Lesson learnt - insurance

[oldguy57]

The fact is that Insurers historically used to lose vast amounts (and I do mean vast) of money on their motor insurance accounts. Underwriting considerations were largely very simply based on age occupation area etc before the advent of computerisation which now allows a large number of elements to be brought into consideration based on gathered data. The data seems to suggest that if you have one claim or incident you are more likely to have another and therefore you are a greater risk.This may or may not be the case for you as an individual but basically "computer says no" seems to be now the overiding consideration. However even given all this the final premium seems negotiable in most cases! Seems to make a mockery of all the use of detailed data to me. Incidentally having a conversation with an insurance company call centre jockey on a topic such as this is a total waste of time- they are neither underwriting nor claims specialists. Might be worth a letter to your Insurers explaining your view.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Have any of you considered using an independent insurance broker?

 

[harvin1975]

Have any of you considered using an independent insurance broker?

Any recommendations?

 

[flowrider]

Mrs. MJ had a no-fault incident recently, no damage to our car. Notified the insurer (Aviva) just in case the other side did decide to claim. I asked if the premium will increase even if the other party did not claim - answer was 'No'. Renewal is not due for another year so I can't say if this is true or not.......

Exactly the same thing happened to my wife 3 years ago, she now has to declare on any new quotes that she had a no fault, no claim incident and pays for it in increased premiums.

 

[mat8n]

I had an accident, I wrote my car off, it was my fault, I lost control, the insurance company paid out nearly £11k, my insurance went up about £100
But, they won't accept it was my fault, It's classed as a partial fault claim

You can't win with insurance. You either need to claim for everything or tell them nothing.

 

[Bonecho]

As already stated it doesn't matter whose fault it was or whether a claim was put in just telling your insurance company of any sort of ding will put up your premium even if you have it protected.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

Any recommendations?

No

 

[John]

However even given all this the final premium seems negotiable in most cases! Seems to make a mockery of all the use of detailed data to me.

Means they can use it to start from a higher premium that you have to negotiate downwards I suppose.

 

[markjay]

....Based on this, going forth if i ever get involved in an accident again, i will not say anything to my insurer unless i want to claim...

Yes, but then you are potentially committing an offence of driving uninsured... i.e. if the insurer somehow does find out that you had an undeclared incident and renders your policy void. Not very likely I agree, but not entirely impossible either.

...Edit: just re-read your post. They are right. Current year premium remained unchanged for me. It's the following year when up for renewal is when the penilisation occurs.

I did say I won't know for sure until the next renewal.....

 

[harvin1975]

Yes, but then you are potentially committing an offence of driving uninsured... i.e. if the insurer somehow does find out that you had an undeclared incident and renders your policy void. Not very likely I agree, but not entirely impossible either..

Depends on the accident of course. If i scratch my car entering my drive it's still deemed an accident - but i won't tell them. A more significant accident involving a 3rd party - i will.
Wrt rendering policy void, they will need to inform you of this. They won't just do it so that you're suddenly driving uninsured and unaware.

I asked if the premium will increase even if the other party did not claim - answer was 'No'. Renewal is not due for another year so I can't say if this is true or not.......

I can tell you with 99% confidence that it will go up if you stay with them and keep terms the same. What they probably meant is that they won't increase your current year's premium.

 

[mat8n]

As already stated it doesn't matter whose fault it was or whether a claim was put in just telling your insurance company of any sort of ding will put up your premium even if you have it protected.

You don't protect your premium, you protect your no claims discount.


for example:-
If your premium is £1000 claim free,you get 50% off, so £500.

If you have a claim/accident the premium will now be £1200, you still get 50% off but your premium is now £600.

 

[m2287]

I can tell you with 99% confidence that it will go up if you stay with them and keep terms the same. What they probably meant is that they won't increase your current year's premium.

I can confirm that Aviva will not increase your premium unless you make an actual claim. (Been there with them last year and just renewed with them).

 

[markjay]

You don't protect your premium, you protect your no claims discount.

for example:-
If your premium is £1000 claim free,you get 50% off, so £500.

If you have a claim/accident the premium will now be £1200, you still get 50% off but your premium is now £600.

Correct...

With most indurers, NCD is now separate to the question of whether you had a claim or not.

e.g., if your NCD is 50%, and it is fully protected, then even in the event of a claim you will still have your 50% NCD next year.

BUT - the overall amount (i.e. the policy cost before NCD is applied) will increase.

So the Premium will rise in the year following a claim even if you have fully protected NCD.

Sounds odd, I know....

 

[tec]

I walked into a lamp-post when i was 5 years old. I've never done this since - would you say i've got a tendency to also walk into lamp-posts?

No, because the slate is usually wiped clean on insurance claims that occurred over 3 to 5 years ago.

 

[Meldrew2]

I walked into a lamp-post when i was 5 years old. I've never done this since - would you say i've got a tendency to also walk into lamp-posts?

Are you Rowan Atkinson?

On NTNOCN he had a tendency to walk into lamp-posts...

 

[harvin1975]

No, because the slate is usually wiped clean on insurance claims that occurred over 3 to 5 years ago.

Very good!

 

[E55BOF]

Correct...

With most indurers, NCD is now separate to the question of whether you had a claim or not.

e.g., if your NCD is 50%, and it is fully protected, then even in the event of a claim you will still have your 50% NCD next year.

BUT - the overall amount (i.e. the policy cost before NCD is applied) will increase.

So the Premium will rise in the year following a claim even if you have fully protected NCD.

Sounds odd, I know....

Unfortunately for the driver, if you accept the actuarial data it is entirely logical. The NCD is applied to the premium, which is based entirely on the calculation of risk, and the data shows that for drivers who have been involved in an accident/incident/claim the risk of a further claim is increased.

Where the system falls down is that it takes no account of individual circumstances. A driver who has thrown his C63 off the road while racing another car is assessed as presenting as much of an increased risk of another claim as a driver whose unoccupied car, parked for an hour in a supermarket car park, has been scraped by some clown in an SUV the driver does not know the size of when parking.


It's unfair; it's a bummer; good luck getting your insurer to agree...

 

[Ash]

'it takes no account of individual circumstances. A driver who has thrown his C63 off the road while racing another car is assessed as presenting as much of an increased risk of another claim as a driver whose unoccupied car, parked for an hour in a supermarket car park, has been scraped by some clown in an SUV the driver does not know the size of when parking.'

... agree - but this seems so dumb. Tempting to get a policy with a black box in the car (telematics) so at least they are using more sophisticated analysis of how & where we drive. Wont appeal to many of this forum maybe but i'd go for it
Ash

 

[mat8n]

Where the system falls down is that it takes no account of individual circumstances. A driver who has thrown his C63 off the road while racing another car is assessed as presenting as much of an increased risk of another claim as a driver whose unoccupied car, parked for an hour in a supermarket car park, has been scraped by some clown in an SUV the driver does not know the size of when parking.

This exactly, The OP is getting the same loading as me 'the clown' for Just making a phone call.

Insurance is a :fail if you're on the wrong side of it, but in my case I was a winner. it equals itself out if you do have a genuine smash.

 

[E55BOF]

"Tempting to get a policy with a black box in the car (telematics) so at least they are using more sophisticated analysis of how & where we drive. Wont appeal to many of this forum maybe but i'd go for it"

OO-er - no thanks - like a dashcam, it can provide evidence for the prosecution as well as the defence...