Engine mounts replaced - still bouncy

[mjhmjh2]

well I just replaced both the engine mounts on the W124 250 TD. One of the old ones rattled (after I took it off), so I took that as a good sign. First one took about an hour to figure out how to do, second, with hindsight took 10 minutes!

The engine still moves quite a deal from side to side on the engine mounts - I also got an assistant to move the engine whilst I watched the gearbox mount - that hardly moves at all.

Anyway a test drive shows up it's still quite bouncy.. I wonder if it's just meant to be like that. RWD diesel with big fat sprung seats and a clutch, bit of a bounce forward gets amplified in the chair, and hence drivers throttle foot moves which makes it worse. IF you floor it and slip the clutch it's fine.

Any other old manual merc drivers out there confirm what theirs is like to drive?

Matthew

 

[jaymanek]

have you checked the shocker, there is a little strut that dampens the engine movement... this will be worn if its original..

 

[mjhmjh2]

can you tell me where I'm likely to find it please? I did have a look about wondering about fitting a brace or shock absorber of some description - if there is one already then that could be a prime suspect..

Thanks v much!
Matthew

 

[Dieselman]

Jay means the damper of the auxillary drive belt, unikely to be connected.

Check the drive shaft doughnuts and centre bearing.

 

[Parrot of Doom]

http://www.detali.ru/cat/oem_mb0.asp?TP=1

Find your model in there, and then click on 'engine suspension' - that should show you if you've missed anything important.

 

[Ian B Walker]

If memory serves me right the left hand mounting is different from the right hand mounting. Have you go the mountings on the right sides?

 

[BlackC55]

I think the bouncyness you describe is normal when taking up the drive. The clutch feel is normally pretty poor and the gearbox lacks feel and gan be notchy.

 

[grober]

Can you describe the "bouncyness" is it side to side or backwards and forwards. You say you got an assistant to move the engine while you watched the gearbox mount. How did he do that? With good mounts its almost impossible to move the engine much by hand.

 

[Dieselman]

To check the gearbox mounting try lifting it at the rear, shaking the engine won't show anything.

Maybe the problem is the rear suspension bushes are worn out so allowing the rear wheels to move under load.

 

[jaymanek]

Jay means the damper of the auxillary drive belt, unikely to be connected.

Check the drive shaft doughnuts and centre bearing.

No i dont (not that thick!), my W123 has an engine damper, i replaced mine a while back as i was having the same issue...

let me have look through the EPC, not sure if the 124 has it or not..

 

[Ian B Walker]

Jay, I have just been into work to check out a 124 I have in there and there is no damper as shown. Wonders if there should be??

 

[jaymanek]

well looking through the epc it seems that the diesels dont have them... both my old M115 engine and my M102 has them and they do have a noticeable effect if worn...
i thought it was standard across all engines as i remember George Fraser explaining to me that if they get worn they usually cause the engine mountings to go too..

anyway back to the case, this makes me think something must be loose, are you sure all the bots were tightened properly on the mounts... i mean there is no way engine movement should be translated into the car so much so to cause your foot to slip!

 

[mjhmjh2]

oh yeah everything under the bonnet done up to correct torques

I found the problem though, the diff rear bolts look like they should have a rubber bush around them... what they appear to have is no rubber!

This looks like a slightly more difficult job. Now I'm pretty sure with a big enough hammer and a drift/chisel/mini grinder I could get the old ones out, but is it likely to be able to get new ones in on the car? It was mentioned there is a rear subframe that might need removal - again is that a massive job?

I've really no money at the moment but if I have to then I've been suggested to go to Star Motors in Reading - I've no idea what the labour time on this kind of job is likely to be so any pointers would be appreciated.

thanks
Matthew

 

[jaymanek]

do you mean the propshaft rubber donut where it joins the diff? If so this is not a hard job but you do need to have the car up in the air....

 

[Dieselman]

I think he means the diff mountings.
No problem, just unbolt the bolts and press in new mountings.

PART No 8

 

[jaymanek]

interesting, on the W123 its just four bolts holding it on, no rubber bits..

 

[mjhmjh2]

sorry, I've just been explaining it to my wife and have gone into "the round things that hold the thing that splits the whirley motion intot he rear wheels".. yes I mean the diff bolts.

When you say just press in new ones, on the basis that I can't get a 20 tonne press under the car, how do you press new ones in? I guess I could make up a couple of plates and a big screw puller/pusher type affair/

This is one of those jobs I'm looking at thinking, if I get into this will I wish that I hadn't? Dropping the diff doesn't seem too much trouble (I've changed land rover gearboxes before so it cant be worse than that!), its just the bushes I'm worried about getting them in

again, many thanks for your replies, very much appreciated!

Matthew

 

[Dieselman]

(I've changed land rover gearboxes before so it cant be worse than that!),

It's not...they are baa..ad on series II or III.

A bolt will pull them into the recess no problem, even the diff bolt may well do the job with some lube on the bush.

 

[mjhmjh2]

ahh smashing.. you chap are a star! You've convinced me to do it now ... I'm sure I'll be cursing in the rain under the car in the next few days!!

If I had to remove the rear subframe.... (I'm being lazy and dont want to get wet outside), what sort of a job removing the rear subframe is? from the pic I can't quite tell if all the suspention is mounted to it or not.. If not then it ought to be easy enough to get that off and then we can get the whole thing on the press.

Dare I ask why it's a job to avoid on series II or III?

Matthew

 

[Dieselman]

All the suspension is on the subframe so it can all be dropped together if needs be. Just undo the four subframe to body bolts and the propshaft and brake lines.

For the landy the gearbox is a pain because the crossmember is welded on, not bolted.
It's either a case of the seatbox out and lift from above or split the transfer case off the back of the box first.

The wife seems to know what she's on about, get her to do the job.

If access is too poor, drop the diff and you can then pull the new bushes in from that side where there will be loads of access.