722.6 TC problems

[broncc]

A bit of a background first. I have a 2007 E280 CDI 4MATIC (hence the 722.6 and not 722.9) with 200k km (124k miles) on the odometer. Soon after I bought it from its second owner, I noticed that the first few shifts when the car had sat in the cold were very rough. After some reading I reached the conclusion that it was the torque converter clutch solenoid which seems to be a common failure on these. I replaced it in January together with the filter, gasket, harness connector and 4L of oil (Fuchs Titan ATF 4134) and the problem disappeared.

The past few months I have experienced the following problem - when the car shifts from 1st to 2nd (or 2nd to 3rd if in 'C' mode), just before the actual shift, I can see the RPM drop from ~1800 to ~1600, there is a slight jolt/jerk and then the RPM get back to 1800-2000 and the car shifts to the next gear. This happens most often when I apply light and constant throttle, e.g. when I set off from a light and there is traffic. This doesn't happen if I push the gas pedal hard. I've also experienced a few more violent jolts/jerks but maybe two or three times during my two years of ownership. I tried adding two bottles of Dr. Tranny Instant Shudder Fixx but there is no change. I also tried resetting the adaptations via Star to no avail. The fluid level is at the top range of the 80*C level when the car is at operating temperature.

The previous owner had replaced the transmission oil a few months before I purchased the car at around 180k km (112k miles). I asked the local MB dealership for all the invoices they have on my car for servicing (which was done there up until 100k km (62k miles)) and there is none on transmission fluid changes.

I am not completely sure I started experiencing this issue after the TCC solenoid replacement but even if it happened in the past, it was less noticeable. Do you think the previous owner might have noticed this and added some additive when he replaced the transmission oil to mask it so when I drained the oil and put new one in, the problem become apparent again?

At any rate, I need to figure out what to do now. I disabled the TCC solenoid using Star and the problem wasn't there so it is definitely the torque converter that is causing it. Could it be that the new solenoid I put in is faulty? I don't feel like spending 600-700 euro for a reconditioned TC if it's just a 50 euro solenoid that's defective. I find it hard to believe that the TC has gone at only 200k km.

The worst part is that had I decided to sell the car when the weather gets better but now it has this problem and I am not the type of person to try and sell a car with a major fault..

Any tips and ideas would be welcome.

 

[Joesoap17]

It could be the conductor plate?
I had similar problems but it came up as speed sensor and solenoid, replaced the conductor plate, connector and 6L of ATF and it is running good now.

 

[broncc]

No error codes unfortunately..

 

[Smart320]

From the symptoms I would also suggest conductor plate even if no codes !

 

[Joesoap17]

Conductor plate is around £100 (try Onestopgearbox shop) can be fitted in an hour if you have access to a lift, at that price it has to be worth a shot?

 

[broncc]

Why do you think it could be the conductor plate? It sounds like a classic case of slippage due to failing TC, no?

 

[Joesoap17]

The solenoids are controlled by the conductor plate.

 

[broncc]

I made two videos

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

- here you can see the rpm drop slightly from ~1500rpm and the car jolts slightly, in a few seconds the car upshifted

To view this content we will need your consent to set third party cookies.
For more detailed information, see our cookies page.

Accept third party cookies

- the same happens here but around ~1600rpm, again the car jolted and a bit after the clutch was applied the gearbox upshifted..

 

[Rov]

I have the same problem with my 2007 e200 kompressor.
I replaced the TC solenoid and fluid and it behaves the same.
The tc lock-up is felt mostly when very hot in stop and go traffic and very little gas pedal application( steady 15-20%). After the key on/off throttle reset or adaptation of the gearbox values it dissapears for a while.
If i drive it like it's stolen, alot of wot and redline shifting the gearbox applies the TC without this "steps"/jolts.
It feels like the tc is applied in steps rather than gradual pressure like 50% and 90% .
In 3rd and up it shifts perfectly.
If i start to accelerate and then release the gas pedal for a second the tc locks and I can go ahead and accelerate without the jolts or slips.
My adaptation values are negative so wears is non existant because the range is 0-180 plus the tc adaptation shows it keeps the tc locked at speed within 30-50 rpm and the max adaptation value is 150 rpm.
The gearbox has 160000km right now, drives without vibrations, noises or such.
What is the solution? Why is this happening?
I am desperate to find the solution to this because otherwise it's flawless and smooth.

 

[Rov]

FIXED!
UPDATE

Aftet 4 years of ownership I managed to trackdown the problem.

In addition to trying egs53, countless adaptations, oils, installed atf cooler from v8 engines and even a torque converter swapt I finally found the solution to my problem.

When I was blowing compressed to clean the debris between the ac radiator and coolant radiator I had a thought from nowhere that maybe I should check the front abs sensors.
It was in the back of my mind since I once felt the abs triggering at very low speed for a fraction of a second.
Also, when esp was off, the shifting was better.

I found grease on the sensors and lots of dirt, cleaned with a rag and inserted a flat screwdriver wraped in clotch inside the sensor hole to try and clean the abs ring.
I rotated the wheel with little tension exerted on the scredriver and cleand it as much as I could.
Put the sensor back, lowered the lift and when I left the garage I couldn't belive it, the gearbox shifted flawlessly.

Today I removed the hubs to clean or replace the abs rings pand I found:
1. The disc cover was corred badly, one screw was not clamping due to corrosion (aluminium) the car being 15 years old, 12 of them were in Germany, Bavaria, with high moisture and such.
This lead to the cover shifting it's position and the inner conver near the abs sensor touched the abs ring and rubbing material off it.
2. Grease was thrown out and combined with dirt and brake dust it made like 1mm thick layer of hardend grease on the inner edge of the cover .

I removed and replaced the abs rings and cleaned the sensors with a rag.
While the ring was off I cleaned the grease that was inside and hub and bearing and placed aprox 70g of new grease inside the hub and on the bearings. ( Febi, green, oe mb).
I installed the rings flush with the hub just like the oe ones using a flat piece of wood and a hammer. The did not need hard tapping to sit flush
I purchased Metzger rings, only ones available at a local warehouse. They looked exactly like OE ones.
Next I installed the hubs, set the play to 0.01-0.02 mm using a dial gauge with a magnetic base.
All is perfect now, the converter is locking-up gently when pulling away from a stop and it upshifts higher than before.
The gearbox responds natural to accel pedal giving upshifts and downshifts at exactly the right moment
Also, now, it will keep 3rd gear in 1200 rpm locked of accel is pressed gently.

So, to end the post, it looks like the Esp has a massive influence regarding the gearbox shifting and locking of the TC.
Remeber that I had no errors on Abs esp engine or gearbox. All seemed perfect.

Thank you guys for all the help, I hope this will help others with similar problems.

P.S: the rear abs rings were replaced two years ago during some maintenance service. The original ones were badly corroded and broke off easily, still they did not throw errors.

 

[Fsalgues]

FIXED!
UPDATE

Aftet 4 years of ownership I managed to trackdown the problem.

In addition to trying egs53, countless adaptations, oils, installed atf cooler from v8 engines and even a torque converter swapt I finally found the solution to my problem.

When I was blowing compressed to clean the debris between the ac radiator and coolant radiator I had a thought from nowhere that maybe I should check the front abs sensors.
It was in the back of my mind since I once felt the abs triggering at very low speed for a fraction of a second.
Also, when esp was off, the shifting was better.

I found grease on the sensors and lots of dirt, cleaned with a rag and inserted a flat screwdriver wraped in clotch inside the sensor hole to try and clean the abs ring.
I rotated the wheel with little tension exerted on the scredriver and cleand it as much as I could.
Put the sensor back, lowered the lift and when I left the garage I couldn't belive it, the gearbox shifted flawlessly.

Today I removed the hubs to clean or replace the abs rings pand I found:
1. The disc cover was corred badly, one screw was not clamping due to corrosion (aluminium) the car being 15 years old, 12 of them were in Germany, Bavaria, with high moisture and such.
This lead to the cover shifting it's position and the inner conver near the abs sensor touched the abs ring and rubbing material off it.
2. Grease was thrown out and combined with dirt and brake dust it made like 1mm thick layer of hardend grease on the inner edge of the cover .

I removed and replaced the abs rings and cleaned the sensors with a rag.
While the ring was off I cleaned the grease that was inside and hub and bearing and placed aprox 70g of new grease inside the hub and on the bearings. ( Febi, green, oe mb).
I installed the rings flush with the hub just like the oe ones using a flat piece of wood and a hammer. The did not need hard tapping to sit flush
I purchased Metzger rings, only ones available at a local warehouse. They looked exactly like OE ones.
Next I installed the hubs, set the play to 0.01-0.02 mm using a dial gauge with a magnetic base.
All is perfect now, the converter is locking-up gently when pulling away from a stop and it upshifts higher than before.
The gearbox responds natural to accel pedal giving upshifts and downshifts at exactly the right moment
Also, now, it will keep 3rd gear in 1200 rpm locked of accel is pressed gently.

So, to end the post, it looks like the Esp has a massive influence regarding the gearbox shifting and locking of the TC.
Remeber that I had no errors on Abs esp engine or gearbox. All seemed perfect.

Thank you guys for all the help, I hope this will help others with similar problems.

P.S: the rear abs rings were replaced two years ago during some maintenance service. The original ones were badly corroded and broke off easily, still they did not throw errors.

Sr, my name is Federico Salgues, im writhing from Uruguay, South America, please excuse my English, I usually speak Spanish.

I wanna said something to you, THANK YOU, thank you, thank you.
I spent the last 3 year looking for a fail on my car, (w203 220 cdi), I rebuild the transmission, the torque converter, the fluid, and the turbo, intake flap manifold, and many many sensors, even the tcu unit and reflash the ecu too.
And one lucky day, I read your post, so I clean the ABS sensors, boom, my car runs great again, like never did. If was not because of you I will never consider the abs sensor could do that fail (the same fail you describe it). Again, thank you thank you

 

[Teo23]

Hello. I have the same problem described by you (c200 kompressor 2007).
The automatic box jerks at around 1500 rpm, especially when cold. I took it to the service where they reconditioned the TCC and changed the hydraulic block with a second-hand one, but the car still jerks.
When it warms up, it becomes very little noticeable, but when it's cold, you can feel the moment of lock-up. Today I will try to clean the both ABS front sensor .

 

[Teo23]

I clean the abs front sensor but its the same thing..

 

[Teo23]

“Broncc “ did you solve anything?