190E Evolution II

[talbir]

I always try to isolate seller and car - if seller is a dealer/profit maker, then he's likely not had the car a long time, so cannot have done much to the car or ruined it in anyway.

He may not disclose all the details, but that's the prospective buyers job to uncover....one should never rely on / trust the seller's story, always judge the piece based on your own info and judgement. Far easier to draw conclusions on a piece of metal than a human being so why bother trying to work out seller at all ?


talbir

 

[Carlo]

Hello Evo fans,

A friend of mine was looking for an Evo II and we saw the Evo on pistonheads.
A Dutch forum member of the Mercedes 16 valve community in Germany whent over the channel to have a look at the car.The interior was perfect but the bodywork needed some repainting.
BUT! The engine wasn't a genuine Evo II engine.The engine nr was scraped away ( removed ) so it wasn't that of a bargain.Probably normal 2.5 16v engine

Greetings Carlo

 

[jaymanek]

How could your friend tell the difference? I thought cosmetically they looked the same...

p.s. I had a little bid on this too but didnt go too far with it as I thought it didnt add up.

 

[Will]

Very interesting.

There was a discussion over on the 190 forum on a similar topic recently. As you know, the 2.5-16 Evolution I & II engines are different from the regular 102.990 2.5-16 engines, and there is some question over what original MB engine parts are remaining (specifically the block and crank etc).

So if this has a non-original engine, poor bodywork and is a category-C insurance write-off I really can't see it being worth very much

Sorry to hear of your freind's wasted trip.

Will

 

[Will]

Thinking about this some more - wonder where the original engine is and what happened to it?

It's possible (just!) that the car has some hidden past - stolen/recovered (maybe not even in this country), engine number ground off perhaps?

It's pretty easy to determine if this is an original Evolution-II engine though by inspection, if required.

Will

 

[Carlo]

The Ke-Injection unit and the EZL unit where different from the Evo II engine.
That was the first thing he saw.
The bore and stroke from the Evo I and II are different then the normal 2.5 16V.
2.3 16-2.5 16 and Evo II have a slinge chain Evo II has double chain.

Pieces for the EVO I and II are rare to find.Most pieces that were in the factory are sold to breakers.
Front bumpers , door pannels etc aren't available true Mercedes Benz anymore.
A few months ago I needed a doorpannel for a friends Evo I and there was 1 available ( in Denemark )
Rods and pistons and pistonrings aren't available anymore true Mercedes Benz

Bottom line , if you want a genuine and good Evo I or II you'll have to pay for it.Bargains for such a cars is a waste of money i guess.
I feel pitty for the guy who won the bid on ebay.I really do.

The seller had to known these shortcommings and metion them when he advertised his car.

 

[jaymanek]

im sure the seller was bidding himself, i doubt its actually sold and if it did there is a strong chance it will be back on again...

 

[mercboiuk]

Considering this new information coming to light, it seems a classic case of "if it's too good to be true".....

Darren

 

[pentoman]

2.3 16-2.5 16 and Evo II have a slinge chain Evo II has double chain.

Perhaps you got your sentence the wrong way round in a muddle, but a 2.5-16 has a double chain. Perhaps an Evo II has a single chain (I think it might) and that was the issue?

 

[jaymanek]

I think all 2.5's have double chains..

 

[Will]

2.3-16 - single-row chain (simplex)
2.5-16 - double-row chain (duplex)

IIRC, the 2.5-16 Evolution-II might have a simplex chain (as Pentoman has noted).

Some 2.3-16s out there have got a duplex chain setup, although there is some confusion as to whether they came like this from the factory. It's quite likely that they were fitted with the duplex timing gear after manufacture (perhaps after a failure of the original chain or as part of an overhaul).

Will