Lost BHP

[Iggu]

Only the M cars of the new bimmers have the DCT box. The rest use a ZF 8 speed standard auto, which is what the 1 series would of been. Its a bloody quick box, but its not a DCT.

I really wouldn't worry about it. If its been mapped there dam quick. But its no SL AMG

Not so. My 135i had the 7 speed DCT as standard. See here http://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.caranddriver.com/amp/reviews/2011-bmw-135i-dct-first-drive-review
Re: S3 ... agree but my point was about road conditions. If there is any moisture on the road the S3 will beat a RWD AMG purely on traction.
This is why I don't bother with any road races / traffic light grand prix rags these days - my C63 is not "faster" in the real world than my previous cars like my S3 or 135i but it is certainly "better" in every tangible and intangible way imaginable.

 

[Scott_F]

I can assure you from experience, these are mutually inclusive.

I suppose it all depends on your anxiety levels about the potential performance of other road user's cars in relation to your own.

 

[RickMM]

I think the confusion here comes from the fact that newer M135i/140i hatchback models do have the ZF auto, and these are far more common on the road.
Interestingly, this seems to be the way the new M5 is going too, according to US forums.

Not so. My 135i had the 7 speed DCT as standard. See here http://www.google.co.uk/amp/www.caranddriver.com/amp/reviews/2011-bmw-135i-dct-first-drive-review

 

[bluestreak]

A BWM bod recently predicted imminent demise of DCT transmissions in favour of fast evolving automatics, such as ZF. Interesting.

 

[StephenSJason]

I used to own a BMW 135i with the older twin-turbo engine (N54). I shoved everything I could into that besides larger twin turbo's/big single and it was always happy on a dyno around the 430hp mark with around 500lb-ft.

The thing was absolutely nuts, with a huge bang n the back from the "boost" and there wasn't much that could show it up. This was back when the 997 Turbo was the big thing, and my 135i would ride right with them. I also remember when the RS5 was a new thing, I never rated it, but I remember going toe to toe and catching it so quickly that I blew past with relative ease and he looked so, so unbelievably pssd off.
My favourite was probably a locally notorious MK2 Golf, stripped and with an R32 engine. He floored it and as it weighed around 1000kg (if that) it started to leave pretty easily. My mighty BMW then stopped spinning and holy hell, that was the end of him.

It's all relative though as, for example tune a 997 turbo with the same items and my BMW wouldn't have a chance, it'd need better fueling, larger turbo's and the like.

I do miss that car, although on reflection it was a bit ugly.

To put this into context of AMG vs turbo BMW though, with my C63 I did run a friend's hybrid turbo BMW 335i (twin turbo, again), which equated to around 500hp. That thing is serious, and a little lighter, but my C63 with Eurocharged map about leveled with it. Now that it has headers, the C63 has moved on beyond once more.

Like someone said, there will always be something out there faster than you. Power doesn't always come into it, it's RPMs, tyre condition/suspension condition/setup affecting traction for example but also reaction time. If you snoozed for 1sec whilst this remapped (presumably) BMW got on it then that's basically it for you until big speed. You'd need double the power of the BMW to reel it in quickly so say, over 600hp. Then the other big problem is of course power to weight.

Bottom line, don't feel bad. The 55K is still epic even today and with a little tuning gets it right back up there with today's big boys.

 

[Grovsie31]

Only the M cars of the new bimmers have the DCT box. The rest use a ZF 8 speed standard auto, which is what the 1 series would of been. Its a bloody quick box, but its not a DCT.

I really wouldn't worry about it. If its been mapped there dam quick. But its no SL AMG

indeed, I assumed he meant a newer M135i

 

[zoros]

Thanks guys - a wealth of knowledge and I never stop learning.
A lingering question for you all - along the same vein:
How would a Tesla cope amongst all this goings on? Surely with instant torque and very aggressive accel - it would be a match for any of the cars you all talk about, even with your mods etc?

 

[renault12ts]

Thanks guys - a wealth of knowledge and I never stop learning.
A lingering question for you all - along the same vein:
How would a Tesla cope amongst all this goings on? Surely with instant torque and very aggressive accel - it would be a match for any of the cars you all talk about, even with your mods etc?

Up to a point...then the Tesla would lose out. The torque is instant but flat.

 

[E63AMG]

I drove a Tesla X a few weeks ago. Safe to say it was a damn sight quicker than my E63. An unbelievable car, but at £156k new it should be!

 

[bluestreak]

Was that p100D? They are quick alright. I wonder what ownship experience like when battery is at 50%? E63 is better built too and sounds better

 

[John]

I suppose it all depends on your anxiety levels about the potential performance of other road user's cars in relation to your own.

I'm not sure why you would have anxiety about the potential performance of other cars...?

Certainly not an emotion I ever experienced.

I knew what my previous car would be quicker than and what it wouldn't so it was either immense fun trying against faster stuff or immensely satisfying killing "supposedly" fast stuff.

:bannana:

 

[Alex]

Was that p100D? They are quick alright. I wonder what ownship experience like when battery is at 50%? E63 is better built too and sounds better

Quick off the line, dead at the top end = Tesla.

 

[zoros]

Anxiety levels - whoa boy. Not in the least bit stressed - just interested how ugly small mass produced metal has managed to progress from a performance perspective, in such a short period. Bearing in mind (also) that the 135M (if that what it was) - was £35k new and my 55 was £103k new (paint and wheels factory fitted), the engine was 'hand built' and probably cutting edge MB technology only several years ago. And yet you now find a 2 litre block (not the 135M) in a bland box does the business and more. What will it look like in another 10 years I wonder?

 

[renault12ts]

Anxiety levels - whoa boy. Not in the least bit stressed - just interested how ugly small mass produced metal has managed to progress from a performance perspective, in such a short period. Bearing in mind (also) that the 135M (if that what it was) - was £35k new and my 55 was £103k new (paint and wheels factory fitted), the engine was 'hand built' and probably cutting edge MB technology only several years ago. And yet you now find a 2 litre block (not the 135M) in a bland box does the business and more. What will it look like in another 10 years I wonder?

The tech will allow performance at ever decreasing cost.

Ultimately though there is a limit...you'll not get a road car doing 0-60 in less than, say, 2 seconds. So if performance is your thing there will be no need to spend big to get it. In fact spending big to get it will annoy the life out of you if someone else can do the same or better for a third of the cost.

But luxury will always cost and when all is said and done I'd rather be in my luxo barge than an M140.

 

[zoros]

Absolutely.

 

[stevebgt1]

Totally agree.

There are many hot hatch type cars out there at the minute, whether they be standard or mapped, that are very quick from 30-80mph. That does not concern me.
They may be piloting a quick car, BUT, they do NOT experience the same level of satisfaction that you get in an AMG car. I was very very surprised when I bought my A45 AMG last year how quick it was, probably a tad faster than my current E63 5.5Bi Turbo, but they are completely different driving experinces....and I know which one I prefer.

If I want to get from 0-60 as fast as possible, I just jump on my 939 Ducati...

 

[C43AMG]

I had a CL55 Kompressor which I had Eurocharged + 83 Pulley which took it to 550 bhp which was a great improvement except for lots of wheel spinning !! then I had a Quaife LSD fitted, totally transformed the car !! No more spinning and the car just felt planted. The best mod out there.
Same with my CL 63 mapped by Acid at MSL, Birds fitted a Quaife same result, the CL drives so much better. Just came back from 2,500 miles trip around France, what a fantastic Grand Tourer it is.
I have a friend who has a BMW 135 which Birds mapped and upgraded the suspension he also has a 512 Ferrari and he enjoys them both equally.

 

[Deleted member 6183]

This would be appropriate to say about a diesel taxi. When you spend money on an AMG you demand respect and should be prepared to use pulley of any size to get it

 

[John]

0-60/62 are not a reliable measure of the overall performance ability of a car anyway.

Having a car geared up to a fast 60 time doesn't mean anything.

I remember coming up against an RS5 when my car was standard - both supposedly being 0-62 in 4.7s.

I whooped it's ass at Vmax.

Separates the wheat from the chaff!

 

[benlucas]

0-60/62 are not a reliable measure of the overall performance ability of a car anyway.

Having a car geared up to a fast 60 time doesn't mean anything.

This.

Many years ago I purchased a nearly new R5 GT Turbo, almost solely on the strength of its 0-60, this being around 7 and a bit seconds which was front row performance in the early 90s. It did this by virtue of being able to hit 60 in 2nd, was very light and had a tiny turbocharger that spooled up instantly. However, 4-up going up a long incline all the acceleration evaporated, therefore it wasn't that fast at all and I had fallen for the marketing fluff..

Look at 1/4 mile times to see how fast a car really is. If you still want to use 0-60 then a rule of thumb is if the 0-60 time is very close to the 60-100, it's fast!

Anyway, my bum-ometer tells me that my E55 is plenty fast enough compared with the numerous cars I've owned over the years (Cossie, RS6 etc.) and that's good enough for me. I stopped racing other cars years ago.