What do you think good or bad

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by normanr, Sep 23, 2008.

  1. normanr

    normanr Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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  2. Shude

    Shude MB Club Veteran

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    It will only make money while people are stupid enough to speed past them. There is a simple way to hurt big brother: don't speed past speed cameras! They'll soon get bored..
     
  3. st4

    st4 Banned

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    It won't make a penny - no one will speed as there is no defeating an average speed trap. It will enforce the law very effectively for those who have taxed, insured, legitimate cars. For those who joy ride in stolen cars it won't do a thing.
     
  4. gina2201

    gina2201 Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    Reading the comments, (313 of them!):
     
  5. Dieselman

    Dieselman Banned

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    Which year is this from SPECS have been used in regular service for the last 10-15 years.
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    Monday 15th September

    They do only track single lanes, but how does one know ehich pair of cameras are paired together.;)
     
  6. AndyS

    AndyS Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    I wonder if people will fly past them - realise that they were well over the limit and so will pull over to the hard shoulder / kerbside to stop for 5 seconds and then pull off at normal speed to get the average speed right down..?
     
  7. st4

    st4 Banned

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    What if you straddle both lanes? or venture onto the hard shoulder :D
     
  8. verytalldave

    verytalldave Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    The UK is the most "spyed on" country in the world. Our current leaders are so paranoid over our behaviour that they seem to want to watch us from the moment we leave our homes to when we return.
    And if they can make a bit of money in doing so, then its all good for the coffers.
    If its anything like Red Kens Londons congestion charge, it will just about be self-financing if they are lucky.
    But to give an answer - BAD.
    Shude speaks wise words as usual.
     
  9. flango

    flango MB Club Veteran

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    Good old PH got it wrong again, specs have been in use on at least 2 motorways for over 18 months M25 & M4 monitoring regular traffic. I think the approval they are talking about is a network of specs cameras in a residential area that actually communicate with each other rather like a wifi net, then if you speed anywhere under that net from camera to camera you get caught. No problem with that speeding in residential areas is dangerous but is it dangerous on a clear motorway in good conditions? Lets hope at least they set the threshold quite high 10% + 3mph would do ?
     
  10. Sp!ke

    Sp!ke Administrator Staff Member

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    Doesnt effect motorbikes as they are all forward facing.

    In the car I find them very distracting in that for the duration monitored one has to really keep a close eye on ones speed in case you creep a couple of MPH over, so much so it detracts from reading your surroundings and the road ahead.

    I recently had to accelerate out of the way of someone joining the motorway without looking and then had to back right down to 20mph shortly afterwards in order to get my average down again. Not good.
     
  11. flango

    flango MB Club Veteran

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    Another example of this I just remembered they are also on M60 in Manchester, 2:30 am a few months ago fetching my missus back from Manchester airport, A Saab came hurtling past me at well over the ton straight into the specs area past the first camera, now this is on a stretch that starts on the Bredbury junction and then goes into a bad right hander where the second camera is situated about a mile and a quarter later. The driver realising what he had done has stopped in lane 1 so time elapsed and he did not get caught on the second camera, gave me quite a fright as I rounded the bend but saw him in time and moved over to lane 2. Specs on motorways all in the name of cash not safety these will only contribute to more accidents yet further clogging up the motorway network
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2008
  12. st4

    st4 Banned

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    And that will bother the government how?
     
  13. Dieselman

    Dieselman Banned

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    I always find it incredible that so many people who haven't experienced such devices have such strong opinions as to what problems they will cause.

    I regularly drive a city, and now county, that has had SPECS cameras in operation for 10-15 years and have never seen an accident or problem caused by them.
    People do indeed slow down to a general pace and conform without any issues.
    These cameras cover a wide area and various speed limits ranging from 30mph residential roads, 40 limits both single and double lanes and carriageways, to 60mph and 70mph dual carriageways.
    Undoubtedly they have reduced accidents on the more open roads, which used to be regularly closed as a result.
     
  14. st4

    st4 Banned

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    No but this one seems a bit iffy:

    Basically a plonker twigged he had breached the average speed and stopped to a virtual hault to bring the speed back

    We have them on a difficult stretch of road going down the Ayrshire coast, its mighty effective of enforcing the speed limit on what is a very dangerous road, and they are very clearly visible so act as a deterent.

    However motorcycles can easily defeat them so its a bit unfair on car drivers don't you think. Given that motorcyles have a higher accident rate I find that odd.

    We also have specs on area's with roadworks. People seem naturally more concious of their speed but I think cars crowd up too much and people don't leave a suitable distance. They haven't yet invented a camera that penalised tailgating.

    However I find the concept of camera's scattered all over our roads a little bit invasive, one thing a few Gatso's here and there for accident blackspots where excess speed triggers them, but aren't specs camera's constantly running like an ANPR one. This seems a bit too surveillence culture for me and very heavy handed.
     
  15. Dieselman

    Dieselman Banned

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    A good example. Once drivers are aware of them SPECS cameras do work at reducing speed.
    I think they are much more effective than Gatso/Truvello devices as they negate the requirement to suddenly brake due to surprise.
    Not if there is a regular speed trap round the bend....seen that done...it works a treat..:D
    Do they if the cameras are not there.?
    I appreciate your veiwpoint but don't agree with it, so sorry if I appear rude, but I'm trying to avoid that particular conversation.:)
     
  16. st4

    st4 Banned

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    Fair cop re the last point-its been done before but as the two view points are very well known on this forum there is no need to repeat them, but people should maybe consider the implications of them.

    A well placed speed trap to trap bikers would be more amusing and level the odds for us car users. Fairness for all and all that ;)

    With regard to the speed limits @ the road works example- I won't even argue that one as its very good @ enforcing the speed limit, so good it would render probably most of a traffic cops enforcement duties redundant.

    However I might add its a very different way of enforcing the limit, taking the emphasis away from the driver wanting to abide by the law but occassionally slipping up to bullying/nannying/intimidating/incentivising (take your pick BTW) to doing so. A very different approach

    There is undoubtably a safety aspect where I fear people may consider the speed they are doing too much in relation to whats going on around them. I did notice myself on the stretch of the A90 where there were specs camera's I seemed to be fixated on it, maybe @ expense of other observations.

    On the Ayr example it was fine, hitting an average of 60 would be quite a challenge, but it helped curb ones enthusiasm for the loud pedal when the road straightened out. I beleive SPECs has been very effective on the Ayrshire coast.

    I think in certain situations, SPECS will have safety advantages, I can think of several area's where I'd welcome it, but IMHO a sense of proportion is needed. Accident blackspot area's (A96 to Aberdeen would be a good candidate) are ideal for SPECS, quite stretches of MWAY- pointless. The answer lies between effectively using them, not just putting them everywhere.

    So yeah, lets see areas that have accident blackspots or are notorious for accidents/nearmisses/hazardous with SPEC's zones.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2008
  17. kjay

    kjay Hardcore MB Enthusiast

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    Why don't they just have done with it and make us all fit 70mph limiters to our cars.:mad: :mad:

    I'm off out for some spirited driving in the coupe - while I still can!!
    And, I'll be happily checking the surroudings for possible hazards, not looking at my speedo.;)

    .
     
  18. jaymanek

    jaymanek Authorised Forum Sponsor Authorised Forum Sponsor

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    I dont normally join in on these conversations but my view is this.

    I support cameras located in built up areas, i support them by schools and small roads, i support them when they are located in accident blackspots.

    I DONT support having them on big wide open motorways such as the M1 and I personally think the 70 mph limit on M roads is a huge mickey take.

    i think theres a point where it goes too far.. The odd gatso is fine... All this average speed stuff will simply lead to more fake plates, cars registered in incorrect names & addresses etc etc. there are plenty of ways around the system...

    if pushed too far, more and more people will cheat the system.
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2008
  19. flango

    flango MB Club Veteran

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    I agree it won't bother them one little bit, they couldn't care less
     
  20. flango

    flango MB Club Veteran

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    I know the ones on the A77 well as I used to live in Prestwick and remember the road before they put them on, more deaths near Girvan than enough incredibly dangerous road. I've not seen the stats since they put them on but I bet it's improved things. My concern is their deployment on Motorways. Would be interesting to see the M4, M25 and M60 accident stats where these cameras have been in operation
     
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