shade of puce and rather smartish like, left us when the older and much more polite gent came over and things became more civilised shall we say. Didn't end there though, as things took a funny turn as we were cogitating over the bike sat outside in our Merc, when the shop shut up, and the young sales chap left the place on his moped, you couldn't write it better than that eh?

Wow! Had the opportunity to enter the race circuit impressive and I bet you have some exciting tales to tell. Something I couldn't do, have trouble with speed and bends, last time I took a turn was as a child on the local fairground Noah's Ark ride, and felt so giddy and sick, that did it for me, what a woose - yep I admit it.

A bit like you, I loved the Beemer, and love my Mercs passed and present, but a bad episode and leave an unpleasant taste, wishing you happy miles and smiles ahead for you though.

 

[tonysmb]

I needed to contact BMW customer services because I was struggling to get Apple CarPlay to install (it was just very slow it turns out) and they were soooo much better than when I’ve ever needed support for similar things from Mercedes. It’s fair to say that, in my 25 years, I’ve generally loved the products but absolutely HATED Mercedes customer services. They are, in my experience, both arrogant and incompetent - always have been. When I contacted them about some sort of compensation for the turbo issue that I’d had for TWO years before the factory fix for the design flaw, they said I should be satisfied because that had “fixed it for free” and they had “kept me mobile”. I responded that, if that’s the standard of care, I’d be buying a BYD next time.

Ah, you might want to review your choice if hoping to 'penalise' the dealer; my local MB dealer group has recently taken on BYD dealerships in addition to MB. Perhaps word went around the trade and you gave them an idea, catch the customer either way

I recall your earlier threads about your problems and it seems such a shame as I quite liked the idea of the All Terrain models, although I've only seen one on the road (well, a ferry, to be more accurate )

 

[ALFAitalia]

None of this will come as a surprise but I just wanted to flag here about my experience of buying an “Approved Used Mercedes”, Mercedes UK customer services and Mercedes factory follow-up.

I’ve posted elsewhere on here about my bitter experience with my W213 E400d All-Terrain model and my 2.5 year, ultimately unsuccessful, battle to get this car fixed.

Short summary: from the time I bought it (about 3 years old) from the dealership that had serviced it its entire life, it had an issue of gear-change judder after about 1.5 to 2 hours of driving. Nearly 2 years into the investigation, it was discovered that the vacuum pipe to the turbo was melting because it runs too close to the DPF. Eventually Mercedes factory created a fix that solved that problem but didn’t fix the gear-change issue (they thought the gearbox was not changing properly because the car wasn’t seeing the torque it was expecting).

I rejected the car and I’m now driving a 530d. Here’s why:

1. Mercedes took almost no interest in the problem. Even though they implemented a factory fix on my car for the design flaw, they have done nothing to any other 400d All-Terrain - nor is there any technical note on the MB system (I have checked). They’ve effectively “buried” the issue despite the service manager agreeing with me that they will probably all have this issue.
2. Approved Used means nothing. MBUK wanted nothing to do with the ongoing gear-change issue - just pointing me back to the dealer.
3. Within days of rejecting the car, it was for sale on an independent dealer in Manchester’s website and already “reserved”. Some poor soul has bought the car with the “irreparable” fault with the explicit knowledge of the Mercedes main dealer and MBUK. The reg is YK19USJ for reference.

After 25 years continuous Merc ownership, I’ve moved to the Dark Side (the BMW drives better but isn’t as comfortable or as sophisticated in many ways. BMW UK customer service and tech support is infinitely better though).

For the time being we still have the A200 but my wife’s next car won’t have the 3-pointed star.

A couple of things.....Mercedes are correct to send you back to the dealer.....your contract is with them not Mercedes......its up to the dealer to get settlement/help/contributions from the marque if they feel the need.

Secondly , no problem is irreparable and since Merc did not know how to fix yours then it must be a pretty rare fault for the not to be a TSB about it. So maybe it has been fixed before sale.....we can always hope!!

 

[markjay]

Unfortunately this is a recurring theme on here, I.e. people buying an Approved Used MB only to find out that it can be an uphill struggle to get issues sorted.

In contrast, I had a major warranty repair on my Hyundai, and I have to say that I am very pleased with how both the dealer and Hyundai UK dealt with the issue.

Glad you managed to resolve the issue at the end.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Unfortunately this is a recurring theme on here, I.e. people buying an Approved Used MB only to find out that it can be an uphill struggle to get issues sorted.

In contrast, I had a major warranty repair on my Hyundai, and I have to say that I am very pleased with how both the dealer and Hyundai UK dealt with the issue.

Glad you managed to resolve the issue at the end.

We mostly hear about the bad experiences - or the experiences which aren’t necessarily bad but don’t end up in the favour of person posting - but few take time to post about the positive and neutral experiences. It applies to all brands.

In the OPs example, the car being outside of the manufacturer’s warranty period is likely to be an important but important influence in the outcome. The Approved Used warranty is less comprehensive.

I’ve had too many experiences of things that have not gone my way with Mercedes but it doesn’t mean that they’re bad, they’re a business and there’s a limit as to what they can and will do even for regular customers.

An unusual aspect of this particular experience is that there is a factory fix for a design flaw which will not be applied to any other cars. It would be usual for a fix not to be applied to other cars.

Not issuing a TSB or recall is not the same as not applying the same fix to other cars.

 

[Fastcar155]

I have used three different Mercedes Benz dealers , Cheltenham and Plymouth and found both dealerships generally first rate.

I cannot say the same of Worcester , refused to change brake fluid although on a service pan ( backed down after I made a fuss ) and had no idea as to the engine oil used in the service.

All they would say it was approved by Mercedes.

The service I received from A Mercedes Benz went from awful to excellent , to my mind it depends on the service agent your e mail lands.

Such a shame

 

[MSG2004]

I have used three different Mercedes Benz dealers , Cheltenham and Plymouth and found both dealerships generally first rate.

I cannot say the same of Worcester , refused to change brake fluid although on a service pan ( backed down after I made a fuss ) and had no idea as to the engine oil used in the service.

All they would say it was approved by Mercedes.

The service I received from A Mercedes Benz went from awful to excellent , to my mind it depends on the service agent your e mail lands.

Such a shame

I've posted similar and said it on other threads - it's the luck of the draw about how you are dealt with ie who the service manager is and or the person
you are dealing with.

Some may recall the nox sensor f'd up on my gle just outside the 3 year warranty by a couple of months - the car had about 12/13k miles on it a
FSH by MB all within time. The service manger that dealt with my car said she'd try to get MB to sort it, they did FoC. this is a few years ago
On my previous MB's, all bought from a main MB dealer, and a gent called John at Dartford was one of the best service managers I'd ever met at any main dealer

So, if you have a problem, - go in armed with knowledge - even if you get frustrated by the long waiting times for even the intail diagnosis etc, remain nice and polite as this goes a long way IMO - I'm not say people here are not, just saying as it makes it easier for the service manager/rep to digest what you are saying.

My first MB in 2004 a year old c class had to go back many times for pulling to the left and I guess I could have rejected the car but the way I was treated at the main dealer meant I accepted these things happen and they eventually sorted the car

 

[W1ghty]

There was a thread on the other MB forum , same engine involved . The issue again was the same pipe collapsing but it was thought to have been caused by the excess engine heat because of towing .
The pipe was eventually replaced by MB who had to design a new reinforced pipe .