Xenons and vehicle mods in general - re Insurance cover.

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GuyFawkes

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Original article at http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/moneybox/7861184.stm

Insurers warn on car alterations
By Bob Howard
BBC Radio 4's Money Box


Drivers who significantly modify their vehicles must alert insurers or risk losing cover, insurers caution.
Changes include anything which affects a car's performance, safety, or the odds of it being stolen or vandalised.
These can include fitting alloy wheels, built in sat-navs or entertainment systems.
The Financial Ombudsman Service says insurers must prove that there has been a significant change to the associated risks for cover to be withdrawn.
'Important' changes
Mohammed from Leicester claimed on his insurance after a BMW he bought for £20,000 second hand was badly vandalised, causing £5,000 worth of damage.
He was not aware that some of the car's features were a result of modifications requested by the original owner.
When the insurance assessor discovered modified headlamps, sat-nav and seats it refused to pay out until he agreed to pay an extra £1,000 on his premium and excess.
He agreed, but still thinks it was unfair:
"I shouldn't have been penalised like that as obviously I wasn't aware of it."


Insurers have different policies over what changes they expect drivers to alert them to. Insurance brokers have seen other examples of controversial decisions.
Peter Staddon, from the British Insurance Brokers Association, says whilst drivers have a duty to disclose important changes, some insurers extend the definition too far:
"We've had silly situations where we've had an insurance company try and throw claim out on the grounds that they had a roof box."
Onus on insurer
Norwich Union says it has several hundred disputes on this issue each year.
It exempts any changes made for an owner before a car leaves the factory, but it requires any alterations after that to be declared.
Nigel Bartram is the company's motor underwriting strategy manager:
"We price the risk on the information we're given and if that proves not to be right we're fully within our rights to void the policy."


Insurers concede that some changes, like some engine modifications, may be impossible for many people to detect. Unresolved disputes can end up at the Financial Ombudsman Service.
Peter Hinchcliff, its lead ombudsman for insurance, says the onus is on the insurer to explain their actions:
"We'll expect the insurer to explain why the work that was done was relevant for them.
"It's got to be something that makes a difference to the risk they are taking on."
The consumer's group Which? advises anyone buying a second hand car to ask the seller if there have made any modifications and consult a local dealer if they are still not sure.


BBC Radio 4's Money Box was broadcast on Saturday,
31 January 2009 at 1204 GMT.
 
Changes include anything which affects a car's performance, safety, or the odds of it being stolen or vandalised. These can include fitting alloy wheels, built in sat-navs or entertainment systems. The Financial Ombudsman Service says insurers must prove that there has been a significant change to the associated risks for cover to be withdrawn.

I don't believe the story that the man didn't know his BMW was modified, but the rest is interesting as it puts the onus on the insurer to prove they have reasonable grounds to refuse a claim due to the risk significantly increasing due to the modification.

I was a bit peeved when I changed my standard alloys for some different Mercedes alloys of the same size and fitment to be told I had to pay extra premium.
I can't see how that significantly affects the risk to the insurer.
 
It's a grey area for most. Some insurers ask for modifications to the standard car including factory fit options. How are people expected to know this, you would have to be a complete geek to know the standard spec of a 10 year old car, I suspect dealers would struggle to give the correct details too.

Fine for chipping the ECU, adding bigger alloys, spoilers etc etc but this just gives Insurers the ability to walk away from a claim.

When I changed my insurance to the CLK55 I was asked what modifications had been added, even factory fit, I struggled to answer fully but said satnav, sunroof and phone. That is all I could think of. What if I forgot to add the optional cupholder........???
 
Then the cupholder police would be after you ...
 
What if I forgot to add the optional cupholder........???

That would only decrease the attractiveness, so they would be Ok with that..
 
I don't believe the story that the man didn't know his BMW was modified, but the rest is interesting as it puts the onus on the insurer to prove they have reasonable grounds to refuse a claim due to the risk significantly increasing due to the modification.

I was a bit peeved when I changed my standard alloys for some different Mercedes alloys of the same size and fitment to be told I had to pay extra premium.
I can't see how that significantly affects the risk to the insurer.

When I had the jag XJ6 I said that it had bigger alloys added, it did not alter the premium so long as they were within 2" of the orginals.
 
It's a grey area for most. Some insurers ask for modifications to the standard car including factory fit options. How are people expected to know this, you would have to be a complete geek to know the standard spec of a 10 year old car.
Plenty of those around here. :D But even they would struggle to to determine what was a factory fit option from new or added as a modification later. Especially as this months option could be next months standard fit (on the facelift 202 lots of things became standard in 98 - but at two different points in the year as far as I remember).
 
I don't think an insurer can walk away from a claim unless the modification makes the car illegal. If one applies the logic of insurance that one should pay a premium commensurate to the risk one brings to a common pool of risk then the most they can do is reduce their payout proportionate to the risk covered.

e.g. Car is valued at £20,000 - premium is £1000 p.a. BUT if the insurer knew of the risk they would have charged £1,100. Therefore if there is a claim for £5,000 of damage they would reduce the payout by 10% as you underpaid the premium.But if the insurer would not have covered the car if they knew of the risk they could well walk away from the claim.

Just an opinion not a fact.................... and I have no experience of this happening - but have applied logic from C.I.I. textbooks
 
I wonder how many of the young 'Barry's' out there actually tell there insurers, if indeed they are insured, every time they add a bit more plastic to the body kit, put another 44" subwoofer speaker in the boot, or squeeze a Rover V8 into the engine bay of their 1.1 Saxo??
 
Fortunately the body kit on my 230CE was fitted from new. Must ask about the alloys though as they are a great improvement on the ones fitted.
 
AFAIK if the stuff fitted to the car was available as OEM , then you don't need to worry about it ...

Halfords alloys ? - tell the insurer ...

AMG alloys ? - no need

Max Power body kit ? - tell the insurer ....

AMG skirts and valances ? - no need
 
Hey

Here is a thought...... How many of the people on here who have fitted MBClub Mod pedals have informed their insurance??

230K
 
AFAIK if the stuff fitted to the car was available as OEM , then you don't need to worry about it ...

Halfords alloys ? - tell the insurer ...

AMG alloys ? - no need

Max Power body kit ? - tell the insurer ....

AMG skirts and valances ? - no need

Technically you need to declare anything that wasn't on the car when it came out of the factory. That even includes:

window tints
chrome exhaust tips
etc.

The point is that even purely cosmetic mods may increase the risk of the car being vandalised or stolen. And/or the cost of repairing it if damaged.

http://www.carinsuranceexplained.com/car_insurance_explained/declaring_modifications.htm

http://www.gocompare.com/car-insurance/modified-cars.aspx

http://www.uswitch.com/news/carinsu...orm-car-insurance-firms-of-modifications.cmsx

etc.
 
AFAIK if the stuff fitted to the car was available as OEM , then you don't need to worry about it ...

Halfords alloys ? - tell the insurer ...

AMG alloys ? - no need

Max Power body kit ? - tell the insurer ....

AMG skirts and valances ? - no need

Not really true - I know of an instance whereby someone bought a new mini, but when he told them of having a chequered roof (factory fit) they increased his premium because the car now become more desirable and therefore liable to theft.

So in your example if they are standard AMG fit - because of model designation I think you are correct - but if they are selected off an options list it is best to have told your insurer (but no-one does :D )
 
I've told mine about my exhaust and side steps.

When I rang about the after maket HiD kit they still agreed these would be ok and I would have this in writing.

There would also be no increase in premium for these.


Alloys and dark windows I have not told them as that is was items on my car when bought new?
 
dark windows I have not told them as that is was items on my car when bought new?

windows in front of the B pillar.? I'm sure they would be interested in those, but not behind the pillar.
 
I have told my insurers of all of the changes to my car, not least so that, should the front end get wiped out, I get OEM xenons fitted and not the halogens as were originally fitted when it left the factory..
 
Hi,
After recently talking to the parts manager at my local MB dealer, apparently any OEM mod done to a Mercedes with genuine MB parts providing that the model was available with the option from new you can have your VIN number Data card updated to reflect the mod/option. How they verify this i don,t know as yet but i asked if the vehicle had to be subject to an inspection but he said no
When my OEM zenons are fitted to the 43 i will update the VIN card negating the need to tell the insurance.
 

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