Do you have those extended shank wheel bolts?

[jaymanek]

If so get them changed now before they snap on the side of the road.

We have had plenty of experience and so I have changed all the ones on my cars.

With the extended bolts, when the head shears off, there are limited ways of gripping the shank with enough force to be able to turn it out...

Normally we simply burn the bolts out with oxy acetylene but one on this car was simply having none of it..

This is the first time a wheel has had to be destroyed.

The wheel is still not free, we have been battling for over a day.

 

[corned]

Sorry Jay, it's a good sales pitch, but that style of wheel is never going to catch on...

On a serious note, are you saying that the bolt shears at a point where there is still a 'head' on the outside edge of the wheel face, i.e. preventing the wheel from simply being pulled off the hub?

 

[jaymanek]

Yes thats right... Due to how far the bolt sits into the wheel, they decided to extend the shank... however instead of having just a long head, they have a narrow stem instead which cannot take a lot of force.. so if your wheels havent been off for a while or someone has over tightened...

these extended shank bolts were used throughout the 80's and 90's... MB stopped supplying them for some time, but they seem to be available again.

 

[corned]

Great design - not. Just like a proper shearbolt!

Doh!

That copper grease stuff certainly has it's uses though...

 

[Roger Jones]

Thanks for this reminder. Having just acquired an R129 with the old bolts, I'll be changing them. The part number I picked up from another thread for the replacements proved invalid, so I wonder if you can confirm the correct number for the new bolts.

My newly arrived car was fresh out of a tyre shop used by the vendor. Not only did they fail to plug the leak caused by a nail (the tyre is still losing pressure), but they must have overtightened the bolts by 20 Nm or more, such was the force I had to use to get them undone. I bet many of the sheared bolts failed because of overtightening. You can tell when the correct torque has been applied, because loosening the bolts doesn't require the gorilla technique (unless they haven't been shifted for ages, I guess), as was clear from the difference between the "repaired" wheel and the rest.

By the way, having read the manual for the car, I found this unequivocal statement from MB: "Never oil or grease wheel studs." (they mean bolts). I mention this as it cropped up in another thread recently, with opinions differing.

And, by the way, the manual also says "The higher tyre pressures for a heavily laden car also produce favourable handling characteristics with lighter loads and are perfectly permissible. The ride of the car, however, will be somewhat harder." I was surprised to see this official sanction, but you learn something every day, especially if you RTFM.

 

[renault12ts]

What's RTFM ?

 

[Roger Jones]

An old computer-world abbreviation: "Read the f manual". Expand the f word to your taste.

 

[renault12ts]

What? Fine? Furry? ****?

 

[alexander patie]

a few points from a mechanics perspective.

the bolts ONLY cause problems when kwik-fit or similar animals over tighten the bolts with an airgun. a despicable but oft used practice. we always torque wheel bolts.

those new bolts in the picture appear to have a significantly thicker shaft! MB do modify parts to eradicate known faults...

yes, copper grease or any lubricant at all is forbidden from wheel bolt threads and flanges, although it is wise to clean rusty threads and make sure they are clear in the hub - especially on front hubs with alloy wheels.

we see this fault a lot with w210s and one or two other models. we usually drill the bolt carefully until the flange is removed, then the stub comes out with mole grips. i was frankly SHOCKED to see jaymanek's picture. this is really an unecessary approach, the bolts CAN BE DRILLED out in less than 3/4 hr without any damage to wheel or hub.

 

[jaymanek]

we see this fault a lot with w210s and one or two other models. we usually drill the bolt carefully until the flange is removed, then the stub comes out with mole grips. i was frankly SHOCKED to see jaymanek's picture. this is really an unecessary approach, the bolts CAN BE DRILLED out in less than 3/4 hr without any damage to wheel or hub.

Sorry but you werent there... we tried to drill 9 stuck bolts..(went through LOTS of expensive drill bits) some came, some didnt so we used oxy acetaline.. but the tenth was having none of it. We had half the mechanics in the whole of Nuneaton here with their tools...
Its a tough task as the bolt seat is so deep into the wheel.
Im sure with some tool it may have been possible but we wasted 2 days (on and off) and in the end the wheel had to go.

next time i will invite you to help

 

[renault12ts]

OK J we know. I was waiting for your reply when I saw THAT post!!

 

[franey]

For your info................

I sell the extended ones, though these have a thicker shank so are a bit stronger,
I would steer clear of Kwikfit Kev !!

 

[franey]

Suggest using ceramic grease on threads.

 

[jaymanek]

For your info................

I sell the extended ones, though these have a thicker shank so are a bit stronger,
I would steer clear of Kwikfit Kev !!

Really? I know you sell them but how good is the quality? I would consider a set for both my SL and 500E.. Do they rust?

 

[franey]

Jay, PM your address etc, I will send a set for one wheel for you to evaluate. The bolts are a satin chrome as opposed to a mirroe finish.

 

[alexander patie]

sorry to bend noses out of joint, although i can understand the offence i have caused, i feel it needed saying.

i have personally drilled out many of these bolts, did one two weeks ago. just like in this case, i have had to do many on one car, definately due to over torquing with an airgun - this really gets me!!

regarding drilling the bolts, it is certainly not easy. the main points to note are the correct drill sizes to use, and that, obviously, the hole needs to be dead central to the bolt. if it goes off center this will cause major trouble with the last drill size. i have been told many times by others that the bolts are too hard to drill, but they were wrong. modest i may not be, but nor am i a liar.

the biggest mistake people make when drilling is going up too small a drill size. i would start with a 3mm bit, making sure to keep it concentric to the bolt! then 8mm then 13mm. if it is perfectly central it all goes like a dream, but if not the last size will not cut centrally and a burr grinder will be needed to trim the stub to get the drill back on line again.

i should say again, i do not wish to cause offence with my comments. none of us are perfect and we can ALL learn something from others here - myself included. i hope my advice can be of use to someone else, and wil get a couple of pics for a 'how to' guide next time .

 

[renault12ts]

Duck...

 

[alexander patie]

pet?

 

[jaymanek]

Thats completely fair enough and on a forum theory is great..

With the greatest respect as ive never met you.. I would have loved to have seen you try...

Like i said we have done this umpteen times too.. and normally they do drill out.. just like the other 9 did..

 

[alexander patie]

that is very fair comment jay (is it jay?). it is of course possible that this 1x bolt was not a genuine MB item.

sorry again for any offence, i can be a little too forthright on occasion.