payments or not

[G-Force]

Great posts guys, on a slightly different tangent - cars are more cable of high speeds and stop a damn site quicker than what the highway code says and are much more safer than back in the early 70's when speed limits were set, the laws on driving and need a re-vamp... as is the way we teach people to drive. i passed my test (some years ago now) in a 1 litre micra -i bought my self a 2.8XR4i Sierra and went down the closest motorway a bit qiucker than 70mph - and that was my first time on a motorway and my first time driving at night.
Drivers just seem like easy targets for the goverments "funds"

 

[st4]

Great posts guys, on a slightly different tangent - cars are more cable of high speeds and stop a damn site quicker than what the highway code says and are much more safer than back in the early 70's when speed limits were set, the laws on driving and needing a re-vamp... as is the way we teach people to drive. i passed my test (some years ago now) in a 1 litre micra -bought my self a 2.8XR4i Sierra and went down the closest motorway a bit qiucker than 70mph - and that was my first time on a motorway and my first time driving at night. Drivers just seem like easy targets for the goverments "funds"

Welcome G force, do you know about the meet we have planned in Scotland in October, read about it here

Cars do outperform the highway code's numbers and your right re safety and speed limits. But alas the people who operate them and driver skill levels haven't moved on. I therefore would't recommend a change to speed limits without a thorough examination of the way we train car drivers. We're safer in our cars now that they've advanced, but a higher speed limit (100mph) would detract all that progress that has been made to make us safer in our metal boxes.

However the offence of speeding is of such minutia compared to what goes on out there that I can't help but laugh when someone gets pulled over and fined for a 5mph speed limit breach, its the equivielent of adding jogging pace to the speed your travelling at, but taking money out of the equation it wouldn't happen. Money talks, especially with this empoverished lot that are in power.

 

[G-Force]

True ***,

I drive a bit in Germany and the learner drivers are given much more training - driving/first aid/road sense and basic mechanics and their road sense on autobahns is excellent, i would say their is less accidents on the autobahns than on our motorway network and a lot of their country doesn't have speed limits
I appears that sometimes you can send away 10 kellogs tiger tokens and you get a liscence these days and the driving standard is awfull.

However a down side of the "no speed limit" in Germany is that when their is a crash it's usually a biggee!!!

 

[Mudster]

I'm not bothered by the money, it's the points that bother me.

Of all the times I've been stopped, I've been at fault.

I only ever felt aggreived for one of the offences which is a long and boring story.

I was even given great benefit due to extenuating circumstances...driving at well over 100 mph (in a 60 zone) towards a hospital to see my father who'd been rushed in with a heart attack....I should have been banned but was offered 3pts once the police made enquiries of his admission....

However I seem to spend a great deal of time with 9pts on my licence and becoming a mobile chicane as I simply can't take another hit.....

 

[GrahamC230K]

I voted will not make a difference as I am more concerned about getting the points and how that affects either keeping my license or how it financially affects my insurance.

Indeed, this was my first reaction. Paying the fine is not the problem. However before you vote I think the question to ponder is would ther be so many tickets issued if there wasn't revenue earned from them?

So if there wasn't a fine and the expensive camera that caught you was otherwise funded, would you feel the conviction more necessary? After all someone must feel that camera a real safety requirement if no revenue is earnt.

 

[pammy]

Why, what about innocent before proven guilty. Without turning this into a dig about the police the fact is they are not a judge or jury, so why should they get to administer the punishment. What about right of appeal and prepartation of a defence, you can't do that on a roadside.

But you can - you have the choice of a ticket - on the spot - or to go to court - it is your choice. If you know you are guilty then the on the spot is a good value way! if you truly feel you are innocent then go to court and argue your point. If the evidence is in your favour it should be rejected and you walk away no poorer and no points. If the evidence is damning then you will likely get a bigger fine for in effect wasting court time - as most know they've done wrong but are just trying to get off .

 

[scumbag]

don't speed. no problems.


speed, risk getting caught, suffer the penatly. The fine and points depend of the severity of how much danger your were causing.

Doing 50 in a 30 brings a bigger reward than doing 90 on a motorway. and yet the speed difference is the same.

In my view the fine and points are meant to be a deterrent to reduce the chances of you speeding. If you get caught. tough. You knew the risk.

Again the point being made here is not about fines and points, its about the speed limits that have been set that in some peoples view may not be realistic.

If they were revalued and raised in some areas let say like this.

20 round schools at school time. 30 at others, wiht lights to show you were 20 was active. 30 round built up areas.
40 at other areas approaching built up areas or those busy bit of dual carriage way, and 50 at hours during the night. where safe. Again with lights to show when.

between 50-90 on motorways at various times, which can be set by controllers depending on traffic volume and weather conditions.

Or some such variation of these, and as we have the technology to do all this, we can even have it flash up on your speedo.

Once we have done that, what will your view on speeding, points and fines be then? Still the same? still revenue generating?

 

[glojo]

A punishment should be just that and has anyone seen any post where a member has stated they would prefer penalty points as opposed to the fine?

To pretend SOME cameras are not plain revenue collectors beggars believe and if we only had points without the fines then would we see as many cameras? If we only had a points system then what about foreign drivers? Do we have a separate system?

Tis a to do and I suppose this topic and similar speed based issues will never be resolved but just about everyone tends to forget the limits we are discussing are just that..... LIMITS. The very maximum speed we can travel at. Look at your rev counter and you will see a red marking. How often do we keep the engine on the absolute limit? Why are we obsessed with sticking to the absolute limit? Not 28, or 29mph we try to travel at least at the legal maximum of 30mph. Weird especially as the time taken to travel through a town or village is to all intents and purposes the same whether we travel at 25, or 30mph, can it be ego, or image?

John

 

[st4]

A punishment should be just that and has anyone seen any post where a member has stated they would prefer penalty points as opposed to the fine?

To pretend SOME cameras are not plain revenue collectors beggars believe and if we only had points without the fines then would we see as many cameras? If we only had a points system then what about foreign drivers? Do we have a separate system?

Tis a to do and I suppose this topic and similar speed based issues will never be resolved but just about everyone tends to forget the limits we are discussing are just that..... LIMITS. The very maximum speed we can travel at. Look at your rev counter and you will see a red marking. How often do we keep the engine on the absolute limit? Why are we obsessed with sticking to the absolute limit? Not 28, or 29mph we try to travel at least at the legal maximum of 30mph. Weird especially as the time taken to travel through a town or village is to all intents and purposes the same whether we travel at 25, or 30mph, can it be ego, or image?

John

I do actually agree with virtually all this and for the most part I do actually drive under the speed limit as I like to take my time (and save on fuel as I a miser).

However I think more people would have faith in the system if money didn't switch hands for motoring offences, why not some community service or something like that. For most £60 isn't a huge deterent, saturday afternoon in ones duds picking up litter etc in the park much more so and punishments like that, IMHO, would increase compliance.

But you can - you have the choice of a ticket - on the spot - or to go to court - it is your choice. If you know you are guilty then the on the spot is a good value way! if you truly feel you are innocent then go to court and argue your point. If the evidence is in your favour it should be rejected and you walk away no poorer and no points. If the evidence is damning then you will likely get a bigger fine for in effect wasting court time - as most know they've done wrong but are just trying to get off .

Fair do's. I guess if I was gunning it, I'd just take the punishment on the chin.

True ***,

I drive a bit in Germany and the learner drivers are given much more training - driving/first aid/road sense and basic mechanics and their road sense on autobahns is excellent, i would say their is less accidents on the autobahns than on our motorway network and a lot of their country doesn't have speed limits
I appears that sometimes you can send away 10 kellogs tiger tokens and you get a liscence these days and the driving standard is awfull.

However a down side of the "no speed limit" in Germany is that when their is a crash it's usually a biggee!!!

At the meet we should pick flanaia1's brains about this. I tend to agree though, driving standards are woeful and the german way makes sense. I haven't driven in Germany but have heard they have much better lane discipline etc. Plus I like the idea of limitless speed, it gives the driver more responsibility over their actions and the consequences of those