E270 Woes

[alistairherriot]

Just out of interest, has anyone else had similar problems?

I have a 2004 E270 CDI Aventgarde which has so far racked up 61K of nice motorway driving (Silverstone to Heathrow) every day. In the time that I have had the car (from new) I have had no less than 4 recalls on the braking system, the last one resulting with the brakes being semi- seized on and the rear disks turning blue!!, the engine started to sound like a cheap taxi (rattling both from cold and warm!!). I have just had it returned from service on Sat morning, to be told that my front disks now need replacing, and worse than that, the bottom ball joints also want replacing. Throw into the mix a lazy drivers door mirror that only folds now to 45deg, and a telephone kit that cannot be upgraded from the Nokia 6310i (which is now obsolete, but not to worry, as MB will supply me with a new handset for £400 + VAT!!

I have to question my future purchase now, as I paid £38K for this car, and when I enquired about trading in for a new 320 CDI CLS, after 18 months I was informed that it was worth the grand total of £18K trade in.

I am desperately disapointed with what I felt was going to be a car with excellent build quality and reliability, coupled with rock solid residuals.

Any one else with anything similar, or is it just me??

 

[marc777]

I can relate to the recall etc but still very pleased with my car - very pleased.

Trade in seems low. Very disappointing. I'd want more than that for my 2002 model !

CLS is nice, but again be prepared for depreciation. No matter the make, it'll be there. My advice, keep the car longer

Marc

PS Welcome to the forum

 

[Satch]

The PX value you have been offered seems v low even given high miles :sounds like somebody is trying their luck. If you paid £38k, what options? Were they taken account of?

Being stuck with the Nokia 6310i or suffering wallet pain is something many of up know well. Actually the 6310i is about the best phone Nokia ever made: if you just want a phone!

Door mirror: yes, they can stick. Thought there was a known fix for this.

Ball joints: sad but true. Warranty item so do not worry about it. Replacement units said to be better.

Brake discs: again sad but true although not a Mercedes specific issue. Many modern cars suffer from disc wear thanks to changes in pad and disc material.

Brake recalls should be preventative measures but sound like something went wrong. Not heard of that one & think you have just been unlucky.

Engine rattles: maybe something very wrong there and should be properly looked at for a warranty claim. But sometimes clatter & roughness can be thanks to a duff spray pattern if the injectors are dirty. Dealer should have dumped some injector cleaner in but run it on BP Ultimate Diesel for a while and trying sticking some more injector cleaner in.

If no difference make a big fuss and involve Daimler Chrysler UK. Not good enough

 

[jeremytaylor]

I thought the brake recalls only affected the petrol models.

Don't understand the phone bit. Do you have a cradle on the side of the console or is it fitted in the arm-rest cubby and fully integrated?

If it's the later you can just swap the adapter for about £140 and chose from a range of phones (see Braybrooks).

My brothers 2004 E270 estate had warped discs at 8,000 miles when he collected it from MB Direct, and they were changed under warranty (the fault was clearly there when he collected the car, so they couldn't blame 'wear and tear').

Despite your problems, I can't think of a nicer way to drive from Silverstone to Heathrow every day, ... apart from possibly ... a CLS320 CDI ... !!

 

[Rory]

J
I have to question my future purchase now, as I paid £38K for this car, and when I enquired about trading in for a new 320 CDI CLS, after 18 months I was informed that it was worth the grand total of £18K trade in.

As most used car buyers are 'mileage averse' I suppose the high mileage in a short space of time would make it difficult for an MB dealer to retail.
That's a lot of money to lose though - it's as if MB is almost trying to put you off buying another. Bit like they tried to with mine by quoting me £135/mth for maintenance (not inc tyres) - made me wonder what I was getting myself in to. Cost of ownwership is surely going to be a growing issue as more and more people opt out of company cars and are using their own money.
Thinking about it, at the £1100/mth it's cost, you may well have been better off doing personal contract hire (or maybe PCP) than buying it outright.

Don't know anything about your circumstances (other than that you do a long drive every day) but if that's likely to continue then perhaps a less costly option would be to do as I did, which was to buy a 6mth old car from MB direct. It had done 6000 miles but was £23500, against its new list price of £33,000. So your car would be 2yrs old and have done 67000 miles. I venture to suggest that it wouldn't be worth any less than you're being offered now.

 

[Shude]

Thinking about it, at the £1100/mth it's cost, you may well have been better off doing personal contract hire (or maybe PCP) than buying it outright.

Surely lease/hire gets expensive when you reach 40k/year though? They tend to favour more like 10k/year...

 

[marcos]

I can relate to the recall etc but still very pleased with my car - very pleased.

Trade in seems low. Very disappointing. I'd want more than that for my 2002 model !

CLS is nice, but again be prepared for depreciation. No matter the make, it'll be there. My advice, keep the car longer

Marc

PS Welcome to the forum

I reckon trade in isn't bad when you consider that they are on average offering 20-30% below recomended trade in prices at the moment due to crap second hand car sales. Mind you I bet they whack it on the forcourt for the full amount

 

[Rory]

Surely lease/hire gets expensive when you reach 40k/year though? They tend to favour more like 10k/year...

Well, as a reference I had a look at Inchcape's 'In-Drive', which is a PCP deal.
On the E280CDi Avantgarde Auto, list £35K, 2yr, 40K/yr, no deposit, it's quoting £1055/mth. The 'option to purchase' (and an indication of what they think the car will be worth) value is just £12366!
Maintenance (presume includes tyres) can be included for another £128/mth, which probably isn't too bad.

I'm sure anyone can quote similar prices. Especially bearing in mind that there's no money required up-front (if the OP paid cash then he could keep his money and get some interest on it) then I reckon that compares pretty well with buying outright. However you do it, it's still a lot of money to pour down the drain.

 

[DC_insider]

I reckon trade in isn't bad when you consider that they are on average offering 20-30% below recomended trade in prices at the moment due to crap second hand car sales. Mind you I bet they whack it on the forcourt for the full amount

I don't know where you get the "20-30% below recommended trade in prices" from.

Glass's Guide for a 2004 04 plate E270 CDi Avantgarde Auto Saloon with 61,000 miles in average condition is £17,700.

 

[marcos]

I don't know where you get the "20-30% below recommended trade in prices" from.

Glass's Guide for a 2004 04 plate E270 CDi Avantgarde Auto Saloon with 61,000 miles in average condition is £17,700.

Just what my local Mercedes, BMW and Audi dealers have told me as to why trade in values are so low. I haven't even bothered to look at book prices yet I'm just getting a feel as to what my car might be worth and it aint good.

 

[glojo]

Sorry to hear about all the problems and the trade in offer.

Our car had the lazy wing mirror syndrome the mirror would only misbehave once or twice a month, but our dealer replaced both 'innards' with an updated version. Don't stand for it, get them replaced (if the vehicle is still under warranty)

Regards,
John

 

[Rory]

Just what my local Mercedes, BMW and Audi dealers have told me as to why trade in values are so low. I haven't even bothered to look at book prices yet I'm just getting a feel as to what my car might be worth and it aint good.

Well I've seen comments (on the Honest John website) that say used car sales are booming, and there's a shortage of good cars at auction. No-one can quite understand it because new sales are not too healthy.
My impression for new sales is that BMW are doing fabulously, but Audi and MB are struggling.

 

[blicky_1]

I know how you feel with the trade in prices

I had a few nice NEW cars in the 90's and decided after my last (Merc C200 Sport in 2000 loosing near 20k in 4yrs, 100k miles) that I would never again purchase new after loosing shead loads of money over the years!!

I'm now going to purchase 3yr old cars (Merc's as my mate is a MB technician and does all the work privatley for me) with low ish miles, run them for 3-4 years and hope I see a much lower depreciation!

E.G. my current 2001 E200k was 3yrs old and cost me 12K from an independant (31k new??) with 32k miles on the clock, 1 yr warranty, keep it 3-4 yrs & put 90-100k miles on top of it (with LPG ) and it will still prob fetch 4-5k or more!

 

[pint6x]

Just what my local Mercedes, BMW and Audi dealers have told me as to why trade in values are so low. I haven't even bothered to look at book prices yet I'm just getting a feel as to what my car might be worth and it aint good.

this month's copy of Parker's says marginally over £18,000 for part-ex - I know Parker's guide is looked on with scorn by most motor traders, because they hate people coming into their showrooms with a copy and using it in their negotiations, but it's pretty close to the Glass's guide price posted above.

Incidently, it lists a private sale price at approx £21k for your mileage - you may be better off selling it yourself, or perhaps getting an independent specialist to sell it on your behalf with a commission payment for selling it. Parker's says an independent dealer would have it on the forecourt for about £23k

Is the warranty unlimited mileage or for 60k miles ?

 

[prprandall51]

Hi Alistair, sorry to hear of your woes...

Driver's door mirror: I had this straight from the factory, but the dealer just replaced the mirror motor and the problem was fixed instantly. Have you reported it?

Worn ball joints: you don't habitually drive over speed restrictor cushions, do you (the ones that don't completely straddle the road but are like, well, cushions in the middle of the carriageway)? These are very damaging to the lower ball joints (and the inner tyre walls).

Brake disks: You have done well to reach 60K on your first set. They are considered consumable items since the demise of asbestos pads. And it is a heavy car. I knock my car into neutral as I approach lights, etc. to reduce the wear on the disks (especially the rears).

Phone: this is the inevitable (but irritating for you) result of a mobile phone market that measures product lifecycles in months (typically 12-18) and a car market that measures product development in years. It is a shame you didn't have the UHI option available to you. I think MB are leading the way with the UHI technology. I don't think there is a better solution amongst the premium car manufacturers (though I do wish MB would sort out Bluetooth on Comand).

Rattly deisel: Are you using premium brand deisel fuel? I understand that BP ultimate deisel is very good. Also, have you changed your oil more frequently than the service indicator requires? Both will assist in preserving the engine's condition and prevent the onset of - or minimise - deisel clatter.

Philip

 

[alistairherriot]

Thanks for all of your concerns and comments and the warm welcome extended by the forum.

The rattly deisel was fixed at the service, and is now restored back to the nice and quiet lump it was when new (dirty injectors I suspect). I have never used anything other than top line fuels (Shell, Total, Esso, BP) for this very reason. The car is always kept below 2K until fully warm, and then sits at between 80 + 90 on the M40. The type of driving I do (95% motorway) excludes kerbing it so the ball joints are a mystery. If these problems didn't exist, then I would be extremely happy with the car and probably a commited MB driver for life.

I am the type of person that doesn't mind paying a premium if I am getting a quality product. However, in this case, it feels like a new model has been forced out onto the market, with the customer being expected to undergo the final product development phase during their ownership. This is certainly not the experience I expected from MB, or any other car manufacturer come to that, and it lets down the overall ownership experience.

All that said though, we were fortunate enough to be able to take advantage of the Factory collection option when new. That is an experience I would fully recommend to anyone fortunate enough to be in a position to be able to contemplate it. If only the product lived up to the potential!!

 

[glojo]

However, in this case, it feels like a new model has been forced out onto the market, with the customer being expected to undergo the final product development phase during their ownership. This is certainly not the experience I expected from MB, or any other car manufacturer come to that, and it lets down the overall ownership experience.!

Hi Alistair,
This is exactly what I posted many, many months ago. We were being used for extended development of what to me is now an excellent vehicle.

I dread to think how many times our vehicle has been back to the dealership for either minor electronic problems or the many an varied 'upgrades'. On the plus side, each 'upgrade' is free and it improves what to me is an excellent vehicle. I would not hesitate to recommend the 211 and will certainly be buying another Mercedes when this one goes.

As you can see I am a bit of a 'Party' man, but one that has been known to complain.

Bye for now,
John