Buying a second hand 350e Wagon

[Jimbob202]

Hi all,

I'm thinking about buying a second hand C350e wagon, and would like some buying advice and feedback from owners.

Based on budget the car will be a 2017 around 70k-80K miles.

On average I'm driving 100 miles a week but I don't want to go for a suv or an underpowered estate having had lots of performance cars.

I've never owned a MB but having looked at the C class online and having a sit in one I've absolutely fell for it's looks, build quality and beautiful interior.

My concerns are the hybrid unit and when will the battery need replacing in the hybrid unit. What's overall reliability like?

Any input would be helpful.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

The C class is great, for the reasons you describe.

Why have you ruled out diesel and petrol?

Can you charge your car every time you return home? (And can you be bothered to ?)

For your 5,000 miles a year, how often are yo doing more than 50 miles a day?

 

[Jimbob202]

The C class is great, for the reasons you describe.

Why have you ruled out diesel and petrol?

Can you charge your car every time you return home? (And can you be bothered to ?)

For your 5,000 miles a year, how often are yo doing more than 50 miles a day?

I work from home so no commute but I take my kids to nursery 3 times a week, it's 14 mile round trip. No issue with plugging it in.

The car will do two 140mile trips a month and a couple of adventures out at the weekend. I've ruled out diesel because 90% of my trips are less than 15 miles

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I work from home so no commute but I take my kids to nursery 3 times a week, it's 14 mile round trip. No issue with plugging it in.

The car will do two 140mile trips a month and a couple of adventures out at the weekend. I've ruled out diesel because 90% of my trips are less than 15 miles

You are a perfect plug in hybrid customer….

I’ll let others weigh in on the hybrid experience and the potential savings and risks against spending £16 a week running a straight petrol.

(Do bear in mind the electricity cost as well as the petrol in running a hybrid. Most “forget.”)

 

[Jimbob202]

Tbh I didn't think I could afford a desirable hybrid. I'm not opposed but I'm worried that the hybrid battery will need replacing and I'll be left with a very hefty repair bill

 

[Smiley]

There is one shed load of added complexity in a hybrid car vs a conventional ice car. It is not just the battery, there is the charging system and all of the associated control systems to switch between EV mode and petrol. They are probably great at reducing emissions when you are in EV mode but as soon as you get onto the open road then you are lugging around the battery, motor and all the other hybrid stuff which has to be a drag on fuel consumption. My main concern would be the reliability of the whole system (not just the battery) and how well informed the dealer network is to fix the cars when they do go wrong. There have been a few members here who have had frustrating problems with difficult to diagnose hybrid faults.
And what is the real benefit of all this added complexity. Possibly slightly lower daily running costs - but the difference per mile for petrol vs electricity is not as big as it was.
Personally I would not touch a hybrid car - unless it was the only choice and then I would make sure it had a Toyota badge on it because they do at least seem to make them reliable.
BTW have you thought about two cars - it may sound bonkers but a diesel car for your longer journeys and a small cheap EV for the local journeys - a straight EV still has the battery of course but is simple compared to the ice or the hybrid.

 

[Jimbob202]

I currently have 3 cars. Leon cupra, mini Cooper s and mk1 golf cab.

The seat and mini will be sold for a 350E,S4 or.... Q5(wife's choice)

We don't do enough mileage to warrant a diesel, 5000 miles a year at the most and 90% short journeys.

Is like any electrical component on a car the battery gets the most hammer and normally needs replacing hence my reservation

 

[Smiley]

I was a sceptic wrt EVs. But it seems that the batteries degrade a lot more slowly than anyone would have thought. It is not the most unreliable part of an EV. There are some worse than others - early Nissan Leaf for example but they were very early designs with no cooling. The worst part about an EV is the charging network; if you only do local journeys they are worth looking at. Just have a diesel or a petrol car for the longer journeys.
But in your case with a total of 5,000 miles pa I would just buy a petrol car - just avoid the hybrid; it is just pointless complexity waiting to go wrong.

 

[Toml3]

I was a sceptic wrt EVs. But it seems that the batteries degrade a lot more slowly than anyone would have thought. It is not the most unreliable part of an EV. There are some worse than others - early Nissan Leaf for example but they were very early designs with no cooling. The worst part about an EV is the charging network; if you only do local journeys they are worth looking at. Just have a diesel or a petrol car for the longer journeys.
But in your case with a total of 5,000 miles pa I would just buy a petrol car - just avoid the hybrid; it is just pointless complexity waiting to go wrong.

I've been running a 2017 C350e and charging isn't an issue - the main advantage is regenerative braking, so the battery charges each time you use your brakes or coasting. So you get a saving even when you don't plug them in. In general, lithium batteries like to be used without long gaps with no usage. They should last over 10 years as long as their temperature is controlled well, Mercedes seem to have this in the design.

 

[Smiley]

I've been running a 2017 C350e and charging isn't an issue - the main advantage is regenerative braking, so the battery charges each time you use your brakes or coasting. So you get a saving even when you don't plug them in. In general, lithium batteries like to be used without long gaps with no usage. They should last over 10 years as long as their temperature is controlled well, Mercedes seem to have this in the design.

I would agree with you - there is a small benefit from regen and the battery is not the problem - apart from it is too small to have any meaningful value. The problem with a hybrid car is the added complexity of running two power trains and the control systems between the two. For the potential cost and inconvenience of the added complexity, the benefit to the owner is very marginal imo. I suspect that the only reason that manufacturers developed hybrid cars is because they perform disproportionately well in the test cycles which helps the manufacturer meet overall emissions targets.

 

[DITTRICH]

I solved this problem by simply buying a used C200SE petrol estate. I get 30mpg minimum, and 48mpg on a 50 mile round trip to my Mum's house with mixed driving. On long motorway trips at 60mph, I have seen 60mpg plus. No range anxiety, fill up for 600 miles in 10 minutes. No additional diesel or hybrid complexity. I drive in Eco mode almost all the time with the auto stop/start turned off. I bought the car at 154k miles, its now on 190k. The only non consumable item replaced was a NOx sensor at 180k. Discs and pads are still fine... I am careful with the brakes. My previous cars lasted 22 years and 24 years. Some sort of Euro 6 petrol run-around would be better for your short journeys. EVs are going to get road taxed anyway (probably quite alot as the 40k additional 5 years VED supplement demonstrates). My petrol tank is the same size as the day I bought it, and a new petrol tank is cheaper than new batteries.

 

[DITTRICH]

I would agree with you - there is a small benefit from regen and the battery is not the problem - apart from it is too small to have any meaningful value. The problem with a hybrid car is the added complexity of running two power trains and the control systems between the two. For the potential cost and inconvenience of the added complexity, the benefit to the owner is very marginal imo. I suspect that the only reason that manufacturers developed hybrid cars is because they perform disproportionately well in the test cycles which helps the manufacturer meet overall emissions targets.

And they realised that range/battery anxiety is a real issue.

 

[Smiley]

And they realised that range/battery anxiety is a real issue.

In that case the customer could buy a petrol or diesel.....the problem is that without the very low (distorted) emissions values of the hybrid the manufacturers could not hit their global emissions targets.
Hybrids are a huge farce in my opinion; the world is kidding itself if it thinks that running hybrids vs ICE is going to make any difference.

 

[ALFAitalia]

Yep.......and proven by the fact that sales of new hybrids will be just as banned as ICE cars after 2030....with the exception of the very greenest ones .....at the moment the proposal is that you will be able to sell them new if they have an electric only range of 50 miles plus.....that's not many cars at the moment

 

[BTB 500]

We went for a 2019 C300 petrol estate ... nice simple engine & drivetrain (well, by today's standards ) with no hybrid assist, decently quick (255 bhp, 0-60 in 5.5 secs) and reasonably economical (mid 30s mpg round and about, low/mid 40s on a run). Have had it just over 2 years and very happy with it. Worth a test drive, if you can find one.

 

[DITTRICH]

In that case the customer could buy a petrol or diesel.....the problem is that without the very low (distorted) emissions values of the hybrid the manufacturers could not hit their global emissions targets.
Hybrids are a huge farce in my opinion; the world is kidding itself if it thinks that running hybrids vs ICE is going to make any difference.

The EV/Hybrid MPG calculations are a joke. Electricity is regarded as 0g co2/mile.

 

[ALFAitalia]

Well if you are comparing it to petrol it is 0g per mile. Petrol carbon is worked out per mile as it's burnt in the car......it does not take into account all the carbon released in drilling, refining and transporting the fuel to the petrol station (which is far worse KW for KW that the production and distribution of electricity)....so yes if you want to compare like with like EV is 0g per mile. Include all the carbon created in production just makes the figures even worse for ICE cars when compared to EVs.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

The EV/Hybrid MPG calculations are a joke. Electricity is regarded as 0g co2/mile.

And most users “think” that electricity is £0.00 / mile, which it certainly isn’t, especially when charging away from home.

 

[ALFAitalia]

I know a guy with a Pug 208 EV.....since the electricity price rises he reckons that it's slightly MORE expensive to run than his old diesel one.......especially in the recent cold snap as the cold cripples the range.

 

[Jimbob202]

Sorry guys, I haven't been able to pull myself away from auto trader to reply.

To be clear, I'm not specifically look to buy a hybrid car. The 350e seems to tick all of the boxes. I'm concerned about reliability.

Funny thing is nearly every post and video I watch owners say they wouldn't buy another.