First 3 months of E63 ownership

[Shayetet]

Hi chaps, I’m new to MB. Having just chopped in my BMW 540 Msport in November 2020 for a 2012 W212 E63 5.5l bi turbo with 49k miles on the clock.

I was aware of the chain stretch issue surrounding these cars, but had some comfort knowing the car had the chain upgrade in October 2018.
Everything was great, enjoying the car every minute until the EML came on!

The car has been in the Mercedes dealership for the past week for a strip down as the car was throwing P0022 fault code.
Couldn’t be the timing chains surely, not after all the work previously done less than 10k ago.

Nope, it turns out that during the repair in October 2018. The fitter managed to block one of the oil galleries with sealant which appears to have affected the oil pressure into the head which caused the cams to wear away the aluminium head journals.

An oil check valve wasn’t installed either, so coupled with low oil pressure and oil drain down from the head has resulted in major damage.

Estimated cost of repair is £19k!
Cue lawsuit with dealer I bought it from, and desperate pleas to Mercedes Uk for gesture of good will.

Mercedes refused gesture of good will, but managed to negotiate cost down to £9k but getting the cylinder heads repaired instead of new (saving £3k alone).

Just goes to show, that despite all the known faults with these engines. There is always something that can go wrong, and when they do, they cost mega bucks to fix.

As much as I love the car, it’s fair to say ownership so far has been as enjoyable as a sandpaper covered dildo.

So after a top end rebuild, what more can go wrong with the car...?

I’ll keep you posted....

 

[Teego]

Sue the fuggers. It's not an ex-factory fault, it's incompetence in the workshop trying to fix the factory fault. A decent specialist lawyer should give you a free initial consultation and appraisal of your chances.

 

[Shayetet]

Sue the fuggers. It's not an ex-factory fault, it's incompetence in the workshop trying to fix the factory fault. A decent specialist lawyer should give you a free initial consultation and appraisal of your

 

[Shayetet]

Teego the wheels are in motion!

 

[HB]

Absolute nightmare for you. This one of the best cars we’ve ever had and ran fault free from new to 40k mikes when we sold it.
I assume it wasn’t bought from a main dealer?
We have a full diagnostic, mechanical and legal team here in the forum. Not many things we can’t help solve.

 

[MrGreedy]

It's pretty disgusting. If the garage selling the car are the same one that has done the work, I would guess that the claim is probably more straightforward.
But even if it wasn't the same garage, surely there is remedy in law for this sort of mess up .

Do keep us updated please. I'll be very interested to see how this develops.

Good luck and welcome to the Forum!

 

[Shayetet]

Absolute nightmare for you. This one of the best cars we’ve ever had and ran fault free from new to 40k mikes when we sold it.
I assume it wasn’t bought from a main dealer?
We have a full diagnostic, mechanical and legal team here in the forum. Not many things we can’t help solve.

Thanks HB, I just hope when I get the car back it remains fault free and all this doesn’t take the shine off owning the car. I’ll post regular updates of how things progress. Any advice will be welcome.

 

[Shayetet]

It's pretty disgusting. If the garage selling the car are the same one that has done the work, I would guess that the claim is probably more straightforward.
But even if it wasn't the same garage, surely there is remedy in law for this sort of mess up .

Do keep us updated please. I'll be very interested to see how this develops.

Good luck and welcome to the Forum!

It's pretty disgusting. If the garage selling the car are the same one that has done the work, I would guess that the claim is probably more straightforward.
But even if it wasn't the same garage, surely there is remedy in law for this sort of mess up .

Do keep us updated please. I'll be very interested to see how this develops.

Good luck and welcome to the Forum!

They a separate garages, and yes there is a remedy in Law for this. Unfortunately it costs time and money but I’ll get there. The purchase of the car is covered under the consumer rights act 2015, and as I’ve owned the car longer than 30 days and less than 6 month I’m entitled by law to a repair or replacement. If they don’t pay the repair I’ll claim through the courts. The incompetence of the repair is a different matter and one I do not want to upset Mercedes with as they are being very helpful and I need them to help with all the reports I need.
As long as I get the repairs paid for somehow I’ll be happy. But not as happy as getting behind the wheel again!
I’ll keep you posted.

 

[Shayetet]

Ok so I have an update.

It turns out the cylinder heads are too far gone to be repaired, so new ones are now required.

Received the final estimate for the work from Mercedes yesterday. Just shy of £14.5k plus the cost of the strip down so far at £1.5k.
Nearly £10k of that is parts and considering the job is an engine out procedure, I don’t think it’s too bad. It includes a new oil pump and oil check valves, new cams, left and right bank cylinder heads and new actuators.

It does feel like a major kick in the balls, but once the car has a new top end rebuild it should be back to running like new again.

Having one last go with Mercedes to see what I can get out of them but I won’t hold my breath.

I need to wait a couple of weeks for the garage I bought the car from to respond to my letter then the repairs will commence either way.

Rebuild will take two weeks.

So hopefully in 4 weeks time I’ll be back on the road. Unless something else goes wrong between now and then...

Oh and incase anyone is wondering, a new M157 engine from Mercedes will cost around £45k plus labour.

 

[Will]

Ouch!

I can’t speak from a legal point of authority, but doesn’t the seller/selling garage have to be given the opportunity to rectify this before MB are let loose on the repair?

I mean, the repair costs seem to be cost prohibitive relative to the value of a 2012 car - I would sell the car as is or fit a used engine if the repair costs were mine to bear personally.

Hope you get the outcome you’re looking for, but I’d be surprised if the seller would stump £16k for this work without the opportunity for them to mitigate costs (buy the car back for example?)

 

[Shayetet]

Ouch!

I can’t speak from a legal point of authority, but doesn’t the seller/selling garage have to be given the opportunity to rectify this before MB are let loose on the repair?

I mean, the repair costs seem to be cost prohibitive relative to the value of a 2012 car - I would sell the car as is or fit a used engine if the repair costs were mine to bear personally.

Hope you get the outcome you’re looking for, but I’d be surprised if the seller would stump £16k for this work without the opportunity for them to mitigate costs (buy the car back for example?)

Will that’s correct, I explained my rights further up the post and obviously I can’t divulge too much info of my letter due to the ongoing case. I haven’t put forward the full cost of the repair to the seller, but offered a resolution which also involves the warranty paying for some of it. If the seller offers to refund me then that is also an option. But as it stands I’ve exercised my right to have the car repaired.

 

[Will]

Sounds like you’re familiar with your rights, but nonetheless I wouldn’t want to be paying out £16k from my own pocket unless I was 110% certain that I would be getting the money back.

Not saying that you’re doing anything wrong, but I would perhaps want a second legal opinion before proceeding to spend the additional £14.5k I guess!

 

[Shayetet]

Sounds like you’re familiar with your rights, but nonetheless I wouldn’t want to be paying out £16k from my own pocket unless I was 110% certain that I would be getting the money back.

Not saying that you’re doing anything wrong, but I would perhaps want a second legal opinion before proceeding to spend the additional £14.5k I guess!

Will, I’ve consulted a solicitor, I’ve got an independent vehicle inspection CPR report by the IAEA who have determined the fault was present at the time of purchase and the car is not fit for purpose. I’ve got a report from Mercedes that identifies the extent of the damage and their view on condition of the engine at time of purchase etc. I’m requesting the repairs are carried out by MB as I want it done properly and I want it warranted. I do not trust the selling garage to fix the car.
don’t get me wrong, I’m s**t scared it could all go wrong but I can only go by the advice I’m given and I’m satisfied that I have a sufficient case. If the seller refuses to repair, then I will commit to having the repair carried out and take it to court.

 

[Will]

Will, I’ve consulted a solicitor, I’ve got an independent vehicle inspection CPR report by the IAEA who have determined the fault was present at the time of purchase and the car is not fit for purpose. I’ve got a report from Mercedes that identifies the extent of the damage and their view on condition of the engine at time of purchase etc. I’m requesting the repairs are carried out by MB as I want it done properly and I want it warranted. I do not trust the selling garage to fix the car.
don’t get me wrong, I’m s**t scared it could all go wrong but I can only go by the advice I’m given and I’m satisfied that I have a sufficient case. If the seller refuses to repair, then I will commit to having the repair carried out and take it to court.

I totally understand your viewpoint, and likewise if I was in your shoes I would prefer that the car was repaired by Mercedes-Benz - just that I’m not sure you can demand that they’re the only ones who can repair the car, and at any cost.

Have you given the seller the opportunity to arrange repairs themselves? I can think of several suggestions they may make to mitigate the costs (source parts themselves, negotiate on the labour rate, perhaps persue the original repair place for this issue, or even buy the car back due to the cost of repair)

I wish you all the best of luck, but would reiterate my earlier point and ask for cast iron assurance from your legal advisor that you’ll get be getting every penny of this £16k bill

 

[TeddyRuxpin]

Sorry, but was the dodgy timing chain 'repair' done by an MB tech/dealer or an indie?

 

[Shayetet]

Sorry, but was the dodgy timing chain 'repair' done by an MB tech/dealer or an indie?

It was done by MB dealer.

 

[Will]

This sounds a bit awkward for MB if the repair was done by them in the first place!

It’s over by a few months, but I thought they warranted their work (parts and labour) for 2 years anyway - did your legal guy comment about any possible liability with them bearing in mind the issues found during the strip down?

 

[Shayetet]

W

I totally understand your viewpoint, and likewise if I was in your shoes I would prefer that the car was repaired by Mercedes-Benz - just that I’m not sure you can demand that they’re the only ones who can repair the car, and at any cost.

Have you given the seller the opportunity to arrange repairs themselves? I can think of several suggestions they may make to mitigate the costs (source parts themselves, negotiate on the labour rate, perhaps persue the original repair place for this issue, or even buy the car back due to the cost of repair)

I wish you all the best of luck, but would reiterate my earlier point and ask for cast iron assurance from your legal advisor that you’ll get be getting every penny of this £16k bill

All this will all form part of the ADR process, I’ve requested what I want. I’ve been reasonable in a resolution. I’m expecting the seller to propose their own resolution, and if they offer to repair the vehicle a lower price then so be it. I’ll pay the extra to have MB repair the car.

 

[Shayetet]

This sounds a bit awkward for MB if the repair was done by them in the first place!

It’s over by a few months, but I thought they warranted their work (parts and labour) for 2 years anyway - did your legal guy comment about any possible liability with them bearing in mind the issues found during the strip down?

It was a different MB dealer to now, but yes very awkward. I’m waiting for Mercedes UK to respond the report. Not had much discussion on it with my solicitor to be honest, just tying to focus on one thing at a time.

 

[Will]

You mention ADR - you’ve not mentioned (unless I missed it?) what the seller said when you first noticed the EML appear, and what they have said about the route to getting the car fixed, or even what they said about the situation now with it stripped down at the MB main dealer etc?

In other words, is there a dispute currently - have they refused to look at it or did they not offer to get it repaired?