New petrol and diesel car ban - death of first cars, classics etc?

[fabes]

Here's an interesting aspect of the 2030 petrol ban I hadn't considered....

Driving test update to preserve the manual gearbox | Auto Express

Essentially as all new (and learner cars) will be autos new drivers will not (never?) be able to drive a manual in under 10 years time.
What happens to the market for manual cars given most new drivers traditionally have 10 year plus old cars as first cars....?

Second tests needed?

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

As the article says, the world is moving towards automatic cars. Learners will be learning on automatics, the only legislative need now is to legally allow those who've passed on automatics to drive manuals.

How does someone who passed on an original MINI, drive an automatic with 500bhp ?

They just drive an automatic with 500bhp

 

[whitenemesis]

Going from manual to automatic is simpler than going manual from automatic.
Bit more thought required on engine speeds v road speed. Clutch control would need practise as would hill starts etc..
I don't think a retest is necessarily to way to go but definitely some sort or assessment, perhaps from a qualified instructor after he/she has taught how to do the above?

 

[BPD07]

Given the preponderance of newish small autos on the market now, these will become the first cars of the 2030/2031 pass generation. Feedback from the boss (whose been an ADI for 15 years) says a lot of the student drivers today just don’t see a car as freedom (like maybe we did), ludicrously high insurance, maintenance and fuel bills etc. At the moment most still seem to want learn on a manual but she’s getting a few requests for auto teaching.

 

[Gordwestyt4]

I dont see it being a problem I have been an examiner for 20 years .Lots of things have changed in that time we just have to change as cars get more advanced and things move on like electric handbrakes at first they were not allowed on test now they are .Its very easy to get a new car now think the days of most new drivers driving old bangers are gone .Its common for 17 year olds still at shool to turn up in brand new cars Audi,s Mini,s Fiat 500s brand new corsa,s fiesta,s so probably be very little demand for manuals once we go electric.I already know of some instructors thinking og going electric in the next few years as already plenty demand for Auto tuition . Hopfully I wont need to worry about it as plan to retire before 2030 all going well

 

[optimusprime]

There will allways be classic cars . It is a part of our history .

 

[BTB 500]

Its common for 17 year olds still at shool to turn up in brand new cars Audi,s Mini,s Fiat 500s brand new corsa,s fiesta,s

To take the test in, sure, but those aren't necessarily their own cars. Because of the cost of insurance it's quite normal to buy a 10-15 year old small car to get started with (the "first car" mentioned by the OP), and a sizeable majority of those are manuals.

 

[Gordwestyt4]

To take the test in, sure, but those aren't necessarily their own cars. Because of the cost of insurance it's quite normal to buy a 10-15 year old small car to get started with (the "first car" mentioned by the OP), and a sizeable majority of those are manuals

Totally agree but would surprise you how many tell you it’s their car. Changed days my first car was a £50 mini Clubman

 

[wagen]

A real shame. Can't beat a manual if you're from a certain era, just something special about selecting with a gearshift. Have a paddle shift now and am only just getting used to it. Sign of the times unfortunately. C'est la vie.

 

[wagen]

Its common for 17 year olds still at shool to turn up in brand new cars Audi,s Mini,s Fiat 500s brand new corsa,s fiesta,s.

Good lord, how times have changed.

 

[John N]

Totally agree but would surprise you how many tell you it’s their car. Changed days my first car was a £50 mini Clubman

£50 Mini Clubman You were Lucky!

 

[Benzowner]

Plenty of cars £200-250, 20 years old or so, It would then be possible that many current models when they reach that age will still be on the road.

 

[Stratman]

EU lawmakers vote to ban sales of combustion engine cars from 2035

The European Parliament this week voted to support what is effectively a ban on the sale of cars with combustion engines by 2035, and automakers are not happy.

MEPs backed a plenary vote on Wednesday for "zero-emission road mobility by 2035" – essentially meaning no more diesel and gasoline-fueled vehicles on the road.

The ambitious target means the automotive battery industry will have to service a much larger demand over the coming years, and electric carmakers stand to benefit hugely – that is, if they can source the requisite semiconductors and batteries.

 

[clk320x]

Auto boxes> Manual

It’s no surprise high performance cars all have autos now

 

[ToeKnee]

So is this a ban on any sale of a combustion engines vehicle after 2035, new and used, or just new vehicles?

 

[ALFAitalia]

Just new (scrapping several million perfectly good cars on the 1st Jan 2030 would not be very green now would it!!!!?).....and some very green hybrids will still be allowed to be sold brand new for a while (I've heard up until 2035 being mentioned with regards to this). Its only cars and vans....not "any vehicle"....... big commercials, can carry on being ICE until 2040 and as yet there is no proposed date to ban ICE motorcycles.........
Since I wont be driving much past 2050 (I'll be 83 then....hopefully) I should be able to drive ICE until I'm in my box.....I'm never going EV.....Id rather walk!!

 

[ToeKnee]

Thanks Alfa, I appreciate that in the UK but in post 13, it mentions no more sales in the EU. Plus I guess even if you can't sell the vehicle you could still drive it till it's end of natural life?

 

[ALFAitalia]

That's how I understand it.....not to mention the grid could not cope if we all went EV the same day......its will be a slow but accelerating uptake of EV until such time most of the old ICE cars have died of natural causes....probably 20 or 30 years beyond 2030 would be my guess.....as long as we can still afford fuel.....but it should be cheap as chips....supply and demand and all that....It wont be of course!!! If its still affordable to run an ICE car I can see ICE cars that have been looked after being very sought after by petrolheads like us in 20 so years time!!!

 

[ChipChop]

EU lawmakers vote to ban sales of combustion engine cars from 2035

The European Parliament this week voted to support what is effectively a ban on the sale of cars with combustion engines by 2035, and automakers are not happy.

MEPs backed a plenary vote on Wednesday for "zero-emission road mobility by 2035" – essentially meaning no more diesel and gasoline-fueled vehicles on the road.

The ambitious target means the automotive battery industry will have to service a much larger demand over the coming years, and electric carmakers stand to benefit hugely – that is, if they can source the requisite semiconductors and batteries.

I am not suprised car manufacturers are not happy with this. Particularly the German car industry. They have been 'lending' the EU cars for years. Greece way back in 2014 apparently were loaned 69 Audi's, probably not diesel hatchback either more likely Audi A8's.

Always thought the EU were well versed in 'you scratch my back i'll scratch yours' deals, more commonly known as bribery. Perhaps an EV manufacturer is offering more favourable 'lending' terms.

Ireland criticised over EU Presidency car fleet

Transparency campaigners have criticised Ireland and four other EU countries for using free Audi and BMW cars while negotiations were under way over strict new emissions targets.

www.rte.ie

 

[190]

Here's an interesting aspect of the 2030 petrol ban I hadn't considered....

Driving test update to preserve the manual gearbox | Auto Express

Essentially as all new (and learner cars) will be autos new drivers will not (never?) be able to drive a manual in under 10 years time.
What happens to the market for manual cars given most new drivers traditionally have 10 year plus old cars as first cars....?

Second tests needed?

The auto trend for cars covers only one vehicle type. Auto motorcycles are exceedingly rare unless you count moped/scooters and I mean real old style motor scooters not the toys that you stand on. There has never been a two wheel auto only test and I'm reasonably sure that if you pass a test on an auto scooter, you can still ride a proper motorcycle with manual gears up to a certain engine power. If two wheel riders can make the auto to manual transition without a specific manual test, then a precedent already exists so why not car drivers.

The transition is not physically as difficult as it once was because manual cars have become more forgiving to drive with the introduction of dual mass flywheels and engines that develop reasonable torque from very low revs. Together they make a modern manual much less prone to stalling by novice drivers. The mental issue that remains is the distraction of thinking about gear changing while also concentrating on the road ahead. Only when manual gear changing becomes "automatic" will these drivers be a safe as they were driving an auto.