Anyone with experience of Ubiquiti kit?

[st13phil]

I’m considering buying a Unifi Dream Machine (UDM) for home use and would welcome input from anyone with experience of Ubiquiti’s networking products.

First some background.

While my past career includes many years in IT, I was always involved in Application Programming, Systems Analysis / Design and Project Management but I was never involved in network infrastructure or config, so my knowledge is scant in those areas. I always used to wind up the guys who managed the network, saying that as far as I was concerned the network was like the drains and, just like how the drains didn’t concern me so long as when I flush the toilet everything disappears, I had no interest in how the network worked either. In hindsight, perhaps that was a missed opportunity…

Our home broadband is BT’s FTTC VDSL service and I’ve been happily using a Netgear D7000 modem/router for the last 5 years, but last year it started to exhibit behaviour suggesting it’s on its way out including occasional lock-ups that required it to be power-cycled so I researched replacements and settled on a FritzBox 7590. This has proven to be something of a disappointment as it has been incapable of maintaining a stable connection on my DSL line. Having worked with AVM Support and not managed to reach a resolution, I’ve temporarily reverted to the D7000 which has maintained a rock-solid DSL connection so that’s either a massive coincidence or points the finger of blame firmly at the FritzBox. So… I’m now looking for a stable, reliable, replacement – again.

One of the reasons I’d settled on the FritzBox was that it was expandable as part of a unified WiFi Mesh solution. While up until now that hasn’t been that critical as WiFi performance from the D7000 has been adequate around most of our 3-bed house, we’re building a garden house in the spring and WiFi performance where it will be is marginal. I know I could use a powerline solution to get WiFi in the garden house, but would prefer Mesh as it’s a more reliable / more scalable / more elegant solution.

We don’t have IoT devices around the house at the moment, but probably will in the future, so the ability to have separate VLAN’s is attractive from a future-proofing / security point of view. The FritzBox doesn’t support VLAN’s and, in hindsight, that was probably a mistake on my part. Our current modem/router is located in an upstairs office room where the incoming BT line terminates, and that is where any future device will be located. Adding cabled connections to the router (or switch) for remote wireless access points is not an option, so any remote AP’s need to be on a wireless uplink.

The UDM is attractive as it seems to tick most of the boxes, and I would intend to pair it with a DrayTek Vigor 130 bridge modem to connect to the BT line. It’s easily expandable with both indoor and outdoor access points and supports multiple VLAN’s, but is it overkill?

Ultimately, I want a solution that’s rock-solid, gives strong Wi-Fi performance and – as far as is reasonable – is future proof.

Any and all thoughts and advice welcomed.

 

[markjay]

We sell Ubiquti kit, it's what we call 'pro-sumer' (professional consumer), and it's considered either a high-end home kit or an entry-level business kit.

Their hardware warranties and support are not up-to-scratch for critical business use, but perfectly adequate for guest WiFi (or home WiFi).

That said, I only have personal experience with their WiFi and CCTV systems (which are both great for the price).

And, if looking at an integrated smart home setup, then Google Next is a serious contender (though of no interest to us, as we don't generally do home setups).

But I would definitely recommend Ubiquti as a brand.

 

[markjay]

As for using VLANs (or physical subnets) in home environment, I wouldn't recommend it, it's best to keep a single flat large LAN (which is something we would never do in a business network setting).

The reason is that a lot of the home IT kit - printers, Apple MacOS, SONOS, IoT, etc - use simple LAN discovery protocols such as bonjour that scan the immediate LAN but won't go beyond the default gateway, to create a simple PnP setup for home users.

What can happen if you have two devices on two separate subnets, is that they either can't see each other at all, or you'll need to manually configure target static IPs which is a nightmare to manage.

There are obvious downsides to using a single flat LAN for all devices, mainly bandwidth optimisation but also management, security, resilience, etc, but unfortunately the PnP home IT kit simply works against it, so overall using a flat LAN at home is your best bet.

 

[markjay]

With regards multiple APs... mesh has massive overhead (professional mesh systems will have two separate radios, one dedicated to meshing the other to client connections). Ethernet over Power (aka Home Plug) has bandwidth limitations and can often be unstable. In short there's no real substitute to running proper Cat-5e/Cat-6a cables between the APs and the Switch. But if you have to use mesh or EoP, then so be it - not ideal, though.

 

[AltonAnt]

You can use a mix of both wired and Ubiquiti's version of mesh to extend into outlying areas.
Your router also doesn't need to be anywhere near the modem as it is connected via ethernet.
I do like the look of the Dreambox but it is too expensive for the benefits it would offer me.
I've not checked but do you still need to run an instance of the Unifi software or does it also manage that part too?

 

[markjay]

Looking at the spec, the Dreambox has a built-in 'cable router', I.e. the WAN port is RJ45 Ethernet meaning it does not have a built-in vDSL modem. So an external vDSL modem will still be required (The old BT FTTC installations did indeed come with a separate vDSL modem, but in the past 5 years or so the vDSL modem has been incorporated into the BT Hub router).

You should ask BT Openreach if they are planning on rolling-out FTTP in your area any time soon. And you can also check with the following providers:

Virgin Media - do they have Cable in your area?

g.network - do they have Fibre in your area?

Hyperoptic - do they have any services at your location?

They all provide fast Internet alternatives to FTTC, but operate in different areas of the UK.

 

[vijilants]

If you want strong Wifi performace across your house and generally good LAN performance would recommend getting a decent router such as one of the Vigor or Mikrotik range, and couple it using POE to a centrally located access point such as a Rukus Zoneflex R600.

These are way better than Ubiquiti units as they are enterprise devices and outperform Ubiquiti on the 2.4 and 5g band in a massive way, and are far easier to configure than the Ubiquiti.

As they are enterprise devices, they are very expensive if you buy them new but you can get them used for about £100.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Google Neat Wi-fi is fantastic. Rock solid, VLAN, and very very straightforward.

With Wi-fi I find it’s helpful if the router will do a Speedtest, to eliminate ambiguity caused when doing speed tests over Wi-fi. Google Nest Wi-fi does this too.

 

[Atavus]

I use UniFi access points and managed PoE switches plus their Cloud Key. The UDM will replace some of that. I feed a USG with WAN from a Draytek router plus a backup WAN via cable. I run a couple of separate wifi networks, but stop short of VLANs.

Have a look at Crosstalk Solutions on YouTube.

 

[mattk1]

My head hurts! I need to sit down.


KR Matt

 

[markjay]

If you want strong Wifi performace across your house and generally good LAN performance would recommend getting a decent router such as one of the Vigor or Mikrotik range, and couple it using POE to a centrally located access point such as a Rukus Zoneflex R600.

These are way better than Ubiquiti units as they are enterprise devices and outperform Ubiquiti on the 2.4 and 5g band in a massive way, and are far easier to configure than the Ubiquiti.

As they are enterprise devices, they are very expensive if you buy them new but you can get them used for about £100.

We do sell quite a lot of Ruckus kit, mostly R550/R650 but also some R750 (they are all WiFi6 devices), and the Unleashed edition works well for controller-less installations.

But as VAR we buy them by the dozen (for public WiFi installations), and get them very very cheap. Buying these devices retail online will be way over a home-user's budget.

 

[John]

We had a Zebra system fitted by a supplier in 2015 to replace a Ruckus (that could only do 2.4g). Absolute crock the Zebra was!

We used the structured cabling that was then fitted and replaced with Ubiquiti WAPs and Cloud key.

We've expanded that over the years to include manged switches, outside radio comms devices (forget what they are called), HD WAPs and an outside IP rated WAP.

The cloud key went up the swanny so replaced with a proper controller.

We also use their CCTV in one particular area too.

It's all very good, we found it easier to configure and fine tune the various settings on the fly (which we learnt about).

Apart from the cloud key, it's be excellent overall and the WiFi performance on 5g and 2.4g has been excellent.

 

[Doodle]

I have their kit at home, a couple of switches and 4 APs with several VLANs (home, work, IoT etc). I was unconvinced by the UDMs performance however, so since last summer I've been running a pfSense build, HP T730 thin client with Intel i350 card. It's been absolutely faultess and it barely breaks a sweat running a gigabit fibre connection with various packages etc (such as Avahi which handles the cross-VLAN services issues Mark mentioned earlier).

 

[Abb]

My head hurts! I need to sit down.


KR Matt

I thought it was just me until I came across your reply Matt!

 

[markjay]

I use UniFi access points and managed PoE switches plus their Cloud Key. The UDM will replace some of that. I feed a USG with WAN from a Draytek router plus a backup WAN via cable. I run a couple of separate wifi networks, but stop short of VLANs.

Have a look at Crosstalk Solutions on YouTube.

Why is the Cable your backup WAN? Does the Cable Internet not have better performance than the Internet via the Vigor (which presumably is vDSL/FTTC)? I.e. if you have Cable Internet, shouldn't it be your primary WAN connection, and the Vigor secondary?

 

[st13phil]

so since last summer I've been running a pfSense build, HP T730 thin client with Intel i350 card

And there was me thinking that a UDM may be a bit of overkill for my needs

 

[AltonAnt]

I have their kit at home, a couple of switches and 4 APs with several VLANs (home, work, IoT etc). I was unconvinced by the UDMs performance however, so since last summer I've been running a pfSense build, HP T730 thin client with Intel i350 card. It's been absolutely faultess and it barely breaks a sweat running a gigabit fibre connection with various packages etc (such as Avahi which handles the cross-VLAN services issues Mark mentioned earlier).

The main benefit of using a UDM or SGW pro is that everything would be managed in the Unifi software.

 

[markjay]

The main benefit of using a UDM or SGW pro is that everything would be managed in the Unifi software.

(Though it's worth noting the UniFi Protect - Ubiquiti's CCTV system - is managed by its own separate software).

 

[st13phil]

I do like the look of the Dreambox but it is too expensive for the benefits it would offer me.

That was pretty much the position I was in, but after the performance / reliability lottery I've experienced with the more run-of-the-mill consumer kit, I spent the money anyway and last Wednesday installed a Unifi Dream Machine hooked up to my BT FTTC line via a Draytek Vigor 130 in bridge mode (i.e. its "out the box" setup).

I've not checked but do you still need to run an instance of the Unifi software or does it also manage that part too?

It runs an instance of the Unifi Controller, so no need to run that elsewhere.

The initial setup took me a while due to the combination of evolving UDM firmware releases offering different features which render some of the guides on t'interweb misleading or incorrect, but now its done stability and performance has thus far been very good. I took the advice on this thread and kept the setup simple at this stage - no separate VLAN's - and will only delve into that if I have a real need in the future. Wi-Fi coverage around the house equals or betters any of the combined modem/routers I've used in the past, and it looks easy enough to add further AP's if needed.

The only irritation thus far is that one of our devices (Angie's iPhone 8+) repeatedly disconnects and reconnects to the wireless LAN when the phone is locked, thus filling the UDM's Event Log with cr*p. My iPhone 12 Pro and our iPads don't exhibit the same issue and reading the Ubiquiti support forums this seems to be a random, but not uncommon, irritation with some iPhones. I've tried the usual "Reset Network Settings" on the phone and some of the other UDM setting changes that others have thought to work, all no no avail.

Other than that minor irritation, all seems good so far - but this post will probably jinx that!

 

[Gbrowncls55]

Oh dear oh dear i've aged three years reading this and I think my head hurts.. I cant comment on most of it as i dont know what you are talking about however, I thought I would say that a month ago i fitted a "router and two satelites" Netgear Orbi mesh system in our quite big house as we could not reach it all from the BT wifi router and bouncers kept confusing eachother and lost a lot of speed and reliability.
The netgear Orbi system works brilliantly, is rock solid as you say, and we now have about 60% of the wired speed on wifi throughout the whole house (wired speed is 74 mbps). Devices move seemlessly from one satelite to another as you move about and it can be all controlled via the Netgear Orbi app, if you like that sort of thing.
Its obviously very easy to set up as I did it, and as you can tell, my expertise in this area is between minimal and non existant