I think the garage burst the threads on my head .....

[Tony Russell]

You know this old chesnut ?

I'm not trying to be insulting... but...

YOU clearly don't know what you're doing.
YOUR GARAGE clearly don't know what they are doing.

I am at a loss to explain why you think that with the combination of the above, all you have to do is keep taking bites of the apple and eventually you will end up with a whole, fresh apple...

Take the car to someone competent, then send the bill to the current place. Small claims if necessary.

So the car has been in the garage for 3 whole weeks now.
I hired the seating tool for them and printed off loads of material from here.

I dropped in last night to see what was happening.
I walked in and discovered the injector clamp held in with a home do re-threaded piece if stud and held in place with two nuts.
That was bad enough (seeing the material wasn't engineered for the specific stresses of the purpose), but hey were also running the enhgine under the boss's instruction to see if a bit of carbon would block the sllight leak that was evident at the seat of one injector.

FFS !!!!!!

I have read enough now to realise that the action alone of running with a leak will only cause further erosion of the seat.
That and the fact that the home-do stud thing is just waiting to either shear or pop off.

So they showed me the original bolt, and it was clear that the head was threaded as there were bits of it in the bolt.
That should have been obvious first time it was removed (if it was there already), or it was caused by being overtorqued when it was replaced (they hadn't used new bolts).

So now I have a perfectly good car which is unuseabble because there's nothing to hold two injectors in.

At this point, I have asked them to do no more work on it, other than build it back up.
They seemed to be unaware of the danger of trying to tap it up a size and going into a water or oil channel.

Aaaaaaaarrrrgh.

So, what are the options ?

I've booked it into Merparts for Wednesday.
I'm thinking the obvious repair is a helicoil.
I've heard they are better than the real thing.
I've also heard they are worse than the real thing.

The other option is to get the head our and replaced / rebored / whatever.
But that means not using a std fixing bolt, and that's not preferable.

And that's before I consider the problem of discussing what to pay said garage.

I paid them for the original job, this time there was a new injector, bolts and washers.
I would obviously pay for them, but I'm thinking that I should not be asked to pay for the skill aspect, as it's kind of, er, you know.
But they have my car and they have my key, so I don't have the advantage if they disagree.

Someone suggested getting all my money back and having them pay for the expert bloke.
It's highly unlikely, and I'm not the confrontational type.
Plus, I stupidly didn't get a receipt, in exchange for a slight discount.
Had I just put it on my card, they might well have recovered it for me.

Obviously I see things from my perspective, and I have to appreciate the garage's view too.

Anyone care to rationalise me - or slap me round the head ?

 

[iscaboy]

You will note the following quoted sentence of mine,

"Take the car to someone competent"

The operative word here being COMPETENT.

 

[Tony Russell]

That's why I'm taking it to Merparts now.
Meantime, I have the whole thing going over and over in my head as I try to work out the scenarios - hence the questions.

And I need to figure out how I will set the financial position straight in a way that is equitable and reasonable to all concerned - which is why I'm asking those in the trade and others what's the RIGHT thing to do.

 

[Number_Cruncher]

>>Anyone care to rationalise me - or slap me round the head ?

I wouldn't dream of it.

However, have you spoken with these people?

EXTRACT ENGINEERING

They have experience of repairing these heads when these threads strip (it's not uncommon), and the beauty of the repair is that you can use the original stretch bolt, thus getting back as closely as possible to an original set-up.

They can also recover heads when an idiot has gone too deep and penetrated the cooling passage in the head.

 

[Tony Russell]

Nice. Thanks.


Do you happen to know if it's an engine out job to get the head off an A Class Vaneo though ?

The garage it was in seemed to think so, but then, well, they have said a lot of things lately.

 

[Number_Cruncher]

Nice. Thanks.


Do you happen to know if it's an engine out job to get the head off an A Class Vaneo though ?

The garage it was in seemed to think so, but then, well, they have said a lot of things lately.

I don't know, sorry.

I do know the company in the linkare helpful and approachable (I have no connection with them - I'm not advertising!), so, it might be worth talking with them, and obtaining their opinion before going much further.

 

[smiddyboy1]

What Garage did this work???

Argyle Diesel in East Kilbride is where I took my C220 when it had a blowing injector, never had a problem with it after the work was done

 

[Tony Russell]

I'll not name them - they are in Greenock, it's a small town, and I don't want to cause any problems.

I just want the effing thing sorted properly.

In saying that, 3 weeks of cycling has really been good for me

Gotta look on the bright side.

 

[grober]

A Class Owners Club - Diesel Leaks and Stuck Injector

 

[219]

If you're in Greenock , the Mazzonis are only 5 mins along the road in Port Glasgow . Let them become your new 'local' garage . Paul and Stef are very helpful and know what they are doing .

I would not pay another penny to the other place , nor would I darken their door again .

It's a 'no-brainer' to me .

 

[Tony Russell]

"He would get a stepped adaptor made up, In fact he had two made before achieving the fitting he wanted. ..... The adaptor was made up with the smaller thread of 8mm, and a larger 14mm diameter thread, this screwed into the head, which Rick had again re-tapped. He was aware that the thread depth only needed to be 1.5 times the diameter
of the stud, as mechanically nothing is gained in the strength by increased thread depth beyond that rule.
The adaptors were made at a local engineering workshop and fitted by Rick....
"


If I read this correctly, what he has done is have someone manufacture a helicoil type rawlplug affair for him - though in this case I think he had to do it because he already drilled and tapped the hole to a diameter greater than that a 6mm helicoil would require.

And that's kind of what Extract Engineering are providing.
Problem with that is that I'd need to have the engine dropped to remove the head for the Extract Engineering solution, so on it would go.

Anyways, all I'm doing here is playing with my panic.
I'm sure the Merpart people will do a great job, first time without any daft input from me.

Right ?

 

[Tony Russell]

If you're in Greenock , the Mazzonis are only 5 mins along the road in Port Glasgow . Let them become your new 'local' garage . Paul and Stef are very helpful and know what they are doing .

I would not pay another penny to the other place , nor would I darken their door again .

It's a 'no-brainer' to me .

To be honest, that's all I wanted to hear.
A grown up confirming what I thought.

 

[219]

A grown up confirming what I thought.

It has been a while since I was called THAT

However , the guys will do a decent job , and they don't do bodges .

 

[Danny DeVito]

That was bad enough (seeing the material wasn't engineered for the specific stresses of the purpose), but hey were also running the enhgine under the boss's instruction to see if a bit of carbon would block the sllight leak that was evident at the seat of one injector..

Can't believe that !!

 

[Tony Russell]

However , the guys will do a decent job , and they don't do bodges .

Night and day !!!!

Why on earth I never went there in the first place is beyond me.

I'll write the story up for others benefit later, but the service from Merparts is just exceptional. Right down to the point where Paul phones every day after lunch to give me the news, good and bad, and what he intends, with my permission, to do next.

Today he spent a good 20 minutes explaining everything done so far and what's next.

Still waiting to find out the final result, probably on Monday, but the service has just been excellent.

 

[trapperjohn]

Thanks for the update Tony.

You have certainly had a heap of grief. You are doing exactly the right thing now and moving forward confidently with the support of Mazzonis, not to mention the forum.

Perhaps let someone else take the strain of getting your due worth from the first garage. CAB or local solicitor. Perhaps the threat of a small claims court action will be enough for the first garage to do the right thing and compensate you fully without any further grief.

Good Luck.

 

[Tony Russell]

OK.

NIGHT AND DAY !!!!!


Merparts were, to use the vernacular, f'ing amazing.

Took the vehicle, appraised it, gave the worst case scenario, kept me up to date every single stage of the way, gave me the options, made recommendations, and delivered.

The communication alone was priceless, the result was, er, more priceless.

You know what ?

An experienced independent specialist might be more expensive hour by hour than a generalist, but they spend less time f'cking about and break less, so they actually cost less all in.
And the job is good.

Full write up to follow, and I'll send the same to Lofty for his A Class website, but I was an idiot not to put the car into the gurus in the first place.

Still, hindsight and all that.


.

 

[Howard]

Loftys site is ace.

We've just bought a 168 A class and i've been reading it pretty much constantly.

 

[Tony Russell]

It is the best A Class site on the web, no doubt.
Indeed, the only bible I had until I got a copy of WIS, Russek, and Haynes (eventually).

But just be aware, that some material is well meaning, best available info.
Not necessarily definitive though.

As of this week (I had a Damascus moment), I would strongly recommend people to seek out a guru on this car which is obviously engineered to the very edge of what is possible with minimal, lightweight, innaccessible materials.

I will publish all later.

 

[Tony Russell]

Went into the original garage tonight with the intention of paying them for the parts for which they were out of pocket.

I think that's more than fair, given that I paid them for the original job they made a cnut of, and this 2nd and 3rd session had been their opportunity to put it right. The fact that I agreed to the fitting of another part was my responsibility so I should pay for that.
It can be argued that they should refund the original job, and pay for the experts time, but life is short and I just want to get on with it.

Was a bit stunned when the boss man told me the price of the part (£166 ish) and then gave me a bill for £275 (ish).
"I'm only charging you 2 hours labour".

We cordially agreed to go and have a think.

Have I got it all wrong ?

What's the traders view ? Should I just pay it and not question ?

I like these guys. They have served me well for years. And I am a loyal type.

Should I stand my ground and just payt for the bits ?