Stop expanding the ULEZ to all the London boroughs in 2023

[Alex225]

If we all drove EVs The greedy Mayor would have no money .. so another scheme would be introduced to tax them as well... whatever car you drive does not matter motorists are an easy target.... He is also forgetting the poor shift workers... Nurses , Policemen, Cleaners, who have to travel at all times of the day and night and there isn't always a convenient bus or train to take them to work... so they have no choice but to drive... I agree the emission goalposts will move... bigger net ... gets more fish.

It's a very good point, once we all move across to EVs and millions of perfectly usable cars get scrapped where does the income come from? Can't just let everyone drive round tax free, where will their revenue come from when less petrol is purchased? We'll get stung one way or another.

Like you say, shift workers will definitely suffer. My other half's ML isn't compliant, if she works a night shift she has to pay for two days as she'll travel on one date and come home the next. Potentially £24 each shift, means her first 90 minutes of work are purely to enable her to get there and back.

 

[poormansporsche]

A teacher friend of mine has recently had to give up her job to look after her disabled mother due to the extreme shortage of carer staff. Her mum lives just inside the current ulez zone where there are reasonable ok ish transport links. Now imagine the situation for minimum wage carers if the ulez is extended to places with absolutely f£ck all transport links. Good one that !

I recently started work driving for Ocado, in my intake of 12 people, 5 of then were former home carers !

 

[Harrythedog]

Exactly this. Imagine the conversation in Kahn’s office,

“Yuk, those diesels are disgusting, dirty and killing everybody but if the proles give us £12.50 we’ll look the other way”

I don’t think Citizen Kahn is bothered about the environmen. A flight to the States and an appearance in Paris for the CL final in the same week proves that

 

[Connoisseur]

Too easy to blame one person; children and elderly in London are being poisoned by car exhaust fumes which surely has to change? Strangely enough people in the UK refuse to respond to requests unless there is a financial penalty, so the charges will over time deliver the required change. If we go ev then the poisoning will stop. Plenty now available, many at reasonable cost compared to ICE cars. We’ve got one and will soon swap ICE for another, not particularly through choice, but because health matters to all of us. The same/similar charges are coming to other cities and areas , driven by Johnson’s Govt for the same health reasons, as well as at a local level.

So while we moan and complain, which I and many others have done at various times, instead why not take back control and get an ev. Fast, fun to drive and increasingly available at a range of price points, despite the UK Govt dropping all support, unlike in Aus, NZ, USA, Europe etc.

 

[Connoisseur]

even the military are seeing the future

RAF takes key step on path to Net Zero 2040 with electric aircraft trials | Royal Air Force

The RAF has been testing the feasibility of using electric aircraft for training functions as part of early steps towards a Net Zero air force by 2040 target.

www.raf.mod.uk

UK flight schools hire instructors for electric aircraft as fuel prices bite

Pilot schools are recruiting instructors to meet demand for more sustainable and cheaper training

www.theguardian.com

 

[st13phil]

children and elderly in London are being poisoned by car exhaust fumes

Emotive language, indeed. Stock in trade for the climate lobby.

The intriguing thing that is completely ignored is that much of the southeast of England's pollution is actually not "home grown" but a feature of the prevailing weather systems that cause pollution from far away places to concentrate over that particular part of our landmass.

And - like it or not - pollution in London is hugely less than it was in the 1950's and early 1960's, while traffic volumes have increased exponentially. Odd that (spoiler: it isn't really).

 

[Darrell]

I live on the outskirts of the Croydon borough, yet my address is Surrey but will fall under this ULEZ expansion. It's pretty farcical as there are literally no air quality issues in the area, it's suburban in places and green in others.

As said, it's ok if you pay your way out of it so then you can drive anything you want and b*llocks to the air quality. As we know, it's sheer money making to the detriment of the average person. The original ULEZ covers a relatively small area, as also said on here this covers some very normal areas, not necessarily wealthy places. People were coerced into diesel cars, many owners rightly or wrongly are still using them and many not in a position to shell out money on a newer car or even to change cars. Yet they'll have no choice.

My conspiracist head thinks that the combination of this charge, plus insane fuel prices is a fantastic way to change the entire culture toward ICE vehicles. Shame this doesn't feel like a manageable transition to EVs for many.

Same as my sister. She’s in Warlingham which is in Surrey but has a Croydon postcode, CR.

 

[sgregory124]

Fast, fun to drive and increasingly available at a range of price points

"Fast, fun to drive" - errr......you're partly right in that some EV's (by no means all) are 'Fast', from the line at least.

As for fun to drive - that really depends. If 'Fun' to you is accelerating with no noise, no gears, no emotion, no involvement and dragging around huge amounts of weight in batteries and thus compromising handling, then fill your boots. I've driven a couple of EV's and found the opposite - the Tesla P85D I drove was the single dullest experience i've ever had behind the wheel, its single redeeming feature being it had the equivalent of 750hp (approx) and 4WD, but still like the driving equivalent of watching paint dry.

I won't be changing to an EV until i'm forced to do so.

 

[Alex225]

Same as my sister. She’s in Warlingham which is in Surrey but has a Croydon postcode, CR.

She's about five minutes away from me then! Not far at all but certainly not even remotely 'city' like.

 

[Darrell]

She's about five minutes away from me then! Not far at all but certainly not even remotely 'city' like.

Not at all.
They’re in Westhall Rd.

 

[Alex225]

I can't say I know it but know the area, lovely area though and again not even remotely urban!

 

[ML350mgr]

Emotive language, indeed. Stock in trade for the climate lobby.

Exactly! We are all being poisoned but hardly anyone wears a mask to protect themselves from exhaust fumes!

Surely the Mayor could start asking people to wear a mask if he's really concerned. They made us do it in 2020, why not now? In the meantime he can start figuring out how to improve public transport in those areas where cars are the only way for people to get around etc. (who pays for that?). After he's provided reliable and frequent transport alternatives we'll talk.

 

[BaldGuy]

Removed.

 

[KillerHERTZ]

Keep personal political views out of this thread please. use the Politics thread for that.

 

[BaldGuy]

really!!!!

 

[ALFAitalia]

"Fast, fun to drive" - errr......you're partly right in that some EV's (by no means all) are 'Fast', from the line at least.

As for fun to drive - that really depends. If 'Fun' to you is accelerating with no noise, no gears, no emotion, no involvement and dragging around huge amounts of weight in batteries and thus compromising handling, then fill your boots. I've driven a couple of EV's and found the opposite - the Tesla P85D I drove was the single dullest experience i've ever had behind the wheel, its single redeeming feature being it had the equivalent of 750hp (approx) and 4WD, but still like the driving equivalent of watching paint dry.

I won't be changing to an EV until i'm forced to do so.

Quite.......As it stands now....you will NEVER be forced to.....but you might HAVE to for financial reasons. Only the sale of NEW ICE cars will be banned.....used cars can be bought and sold until they fall apart. They have said that current ICE cars will just be allowed to run until they are scrapped, fail the MOT, rust away etc..........whether you will be able to afford the fuel is another question (surely supply and demand should make petrol cheaper ....that might be wishful thinking!). I'll never drive an EV until I'm either flat broke through keeping an ICE car on the road or they prise the keys from my dead hands!!! Of course many people are not petrol heads at all and will quite happily run EVs....my wife could not care less what powers her car as long at its reliable and gets her from A to B.....so many will be going EV way before 2030....or as soon after that date that they need a new car..
As for the poster who said they are fun to drive.....we you must have not driven a lot of cars. Nothing fun about them (fast in a straight line is not fun.....many of the most fun cars I've driven where low powered....but light....Polo G40 anyone?). I'm lucky enough to have driven a few EVs......they are all as dull as ditch water with no character whatso ever (my opinion of course...YMMV).....and there's no getting over the ever present and handling ruining excess weight.

 

[Dickster]

Too easy to blame one person; children and elderly in London are being poisoned by car exhaust fumes which surely has to change? Strangely enough people in the UK refuse to respond to requests unless there is a financial penalty, so the charges will over time deliver the required change. If we go ev then the poisoning will stop. Plenty now available, many at reasonable cost compared to ICE cars. We’ve got one and will soon swap ICE for another, not particularly through choice, but because health matters to all of us. The same/similar charges are coming to other cities and areas , driven by Johnson’s Govt for the same health reasons, as well as at a local level.

So while we moan and complain, which I and many others have done at various times, instead why not take back control and get an ev. Fast, fun to drive and increasingly available at a range of price points, despite the UK Govt dropping all support, unlike in Aus, NZ, USA, Europe etc.

Total rubbish. The congestion charge has been around for years but hasn’t changed congestion - I know because I’ve been commuting into London from Kent on a motorcycle for over 30 years.

Imho pollution in London is limited to some hot spots. So the solution should be to deal with those areas. Perhaps ban lorries and deliveries during rush hour.

Edit

News - The Eco Experts

The latest news, analysis, guides and opinion.

www.theecoexperts.co.uk

Are there really loads of EVs for sale at comparable prices?

 

[ML350mgr]

Are there really loads of EVs for sale at comparable prices?

Probably not that many. If I did a like-for-like change, I'd need to buy an EQC. The cheapest on Autotrader is around £55k and its range will get worse as the battery degrades. I'd be happy to settle for half that money, buy a second hand GLC/GLE and invest the rest!

 

[MrGreedy]

A reminder I've mentioned before, in current battery tech there aren't enough of certain raw materials in the whole world to build enough batteries for EVs so that only the UK could have EVs. Things like cobalt. And that assumes that material is only used for EVs and no other applications. This is not and cannot be about a move to EVs, which only the relatively wealthy of the middle classes can realistically afford. The suggestion of just go and buy an EV is a bit naive for people struggling with their income and outgoings.

Quite simply, the ULEZ is a money generating scheme and is virtue signalling by Khan. Do as I say, not as I do.

 

[neilrr]

Buy £3,000 car to avoid ULEZ charge in outer London, Labour assembly member says

A Labour assembly member has suggested that people in outer London could buy a ULEZ-compliant car for £3,000 if they are concerned about paying the daily charge.

www.standard.co.uk