Stop expanding the ULEZ to all the London boroughs in 2023

[Blackbird1]

I've said this for years too

 

[ToeKnee]

But people are charged more the more they drive and polute, in that they put more fuel in and therefore pay more fuel duty and vat.

 

[Will]

But people are charged more the more they drive and polute, in that they put more fuel in and therefore pay more fuel duty and vat.

Yes, that’s my point.

Do away with the standing charge (VED) and increase the tax on fuel.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Until somebody realises that the pot is empty so they’ll say that EVs are bad for the health.

Sadiq's greenwashed tax is just his local way or raising money which will go into his vote buying pot.

It's nothing to do with pollution or traffic reduction, which could both be achieved simply by banning ICE vehicles at peak times in high congestion areas.

This is a tax on a granny driving a diesel two miles across Epsom downs to go to the shops, while the Amazon courier pays nothing to drive all day around Central London

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Yes, that’s my point.
Do away with the standing charge (VED) and increase the tax on fuel.

Agreed in general, but the next stage will be to realise that tyre particulates kill, especially from two tonne vehicles.

Which will widen local taxes to apply to all vehicles, including EV's

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

The real looming tax issue is what happens when the government realises that it's lost its fuel duty income to people charging mainly at home.

That's £25 billion a year, 2.5% of all tax revenues, 1% of GDP, or a grand per household

"A billion here, a billion there. And soon you're talking real money."

 

[Will]

Agreed in general, but the next stage will be to realise that tyre particulates kill, especially from two tonne vehicles.

Which will widen local taxes to apply to all vehicles, including EV's

Correct, but an increased tax on fuel (and no standing charge) would surely mean that then more fuel used on any given vehicle = more miles driven etc, and that would partly cover tyres as a result.

EVs are going to need some careful planning for the future though.

Increased tax coming on tyres soon…with new emissions labels depending on what they’re made of, and how well they last!

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Correct, but an increased tax on fuel (and no standing charge) would surely mean that then more fuel used on any given vehicle = more miles driven etc, and that would partly cover tyres as a result.

My point is that it's an excuse to tax EV's as well.

Through duties on energy supplied through chargers - beyond the VAT and business rates those sits will already be paying, and through increased taxation on domestic and commercial electricity.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

The easiest way to avoid taxation: follow the leadership of female GP's and junior doctors on income tax.

Faced with marginal income and NI tax rates of anywhere between 40 - 66%, they work less, typically 3 or 4 days a week now.

ULEZ and fuel taxes can be avoided by driving less and avoiding ULEZ areas. Don't drive to B&Q to buy some tools, as I was going to do earlier this week, get Amazon Prime to deliver them to you - for free. Tthe tools are cheaper and you don't pay fuel costs, and wear and tear.

My annual mileage has nearly halved from 18,000 in 2019, with no real difference in "quality of life."

 

[markjay]

...Increased tax coming on tyres soon…with new emissions labels depending on what they’re made of, and how well they last!

I would take an opposite approach.

I would exempt all automative safety items from VAT.

This includes tyres, shocks, lamps, bulbs, suspension components, brakes, seat belts, air bags, etc.

Too many cars are driven on our road with significant defects because owners delay repairing them due the high cost of parts and labour.

This could also apply to emission-control systems: DPFs, cats, AdBlue, etc.

 

[Will]

I would take an opposite approach.

I would exempt all automative safety items from VAT.

This includes tyres, shocks, lamps, bulbs, suspension components, brakes, seat belts, air bags, etc.

Too many cars are driven on our road with significant defects because owners delay repairing them due the high cost of parts and labour.

This could also apply to emission-control systems: DPFs, cats, AdBlue, etc.

This is all quite true.

So we charge on a pay-per-mile basis, let’s set some cameras up and ID the vehicles using ANPR

 

[TC350]

This is all quite true.

So we charge on a pay-per-mile basis, let’s set some cameras up and ID the vehicles using ANPR

If your suggestion to add tax to fuel and drop VED (which I agree with) is adopted, the tax on those items listed by markjay could also be transferred to fuel. This would negate the need for ANPR to detect ICE usage.

I don’t know how to deal with EVs use of roads and tyre pollution.

 

[markjay]

....I don’t know how to deal with EVs use of roads and tyre pollution.

ANPR-based road charging?

 

[horatio]

The easiest way to avoid taxation: ULEZ and fuel taxes can be avoided by driving less and avoiding ULEZ areas. Don't drive to B&Q to buy some tools, as I was going to do earlier this week, get Amazon Prime to deliver them to you - for free. Tthe tools are cheaper and you don't pay fuel costs, and wear and tear.

Does this not make you wonder who is lobbying for all these taxes?

Local businesses and high streets are going to have even tougher time competing with Amazon than B&Q.

 

[markjay]

Does this not make you wonder who is lobbying for all these taxes?

Local businesses and high streets are going to have even tougher time competing with Amazon than B&Q.

I'd have thought that tax on cars and/of fuel increases the delivery costs for online retailers? Although it has to be said that the Amazon delivery vans in London (and possibly elsewhere?) are 100% electric, have been for some time now.

 

[TC350]

ANPR-based road charging?

The problem is that it would take an inordinate amount of ANPR cameras to achieve sufficient coverage for equitable taxation. I can envisage EV drivers taking alternative and longer routes to avoid the cameras that will charge them.

 

[markjay]

The problem is that it would take an inordinate amount of ANPR cameras to achieve sufficient coverage for equitable taxation. I can envisage EV drivers taking alternative and longer routes to avoid the cameras that will charge them.

Well I didn't mean that only EVs should be taxed this way... all cars should, EVs included.

And yes I'm sure that there'll be a 'least-tax route' option on Waze.....

But I think that most people won't be able (or couldn't be bothered) to play 'dodge the cameras' and will just drive to their destination and pay the tax.

 

[TC350]

Does this not make you wonder who is lobbying for all these taxes?

Local businesses and high streets are going to have even tougher time competing with Amazon than B&Q.

I agree that the likes of Amazon make life difficult for local businesses and high streets. The businesses have to adapt and/or change direction to stay afloat. Instead of trying to compete they need to diversify - offer services that aren’t available online.

 

[TC350]

Well I didn't mean that only EVs should be taxed this way... all cars should, EVs included.

And yes I'm sure that there'll be a 'least-tax route' option on Waze.....

But I think that most people won't be able (or couldn't be bothered) to play 'dodge the cameras' and will just drive to their destination and pay the tax.

Countrywide implementation and administration costs would be horrendous, I suspect wiping out tax income for many years. Not that such drawbacks have necessarily stopped the introduction of similar projects in the past!

 

[horatio]

I agree that the likes of Amazon make life difficult for local businesses and high streets. The businesses have to adapt and/or change direction to stay afloat. Instead of trying to compete they need to diversify - offer services that aren’t available online.

A cinema, restaurant, caffe, baker or whatever does offers a real life experience that isn’t available behind a screen. If they close because the council plops a Homebase planter (LTN) in the road and their customers order Uber eats & watch Netflix instead that’s not a free market in action.

* Cinema not the best example of a service not behind a screen but you catch my drift!