• The Forums are now open to new registrations, adverts are also being de-tuned.

Sbc pump

plgibson

Active Member
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Messages
266
Location
Essex
Car
S350L W222 + C 220 W204
Took e class in for a service this morning--2.5 hrs. Recieved phone call computor has locked brakes as SBC pump has reached end of servicable life??? Price £130011 but not to worry its covered by Mercedes warranty for life of vechile
Any one else had this or am i being fobbed off, also if i had taken this to a indy for service would there computor have locked the brakes on and replaced free of charge??
 
MB shoud pay for this. The fact you havent been dealer servicing wont count in your favour I would say, but other members have has SBC pumps replaced FOC. I'd raise it with MB HQ at Milton Keynes if MB dont play ball.
 
It sounds unlikely . I have seen SBC problems before , where the car was reading an error message , when i ran STAR on the car , it showed me that the pump had reached its cycle limit , but it did not lock out the brake system . Infact the car is still driving and the pump has not been relpaced yet . The part about the pump being replaced under warrenty is true , and i have read that there standing by the warrenty even without full MB history
 
My previous understanding is that MB has extended the "warranty" for the pump to 10 years old where the pump fails - presumably because it is such a safety critical part and due to the high cost. The pump apparently counts the number of pedal presses and at a certain # it tells the computer that it needs to be replaced - never heard of it locking the brakes though - I think that is probably main dealer exageration.
I take it the cost would have been £1300 and not £130k (!) - still a big brake repair bill.
No wonder the newer E class has gone back to more traditional brakes.
This SBC braking system will render the cars write offs as they get older and MB pulls the plug on the free pumps.
 
MB shoud pay for this. The fact you havent been dealer servicing wont count in your favour I would say, but other members have has SBC pumps replaced FOC. I'd raise it with MB HQ at Milton Keynes if MB dont play ball.

His post already says that MB is paying the bill - for the life of the car (whatever that means - design life, actual life.....) :)
 
My previous understanding is that MB has extended the "warranty" for the pump to 10 years old where the pump fails - presumably because it is such a safety critical part and due to the high cost. The pump apparently counts the number of pedal presses and at a certain # it tells the computer that it needs to be replaced - never heard of it locking the brakes though - I think that is probably main dealer exageration.
I take it the cost would have been £1300 and not £130k (!) - still a big brake repair bill.
No wonder the newer E class has gone back to more traditional brakes.
This SBC braking system will render the cars write offs as they get older and MB pulls the plug on the free pumps.

Interesting MB are replacing this part without question but not taking a similar approach on W124 engine wiring looms, brake issues are more critical and the car is younger I guess, do they have other policy decisions that folks should know about where MB will replace the part under an extended manufacturer warranty?
 
Interesting MB are replacing this part without question but not taking a similar approach on W124 engine wiring looms, brake issues are more critical and the car is younger I guess, do they have other policy decisions that folks should know about where MB will replace the part under an extended manufacturer warranty?


Good point had not thought about that - I guess it is the POTENTIAL for some really awful press if one of these SBC pumps failed and someone died in an accident. It would really scupper the MB brand for decades.
An engine wiring loom does not have the same consequences.
 
Interesting MB are replacing this part without question but not taking a similar approach on W124 engine wiring looms, brake issues are more critical and the car is younger I guess, do they have other policy decisions that folks should know about where MB will replace the part under an extended manufacturer warranty?

I believe one other difference would be the deal MB had with Bosch when they took the SBC system to their cars, it would not be MB paying for the pump but the parts supplier while they probably did not have a similar deal with the wiring harness supplier.
 
Sent in my 7 year-old car today due to sbc pump problem. Was told that there's no warranty 'cos mulfunction was due to "pressure ball" within the pump rather than the pump itself. However, need to change the whole sbc pump 'cos "ball" not sold separately!!

Does it make sence?
 
How can I find out if my car has SBC? Probably a very obvious thing but...... My car 2004 E55 amg.
 
How can I find out if my car has SBC? Probably a very obvious thing but...... My car 2004 E55 amg.

It will have SBC.

SBC was removed in mid-2006 with the facelift W211.

It's very good at stopping your car in an emergency but as you've discovered it also adds its own complications to ownership.
 
It will have SBC.

SBC was removed in mid-2006 with the facelift W211.

It's very good at stopping your car in an emergency but as you've discovered it also adds its own complications to ownership.

Thanks

Something else to worry about then!!

There seems to be some contradictory info on the time period that MB will replace it if it goes wrong. Is there a way of actually promting the issue so that it can be reset or replaced? i don't fancy a massive bill from MB for something they know to be an issue.
 
Funnily enough I was wondering if there was a way to 'break' it just before the ten years is up...assuming it doesn't happen sooner of its own accord.
 
Thanks

Something else to worry about then!!

There seems to be some contradictory info on the time period that MB will replace it if it goes wrong. Is there a way of actually promting the issue so that it can be reset or replaced? i don't fancy a massive bill from MB for something they know to be an issue.

I can't believe it, but I certainly talked this bloody thing up!! About 15 mins after my previous post I get in my car and get a warning on display saying 'service brake visit workshop'!!!! Never seen it before so have just taken my car to MB dealer. They are going to check it out but their words were that the SBC pump is not covered by MB! I said I understood it was covered for life but they say not. They said if the pump needs replacing the only thing they can do is approach MB to get it done under goodwill so no guarantee that I wouldn't have to pay for it. My car is just over 8 years old (first registered Nov 04) and has full main dealer service history. If I have to pay for it I will be p**ssed off to say the least, especially as its a known issue.
 
Rubbish, checked with my dealer a couple of months ago and it is free replacement for ten years as long as it has a full MB service history, so you should be fine. Probably got an advisor who's never come across the problem and got the standard line for any other major problems.
 
Just had a google and found this, could be useful if like me you have no idea what SBC is or if your motor has it, interesting to see the extent of the issues looking at the recalls..

"Sensotronic Brake Control (SBC) is an electro-hydraulic brake system developed by Daimler and Bosch. The SBC system was introduced on the R230 SL-class, which went on sale in Europe in October 2001.[1]
For conventional brake systems, the driver creates brake pressure in the wheels via the master brake cylinder. In contrast, the electro-hydraulic brake SBC provides the brakes with a brake fluid supply from the hydraulic high-pressure reservoir, which is sufficient for several braking events. A piston pump driven by an electric motor supplies a controlled brake fluid pressure between 140 and 160 Bar in the gas diaphragm reservoir.
When the brake is activated - or when ESP intervenes to stabilise the vehicle - the SBC control unit calculates the desired target brake pressures on the individual wheels. Because it determines the necessary braking pressure for each of the four wheels separately and also measures them individually, it can regulate the brake pressure on the individual wheels via the wheel pressure modulators. These four pressure modulators consist of one inlet and one outlet valve, controlled by electronic output stages.
By the use of a travel sensor and a pressure sensor it measures how fast and how strongly the brake is actuated. The control unit processes this information and generates the control signals for the wheel pressure modulators. Normally, the master brake cylinder is detached from the brake circuit. A pedal travel simulator creates normal pedal feedback. If ESP intervenes, the high-pressure reservoir supplies the required brake pressure quickly and precisely to the wheel brakes, without any driver involvement.
SBC offers increased active safety than most conventional brake systems when braking in a corner or on a slippery surface. Moreover, the system offers innovative additional functions to reduce the driver's workload. These include Traffic Jam Assist, which brakes the vehicle automatically in stop-and-go traffic once the driver takes his or her foot off the accelerator. The Soft-Stop function - another first - allows particularly soft and smooth stopping in town traffic.
In 2001 the µ-Club, an association of international experts in the field of brake technology, honored Robert Bosch GmbH and Daimler­Chrysler AG for the development of the electrohydraulic brake SBC. The respective project managers of both enterprises received the award in the form of the µ-medal in Bad Neuenahr.
The Greek letter µ symbolizes in physics the friction value between two materials. Approximately 350 specialists in the field of brake and safety technology for motor vehicles meet once a year in order to exchange new knowledge. Since 1998, the µ-Club has given awards to persons for the outstanding achievements in their special areas of expertise.
In May 2004, Mercedes recalled 680,000 vehicles equipped with the system; in March 2005 a total of 1.3 million vehicles were recalled. Mercedes dropped the feature in higher volume models, such as the E-class. Lower luxury class volume models such as the SL, the Maybach and the SLR continued to use SBC.[2]
Other vehicles with electro-hydraulic brake systems:
- Toyota Estima Hybrid (Introduced in 2001 in Japan) - Ford Escape Hybrid (Introduced in 2003) - Toyota Prius II (Introduced in 2003 - uses an ehb system from Advics)

SBC Applications (model year)
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Back
Top Bottom