Oxfordian
Active Member
?
Engine starting issue - No glow plug lights, no engine cranking
- Thread starter Oxfordian
- Start date
- Joined
- Aug 14, 2016
- Messages
- 4,426
- Location
- leicestershire
- Car
- R230 SL500 in teal blue, R231 SL500 in black. (Vauxhall insignia diesel now sold) Black Ford Mondeo
I'm in Leicestershire with star, thought you may have been closer, that's all.
Oxfordian
Active Member
Only just saw this - I'll report back!
carsnstuff
Active Member
Under normal start conditions you should see the glow plug light before start right?
If so this seems like the exact issue I've been having and am currently stuck at a petrol station. it only ever seems to does it on warm start... leave it a while and then it just goes!! It's driving me bonkers
If so this seems like the exact issue I've been having and am currently stuck at a petrol station. it only ever seems to does it on warm start... leave it a while and then it just goes!! It's driving me bonkers
Oxfordian
Active Member
I feel your pain as well as the insecurity
I don't know the age of your car but mine is really old and my current focus is still on earthing issues as a result of corrosion. The most sensible advice that's been given here is to have a Star diagnosis as a starting point but I haven't got there yet.There's are threads about this issue on the Mercedesclub.org.uk site and on Benzworld.org (US Merc users site). The main things that I got from them was that a control module (IFI ?) controls the glow plugs and can inhibit the starter. The IFI fires up the pre-glow relay only after certain conditions are met (e.g. car in gear, etc). If these conditions are not met then the glow plugs are not energized and it won't allow a normal start. Second was an earthing issue, possibly with the main earth connections on the chassis (tallies with an earlier reply here).
I'll update this when I have a positive result, and am also interested in your own outcome!
grober
MB Master
Mercedes-Benz C-Class (W203) (2000-2007) Fuse Diagram • FuseCheck.com
Fuse box diagram (fuse layout), location, and assignment of fuses and relays Mercedes-Benz C-Class - C180, C200, C220, C230, C240, C270, C280, C320, C350, C30 AMG, C32 AMG, C55 AMG (W203) (2000-2007).
fusecheck.com
carsnstuff
Active Member
Cheers mate... 05 c200 125k
I might be wrong but the glowplug lights not comming on May not be relevant? As they are only needed below a certain temp?
The rac gut put a jumper across and made it turn over so it's not the starter
Here's the rac printout...
System Type: GEARBOX
Name: GEAR SELECTOR - GEAR SELECTOR (EWM203)
DTC: P2001,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
System Type: GEARBOX
Name: GEARBOX - GEARBOX (EGS52)
DTC: P2316,Fault in Can communication with control unit air conditioning
DTC: P2314,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
DTC: P2315,CAN: communication fault with IC (Instrument Cluster)
DTC: P2311,CAN communication with the engine system is faulty
DTC: P2312,CAN, communication with the engine system; fault or engine temperature is implausible
System Type: BRAKES
Name: ELECTRONIC STABILITY PROGRAM - ELECTRONIC STABILITY PROGRAM (ESPMK25)
DTC: C1352,Yaw rate and lateral acceleration sensor; overvoltage
DTC: C1210,+30 voltage, below lower threshold
DTC: C1029,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
DTC: C1035,Steering angle sensor; faulty signal
DTC: C1038,Engine control module; not identified/incorrect control module
DTC: C1022,CAN communication with the engine system is faulty
System Type: IMMOBILISER
Name: IMMOBILISER - EZS209
DTC: B1001,Voltage Supply too low
System Type: AIRBAG ELECTRONICS (SRS)
Name: AIRBAG - ARMADA
DTC: 9058,Restraint systems control module; coding is faulty
System Type: CENTRAL ELECTRONIC UNIT
Name: SIGNAL ACQUISITION AND CONTROL MODULE - FRONT - SAMV203
DTC: B1013,Right parking lamp; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1018,Left turn signal; short circuit or Open circuit.
DTC: B1009,Right low beam; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1036,Input signal; circuit 61
DTC: B1050,Terminal 30: undervoltage< 8 V
DTC: B1051,Terminal 30: undervoltage< 10,5 V
DTC: B1010,Left low beam; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1029,Control module AAC is not transmitting any data.If fault code occurs with no complaint
reported and no malfunctions, erase fault memory and perform a function check
DTC: B1025,Signal circuit 15
DTC: B1032,Input signal; circuit 15 R
System Type: CENTRAL ELECTRONIC UNIT
Name: SIGNAL ACQUISITION AND CON
That's an awful lot of faults with an awful lot of things which tends to point to battery even though its showing 12.5v.. but we tried jumping it and no game. Also it turned over with the realy bypassed.
Got itvrecovered to parkway and they said they will star it to see if its anything obvious but havnt got time to look at it after that for 2 weeks so will need to get it recovered somewhere else!!
I might be wrong but the glowplug lights not comming on May not be relevant? As they are only needed below a certain temp?
The rac gut put a jumper across and made it turn over so it's not the starter
Here's the rac printout...
System Type: GEARBOX
Name: GEAR SELECTOR - GEAR SELECTOR (EWM203)
DTC: P2001,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
System Type: GEARBOX
Name: GEARBOX - GEARBOX (EGS52)
DTC: P2316,Fault in Can communication with control unit air conditioning
DTC: P2314,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
DTC: P2315,CAN: communication fault with IC (Instrument Cluster)
DTC: P2311,CAN communication with the engine system is faulty
DTC: P2312,CAN, communication with the engine system; fault or engine temperature is implausible
System Type: BRAKES
Name: ELECTRONIC STABILITY PROGRAM - ELECTRONIC STABILITY PROGRAM (ESPMK25)
DTC: C1352,Yaw rate and lateral acceleration sensor; overvoltage
DTC: C1210,+30 voltage, below lower threshold
DTC: C1029,CAN; communication with control unit EIS is faulty
DTC: C1035,Steering angle sensor; faulty signal
DTC: C1038,Engine control module; not identified/incorrect control module
DTC: C1022,CAN communication with the engine system is faulty
System Type: IMMOBILISER
Name: IMMOBILISER - EZS209
DTC: B1001,Voltage Supply too low
System Type: AIRBAG ELECTRONICS (SRS)
Name: AIRBAG - ARMADA
DTC: 9058,Restraint systems control module; coding is faulty
System Type: CENTRAL ELECTRONIC UNIT
Name: SIGNAL ACQUISITION AND CONTROL MODULE - FRONT - SAMV203
DTC: B1013,Right parking lamp; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1018,Left turn signal; short circuit or Open circuit.
DTC: B1009,Right low beam; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1036,Input signal; circuit 61
DTC: B1050,Terminal 30: undervoltage< 8 V
DTC: B1051,Terminal 30: undervoltage< 10,5 V
DTC: B1010,Left low beam; short circuit or Open circuit
DTC: B1029,Control module AAC is not transmitting any data.If fault code occurs with no complaint
reported and no malfunctions, erase fault memory and perform a function check
DTC: B1025,Signal circuit 15
DTC: B1032,Input signal; circuit 15 R
System Type: CENTRAL ELECTRONIC UNIT
Name: SIGNAL ACQUISITION AND CON
That's an awful lot of faults with an awful lot of things which tends to point to battery even though its showing 12.5v.. but we tried jumping it and no game. Also it turned over with the realy bypassed.
Got itvrecovered to parkway and they said they will star it to see if its anything obvious but havnt got time to look at it after that for 2 weeks so will need to get it recovered somewhere else!!
carsnstuff
Active Member
got it recovered to BS3 formaly know as autospec who had a look and said theyd sorted it....
"strip & check 12v feed & signal to starter, found no signal feed, traced wiring bk to front fuse box and Sam unit.
Plug connector found water ingress. cleaned up connector & refit unit. Tested all ok.
3hrs labour plus vat £234
....drive it home fine, less than 2 hrs later, IT WONT ****ING START. bk to square one.
"strip & check 12v feed & signal to starter, found no signal feed, traced wiring bk to front fuse box and Sam unit.
Plug connector found water ingress. cleaned up connector & refit unit. Tested all ok.
3hrs labour plus vat £234
....drive it home fine, less than 2 hrs later, IT WONT ****ING START. bk to square one.
carsnstuff
Active Member
carsnstuff
Active Member
got it recovered to BS3 formaly know as autospec who had a look and said theyd sorted it....
"strip & check 12v feed & signal to starter, found no signal feed, traced wiring bk to front fuse box and Sam unit.
Plug connector found water ingress. cleaned up connector & refit unit. Tested all ok.
3hrs labour plus vat £234
....drive it home fine, less than 2 hrs later, IT WONT ****ING START. same problem. bk to square one.
"strip & check 12v feed & signal to starter, found no signal feed, traced wiring bk to front fuse box and Sam unit.
Plug connector found water ingress. cleaned up connector & refit unit. Tested all ok.
3hrs labour plus vat £234
....drive it home fine, less than 2 hrs later, IT WONT ****ING START. same problem. bk to square one.
Oxfordian
Active Member
Sorry to hear that the issue is still there.
My issue has not yet recurred though I think it will
especially after reading this old thread on another site:C220 Intermittent starting problems - No codes showing.
Could well be an ECU fault - when the fault is present, if you leave the ignition on does the cooling fan run fast?
forums.mercedesclub.org.uk
Not much to contribute until I have my Star diagnostic done!
carsnstuff
Active Member
also not being an expert but i would have thought if the SAM had got wet its mot likely ****** and should have been changed??
i wasnt given that option they just said its fixed come and get it... so slightly pissed off.
i wasnt given that option they just said its fixed come and get it... so slightly pissed off.
carsnstuff
Active Member
Right so I got it going with a jump but noticed it would only jump from alternator current circa 13v and only when I connected to the block and not the negative...
So I took the earth strap off that goes to the chassis from the neg (which looked fine) emmery clothed it up and hey presto ints been fine since!!!
So it seems it was the SAM and the earth.
So I took the earth strap off that goes to the chassis from the neg (which looked fine) emmery clothed it up and hey presto ints been fine since!!!
So it seems it was the SAM and the earth.
Oxfordian
Active Member
Fantastic!
Can't remember what model your vehicle is, but was it difficult getting to the earth strap? I need to have a look at my own main earthing strap but have no idea where it is.
Cheers!
carsnstuff
Active Member
w203 c200 cdi. so from the neg terminal on the battery their is only one lead comes off the battery and its about 15cm long and goes straight to the chassis
Oxfordian
Active Member
Tks
carsnstuff
Active Member
BREAKTHROUGH >>> after noticing water building up under the SAM I removed the drain in the wheel arch on the SAM side the and the problem is solved. Now 100 percent sure that's what it was!!
Would have though a specialist might have known it was this after telling me the sam had got wet?
Would have though a specialist might have known it was this after telling me the sam had got wet?
Oxfordian
Active Member
Brilliant! Hope that solves the problem.
carsnstuff
Active Member
well it didn't and after another year of ****ery and random no starts that were always temporarily cured by a jump from a running car (not a jump pack) i found this vid
looks like we are getting to the bottom of it and now at least i dont have to jump it.
looks like we are getting to the bottom of it and now at least i dont have to jump it.
Jigglyjohnson
Active Member
Hi
I'm pretty sure I've seen this issue before and I think I've said to check the relay in a previous post if the samnhas ANY signs of water ingress then it should be changed as water and electrics don't mix well and can cause some funny symptoms. Have you tried what was in the video when yours plays up
