Another depressing day for "Classics" at Historics this weekend

[BTB 500]

My memory is that they’d struggle with modern ABS braking, fuel injection, acceleration, and extended 70mph driving.

Capable of 70+ on motorways for sure, just not confident how comfy or reliable they be for a longer trip.

As I said nobody would buy one to use on long motorway trips now (or long trips of any sort, probably). My point was just that they would be perfectly driveable in normal modern traffic, unlike (say) many inter-war cars. Or arguably some modern vehicles

Slowest cars on sale now | Auto Express

Sometimes it’s good to sit back and enjoy the journey, and the cars on our list of the slowest-accelerating new models give you plenty of time for that.

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[BTB 500]

Traffic speeds in terms of a metric such as ‘average speed’ might not have, but old 1970s ‘performance’ cars would be left behind at the traffic light GP by pretty average daily drivers these days. I think even quite a few hatchback EVs would show how much technology has moved on from those days!

For sure performance expectations have moved on over the years. As per the link I posted above though it seems not all current manufacturers got that particular memo

 

[Scott_F]

Lot 232 - 1973 Daimler Double Six by Vanden Plas

Lot 232 - 1973 Daimler Double Six by Vanden Plas

www.historics.co.uk

Well that didn't take long....

Pardon our interruption...

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Lot 232 - 1973 Daimler Double Six by Vanden Plas

Lot 232 - 1973 Daimler Double Six by Vanden Plas

www.historics.co.uk

Well that didn't take long....

Pardon our interruption...

Love it; auctioned on the 20th, listed on Ebay on the 22nd. Such a shame he has had to sell it because of an unexpected knee op.

1600 views in 24 hours, with 78 watchers as at midday Thursday.

Call me "old fashioned" but aren't those tyres "supposed" to have date stamps on them? How old do they have to be to NOT have the four digit date stamps? Last century?

If anyone's tempted, they were horrendously difficult to keep running when new. The Directors of my company had them, and loved them, but they were constantly being fixed at less than one year old. Suits only a enthusiast fettler.

Heavy cars, these V12's. 1.8 tonnes ! Gosh. Same weight as a Tesla model 3

 

[Scott_F]

Love it; auctioned on the 20th, listed on Ebay on the 22nd. Such a shame he has had to sell it because of an unexpected knee op.

1600 views in 24 hours !!!

Call me "old fashioned" but aren't those tyres "supposed" to have date stamps on them? How old do they have to be to NOT have date stamps? Last century?

View attachment 176134

View attachment 176135

A "private seller" currently listing three cars, a motorbike and a caravan......

 

[Will]

For sure performance expectations have moved on over the years. As per the link I posted above though it seems not all current manufacturers got that particular memo

And how would that list have looked comparing the same on sale from the 1970s?

 

[Scott_F]

That Ezzy even made the Daily Telegraph.....

MSN

 

[BTB 500]

And how would that list have looked comparing the same on sale from the 1970s?

Funnily enough, from a quick Google a 1968 Escort 1100 did 0-60 in 19.1 - not dissimilar to some on today's 'slow list'. Old 'family cars' were OK in normal traffic, being (typically) low-geared and half the weight of their modern counterparts. But they ran out of puff at higher speeds, where drag and only 4 forward gears were limiting factors. I had a 1974 Fiat with 23 bhp and a mighty 39 Nm of torque. That was light and low-geared and really quite brisk away from the lights and in traffic up to about 40 mph. But the official top speed was (IIRC) 65 mph, so the 0-60 time was "unimpressive" at something over 40 secs

 

[Will]

Funnily enough, from a quick Google a 1968 Escort 1100 did 0-60 in 19.1 - not dissimilar to some on today's 'slow list'. Old 'family cars' were OK in normal traffic, being (typically) low-geared and half the weight of their modern counterparts. But they ran out of puff at higher speeds, where drag and only 4 forward gears were limiting factors. I had a 1974 Fiat with 23 bhp and a mighty 39 Nm of torque. That was light and low-geared and really quite brisk away from the lights and in traffic up to about 40 mph. But the official top speed was (IIRC) 65 mph, so the 0-60 time was "unimpressive" at something over 40 secs

Yes but the list you quoted was specifically the slowest cars on sale today, not a list of the performance of average cars on sale today

Something like a regular Ford of today would be a basic Puma 999cc which would probably do 0-60 and back from 60-0 before the Escort 1100 had got out of second gear

I should think in the 1960s/1970s the Escort wasn’t considered a particularly slow car relative to what was on sale at the time.

 

[Londonscottish]

A mk1 escort with a 2 litre Mountune Duratec and Quaife sequential 6 speed box would be marvellous.

And an entirely new suspension set up and new brakes.

This is why I got in to Alfa in the 80's. They came out the factory with all the right oily bits. OK, sometimes the dampers were a bit iffy. But that's the only thing I ever upgraded.

I knew people who were forever lying on their backs in freezing garages endlessly modding British cars. I went through one cycle of that and then realised I didn't want to be in a garage - I wanted to be blasting through Glencoe on my way to Skye.

 

[BTB 500]

Yes but the list you quoted was specifically the slowest cars on sale today, not a list of the performance of average cars on sale today

Something like a regular Ford of today would be a basic Puma 999cc which would probably do 0-60 and back from 60-0 before the Escort 1100 had got out of second gear

I should think in the 1960s/1970s the Escort wasn’t considered a particularly slow car relative to what was on sale at the time.

My point was only that an 'ordinary' 1970s car in good condition (like the Mk 1 Escort shown) would actually be OK to drive now (although not ideal for long motorway trips). I've not seen any of the 2025 cars on that list being described as unsuitable for modern traffic, despite having similar performance.

 

[Darrell]

The mk 1 Golf was the same. Brake servo on the wrong side of the car. If you want a good handling modern classic VW may is suggest you look at a VW Corrado. A great handling fwd car. Plus they have the same wing mirrors as a McLaren F1 and a pop up rear spoiler.

My first car was a mk1 Golf GTI.

 

[ChipChop]

My first car was a mk1 Golf GTI.

Nice! That must have been a few quid to insure.

 

[Darrell]

Nice! That must have been a few quid to insure.

It wasn’t silly iirc.

It was in 1990 and I would’ve been 23 at the time but I didn’t have any NCB. I was still living at home and earning good money.

I’d wanted one from when I was 17 or 18 and was over the moon with it but after only a few months of ownership I drove past a Ford dealer in Chalfont St Giles. …………

 

[Will]

My point was only that an 'ordinary' 1970s car in good condition (like the Mk 1 Escort shown) would actually be OK to drive now (although not ideal for long motorway trips). I've not seen any of the 2025 cars on that list being described as unsuitable for modern traffic, despite having similar performance.

But the list of cars you posted have obviously been noted as the *slowest* on sale today. Of course any vehicle is suitable to be used, but clearly they’re at the opposite end of the spectrum to what is considered normal performance wise today.

By comparison, it’s like comparing a 1960s/70s Ford Escort 1100 to something from the 1920s. And then you’d need to look up the slowest cars that were on sale in the 1970s (which again wouldn’t have been described as unsuitable either - just slow!) to compare to that Escort, which I don’t think would have been notably slow for it’s time?

 

[ChrisHGTV]

And an entirely new suspension set up and new brakes.

This is why I got in to Alfa in the 80's. They came out the factory with all the right oily bits. OK, sometimes the dampers were a bit iffy. But that's the only thing I ever upgraded.

I knew people who were forever lying on their backs in freezing garages endlessly modding British cars. I went through one cycle of that and then realised I didn't want to be in a garage - I wanted to be blasting through Glencoe on my way to Skye.

It’s very true, even with my GTV the consensus is leave the suspension bone stock. (Though I have polybushed the rear and have adjustable Koni yellows all round). I drove a really ratty Alfa 147 a short while ago and the steering precision was way better than our BMW 120 M Sport. Alfa do seem to get that bit right!

 

[ChrisHGTV]

It wasn’t silly iirc.

It was in 1990 and I would’ve been 23 at the time but I didn’t have any NCB. I was still living at home and earning good money.

I’d wanted one from when I was 17 or 18 and was over the moon with it but after only a few months of ownership I drove past a Ford dealer in Chalfont St Giles. …………

Isn’t that rhyming slang?!

 

[BTB 500]

But the list of cars you posted have obviously been noted as the *slowest* on sale today. Of course any vehicle is suitable to be used, but clearly they’re at the opposite end of the spectrum to what is considered normal performance wise today.

By comparison, it’s like comparing a 1960s/70s Ford Escort 1100 to something from the 1920s. And then you’d need to look up the slowest cars that were on sale in the 1970s (which again wouldn’t have been described as unsuitable either - just slow!) to compare to that Escort, which I don’t think would have been notably slow for it’s time?

I was simply replying to a post suggesting that 'ordinary' '70s cars wouldn't be OK in modern traffic. Nothing more.

 

[Will]

I was simply replying to a post suggesting that 'ordinary' '70s cars wouldn't be OK in modern traffic. Nothing more.

Just seemed strange that you’d researched a list of the slowest vehicles on sale to reason what modern traffic speeds were like - I don’t think that list is relevant or representative of that.

Average 0-60 times for modern traffic would be less than 10 seconds - half that of the Escort.

Okay for an occasional Sunday drive to a car show or something but you’d be getting overtaken dangerously on a daily basis otherwise I suspect!

And that’s assuming the 50+ year old car is performing 100% as it was when it was new

 

[Londonscottish]

It’s very true, even with my GTV the consensus is leave the suspension bone stock. (Though I have polybushed the rear and have adjustable Koni yellows all round). I drove a really ratty Alfa 147 a short while ago and the steering precision was way better than our BMW 120 M Sport. Alfa do seem to get that bit right!

It's in the engineers' DNA.

As is the tuning of the engine and exhaust notes. Ian Tyrrell nailed it when he said "An engine is basically a wind instrument". The Italians understand that concept like no other nation.

I love the sounds from the flat 4s I had. The Busso is, of course, sonically epic. I also love the TwinSpark - when it came out I was expecting another modern droning 4 pot. Oh no, they managed to squeeze all sorts of tunes from it. Fantastic soundtrack.