Just purchased - MOT Quandry

[CraigRoyK]

Hi all,

Here's the story so far:

Needing a new car for the wife, after considering a few different ML's and getting a feel for the major issues to watch out for, we went to look at an ML500 on Saturday.

The vehicle was advertised by a dealer (with premises, not a trader) as Taxed and Tested. On arrival, one of the first points made was that there had been a mistake, the MOT had expired, but they would put a new MOT on. Great!

We (Mrs K and I) inspected the vehicle as best one can in 30 minutes when considering a purchase. We could see any major issues. Some of the common niggles, the odd bit of damaged trim, all to be expected on an 86,000 mile 11 year old 3 owner vehicle.

We discussed the vehicle with the dealer, he said he knew of no major issues with the vehicle.

A deal was struck, deposit paid, and we were advised that he would only be able to get the MOT sorted on Monday as the station he uses "across the road" was not open on weekends. We agreed to collect either Monday evening or Tuesday.

On calling the dealer on Monday he said it wasn't ready yet, As it had needed to go to a different MOT station further away due to no availability locally. On Tuesday he confirmed that it was ready and we could collect.

On collection we were given all the documentation, including tax disc (which we laid for) and new MOT (which I just accepted but didn't look at - there was a tax disc after all ).

So now to the issue.

When I got home last night I was going through all the paperwork again and checking what we had and didn't. I noticed that we all but 1 of the MOTs, but I then realised that this new MOT was issued on Saturday (at 18:10). RED FLAG. Why would he have lied. (Also, the test was conducted 12.5 miles away - in Outer London - there must be numerous MOT stations nearby)

So I went online to check the MOT history.

Turns out the vehicle failed due to a bulb, then passed (pretty standard), however the following issues:

1. The mileage on the fail is incorrect, but then correct on the pass. This will surely flag on future HPI checks?
2. Advisory 1: Nail in front tyre
3. Advisory 2: oil leak

The dealer did not declare the advisories or give me the advisory sheet or fail (the MOT is only A5, having been torn in half - these new MOTs look so unofficial).

The fact that he didn't declare them makes me believe he hasn't fixed them either. So what do I do, feels like my options are:

1. Suck it up. S..t happens, I should have noticed it. (I don't really believe this)
2. Take the vehicle straight back for a refund (I don't know that I legally have this recourse, this is possibly an over-reaction)
3. Ask him to sort out the problem. (why should I trust him seeing as he hid it from me already?)
4. Get a quote from a reputable Indy (Olly @ PCS) and claim the repair bill from the dealer. (Again, I don't know if I legally have this recourse)

Any comments, suggestions, advice will be appreciated.

I do plan to call the MOT station this morning to discuss the oil leak (they should be able to point out where it is) and whether they can correct the mileage issue.

Thanks,
Craig

 

[trapperjohn]

Car sales people don't you just love em.

In this order for me.

First Number 3. Then check he has done what he says he has done. Give him a chance to sort it all. Back that up with trading standards if need be.
If you like the car Number 2 should be a non starter.
You can try number four in conjunction with Number 3. As a plan of action and see if he goes for it.
Number 1 is easy peasy but may not leave you feeling happy. Sort the puncture get Olly to fix the oil leak (always some expense with a second hand motor)

5. Get it MoT'd again at a VoSA testing station (I think the local council run them) See what the result is and start with 1 - 4 all over again.

 

[219]

I'd be more concerned about the tyre with a nail in than the oil leak which many cars have and may be minor .

Have a good look at the tyre ( and the spare since it may have been swapped ) and mark the sidewall with chalk to note the position of this nail . If the nail is/was in the tread area , it may have been repaired since a 'plug' is an acceptable method of repairing this type of puncture at a cost of around £10 . If you can't see the nail , chances are it has been removed and the puncture fixed - whatever you do , don't pull the nail out if you spot it : the tyre will probably deflate . Either put on the spare , or take it either back to the dealer or to a tyre place to have it sorted .

I doubt you would get a new tyre out of it since a puncture can be safely repaired if the tyre has plenty of life left in it ; if the tyre has worn almost to the point of needing replacement then you might be as well just buying a couple of new tyres ?

As for the oil leak - why not go to the MOT station with the car and speak to the tester ? If only a few days since it was done , chances are he will remember the car and tell you where the leak is and how serious - he should have no axe to grind . If the car needs , say , a sump gasket leak , you at least know what is wrong and can keep an eye on it . Are there any signs of oil dripping from the vehicle ? If not , chances are it is a very minor leak and possibly no great concern .
You can certainly phone up the dealer pointing these issues out , and ask him to resolve them - just be sure what you expect him to do before you go in .

 

[Starky]

You do have rights If the car Is purchased from a dealer. You could point blank refuse the car, or you could explain the issues with the car to the dealer and get them fixed with him paying the bill but he may state that he wants his mechanic to do the work.

My father had similar experience with a E class he recently bought. He took the car to Olly who discovered about two thousand pounds of work was needed. As a member of which magazine he was intitled to some legal advice which he did use as they explained his consumer rights.

Under a certain part of the consumer rights he refused the car and got his money back. But on a car the 8,9,10 years old you must espect there to be some minor problems. I hope that helps.

Ben.

 

[dokalj]

Similar scenario when I bought the ML. No advisory sheet given and I only realised after purchase when about 300 miles from the dealer.

I know you can speak to VOSA if you believe your car was passed when it shouldn't have. I do not believe it is uncommon for some used dealers to get a vehicle passed quickly prior to a sale.

I am not sure what your dealings are with this dealer, however would you want them working on the vehicle knowing their track record thus far?

No harm in asking I suppose.

Nip it in the bud and get your car to a reputable Indie, such as Olly or the others on the forum.

 

[CraigRoyK]

Thanks all for the feedback.

So far is correlates with thoughts/direct comments I have had from friends.

Additional information so far:

1. I've called the testing station, waiting to hear back from the actual tester to see how serious the leak is.
2. On the tyre front, I'll simply either repair myself or replace, it's one of the hazards of owning a vehicle
3. I spoke to the dealer & the owner of the MOT station, they both say the "oil leak" is likely just some oil on the bottom of the vehicle, not an actual dripping leak. I will check the drive tonight after the car has been parked there for a day.
4. I have already contact Olly for his advice, my next step is to get the vehicle down there for a health check
5. As others have said, this is a second hand (old) car, so I expect some work. I have actually budgeted for some work (I always do when I buy a second hand car), so if all the things Olly finds come in within my budget then I'll park the whole discussion.

Frankly, if the oil leak is only some oil on the bottom then I wouldn't really care. What is annoying/concerning me is that it appears to have been hidden from me.

Craig

 

[DSM10000]

Hi all,

The dealer did not declare the advisories or give me the advisory sheet or fail (the MOT is only A5, having been torn in half - these new MOTs look so unofficial).

The MOT is not A5, it is A4 and all the advisories are printed on the right hand side, if he tore it in half before giving it to you then he was clearly trying to stop you seeing the advisory comments.As for not declaring the fail, well it was a builb and of no consequence.

Overall the faults seem minor, car dealers twist the facts to suit themselves as indeed do many other businesses, caveat emptor as always!

 

[A-AvantGarde]

The MOT is not A5, it is A4 and all the advisories are printed on the right hand side, if he tore it in half before giving it to you then he was clearly trying to stop you seeing the advisory comments.As for not declaring the fail, well it was a builb and of no consequence.

Overall the faults seem minor, car dealers twist the facts to suit themselves as indeed do many other businesses, caveat emptor as always!

That's the point I think is odd, it shouldn't have been torn / cut down to A5 hiding the advisories.

Not knowing how local they dealer is, i'd suggest asking them for a replacement MOT certificate as the one they've supplied isn't complete and should be A4 in size. That was obviously an alarm bell to you - quite clearly you can only assumt that they were trying to hide something.

You could also mention that because of being supplied with just half the MOT you checked it online and saw the advisories at the same time. Sounds like they tried to get another MOT from a different station to see if it came back with less advisories?

However, what youv'e described doesn't sound too bad (although it's not ideal). Out of interest, how far out is the mileage?

 

[A-AvantGarde]

That's the point I think is odd, it shouldn't have been torn / cut down to A5 hiding the advisories.

Not knowing how local they dealer is, i'd suggest asking them for a replacement MOT certificate as the one they've supplied isn't complete and should be A4 in size. That was obviously an alarm bell to you - quite clearly you can only assumt that they were trying to hide something.

You could also mention that because of being supplied with just half the MOT you checked it online and saw the advisories at the same time. Sounds like they tried to get another MOT from a different station to see if it came back with less advisories?

However, what youv'e described doesn't sound too bad (although it's not ideal). Out of interest, how far out is the mileage?

***EDIT***

Just thought - it's quite a poor design the new MOT Certificate, could the fact that it's been torn in half alter it's validty?

 

[jaymanek]

To be honest I cant see the big issue...

the mileage is correct on the main re test which is what matters. The nail in tyre is probably a nail in the tyre, so can probably be fixed for £7.50 and oil leak is just something MOT testers put down to cover their backs as they cannot see past the under tray.

The only potential thing is the nail in tyre and it all depends where it is on tyre.

 

[CraigRoyK]

***EDIT***

Just thought - it's quite a poor design the new MOT Certificate, could the fact that it's been torn in half alter it's validty?

Shouldn't do as it is online and it is the Vosa record which counts. Not the piece of paper which is basically a receipt.

 

[CraigRoyK]

However, what youv'e described doesn't sound too bad (although it's not ideal). Out of interest, how far out is the mileage?

Agreed.

On the failed test is shows 101k instead of 86k, so significant.

But I know it was 86k when I saw it before the test and the passed test is correct which is what really matters (as others have said).

 

[CraigRoyK]

To be honest I cant see the big issue...

the mileage is correct on the main re test which is what matters. The nail in tyre is probably a nail in the tyre, so can probably be fixed for £7.50 and oil leak is just something MOT testers put down to cover their backs as they cannot see past the under tray.

The only potential thing is the nail in tyre and it all depends where it is on tyre.

The above are essentially the conclusions I am drawing subject to Olly inspecting the vehicle.

 

[dokalj]

Any pictures of your new acquisition?

 

[SilverSaloon]

i wouldnt worry about any of that (but check out the nail yourself). put some cardboard under the car overnigth and see how bad the leak is. it may be nothing, advisaries are just that and can change year to year without anything ever being addressed

 

[This is Pete]

i wouldnt worry about any of that (but check out the nail yourself). put some cardboard under the car overnigth and see how bad the leak is. it may be nothing, advisaries are just that and can change year to year without anything ever being addressed

Yes, but you'd expect a reputable dealer to address and deal with advisories before re-testing and giving you a clean bill of health (from an MOT perspective at any rate).

The chief lesson here (to my mind) is to check through the paperwork before signing. When going through the paperwork in front of the Porsche salesman, I noticed there was an advisory notice against the MOT. When questioned about it, the guy pointed out the second MOT sheet that was entirely clear.

 

[voy2age]

you can go on line these days and look at its mot history, just take the reg and the mot number, always worth asking the dealer for the info, i had an mot yesterday and by the time i got home (15 mins later) it was on line

 

[Sp!ke]

It sounds like someone wanted use of the your car for the weekend hence the MOT delay excuse.

Like other have said, as long as the nail has been removed and if necessary a proper repair done to the car then I wouldnt worry about the other MOT advisories or mileage discrepancies.

No harm in choosing favoured test station rather than the nearest - we all do it.

 

[CraigRoyK]

Any pictures of your new acquisition?

I will it's some after the weekend. No time in the week I'm afraid...

 

[dokalj]

I will it's some after the weekend. No time in the week I'm afraid...

Fair enough, make sure you get some decent protection on the paintwork as some point.