What on earth?

[MrRight]

.....if I was involved in many incidents, I'd be wondering about my own behaviour on the road.......and perhaps not blaming others

Agreed in principal but 3 incidents for a hardcore cyclist who cycled a few thousand miles, of which a fair amount of time was spent commuting in greater london, where I'm afraid the habits of some motorists tends to be a bit iffy. one accident involved an old lady who didnt check the road was clear and drove straight into him out of the junction. The other was a bunch of youngsters , some with beer cans in hand that decided to target him just for kicks.
The third was a vehicle suddenly going into a left lane to get past stationary traffic without seemingly looking into the left lane they were turning into, so I'm quite comfortable here that he wasnt the cause , given on two incidents, the at fault individual was found to be the car driver. The youngsters obviously got away and didnt admit any liability

 

[c63chris]

it is simply unacceptable for that sort of behaviour. random idiots have driven my brother while cycling off the road out of spite, and he has had a couple of people actually not see him coming out of junctions and hit him causing him to fall off his bike and end up in hospital once as a result.

I have the opposite problem and it is driving me nuts if I'm in the m3. the exhaust is really loud and my rule of thumb is never to overtake a cyclist unless I can leave a minimum 1 metre width gap between the handle of their bike and the car , preferably overtake while driving completely in the oncoming lane. the big problem with that is I have to accelerate faster to get past in good time to prevent any braking action from the oncoming cars up ahead , in this car it means driving in gear 1 or 2 and revving reasonably high and then feeling a bit embarrassed after the car makes a huge racket. i dont want to be in too high a gear as the smg takes a while to shift down which is potentially risky ! I dont have the problem in the merc at all which can handle higher gears and makes far less noise. I never ride a bike on the road so I dont know how much that is likely to annoy cyclists, it certainly isnt my intention to do so, but unless it freaks them out , I assume it is the lesser of two evils , the latter of which is leave a narrower gap of say a foot but accelerate slower. Any cyclists on here care to chime in?

I cycle a lot and the biggest risk I see is cars coming too close. They literally try to push past. You can hear the car behind you so personally speed or noise not an issue. They did an exercise, the police, recently to enforce the 1.5m you’re supposed to leave using a plain clothes officer and camera. It’s the usual thing some give you room but majority don’t.

 

[MrRight]

I cycle a lot and the biggest risk I see is cars coming too close. They literally try to push past. You can hear the car behind you so personally speed or noise not an issue. They did an exercise, the police, recently to enforce the 1.5m you’re supposed to leave using a plain clothes officer and camera. It’s the usual thing some give you room but majority don’t.

really good to hear your view on this. far too often do i see the car ahead barely leaving a 1 foot gap, not allowing any room for the cyclists. I could never risk that , what if there is a pot hole or debris on the road and the cyclist has to avoid it at v short notice for example. sometimes I wait so long behind a cyclist if the visibility ahead is poor such that the cyclist himself ushers me past !

 

[Bellow]

Choose from the following:
Leave the cyclist a gap larger than exists between oncoming traffic - expect delays.
Leave a lesser gap, expect the cyclist to be aware of anything in their immediate path - and expect the motorist to be less fearful and actually pass the cyclist (and without leaving said cyclist with a lung full of soot).

 

[190]

They did an exercise, the police, recently to enforce the 1.5m you’re supposed to leave using a plain clothes officer and camera. It’s the usual thing some give you room but majority don’t.

Then there are some timid/dozy drivers that won't pass a cyclist unless they can leave at least 2.5m causing an inevitable queue behind them, usually with me in it. I've been known to occasionally utter "oh for gods sake just get past the bl....y thing" Legislation is not always helpful.

From a cyclist point of view what do you feel is a safe gap. I assume it's speed dependent as many cyclists have no problem passing cars with less than a 1.5m gap.

 

[c63chris]

Then there are some timid/dozy drivers that won't pass a cyclist unless they can leave at least 2.5m causing an inevitable queue behind them, usually with me in it. I've been known to occasionally utter "oh for gods sake just get past the bl....y thing" Legislation is not always helpful.

From a cyclist point of view what do you feel is a safe gap. I assume it's speed dependent as many cyclists have no problem passing cars with less than a 1.5m gap.

1.5m is a safe gap. The problem with this is there are the same arguments trotted out whenever “cyclists” are discussed. The reason for the gap is safety. Pot holes. Sunken drains. Pedestrians walking into the road. Debris. Most of which car drivers can’t see as it’s their off side.

Cyclists and motorcycles, yes I commit this sin too, have the same problem when filtering in. Filtering in is when you pass slow/stationary traffic. To some drivers this is an affront to them. It is allowed and encouraged under the Highway Code. The big difference is you can see the road ahead and judge if you can pass.

 

[Bellow]

Then there are some timid/dozy drivers that won't pass a cyclist unless they can leave at least 2.5m causing an inevitable queue behind them, usually with me in it. I've been known to occasionally utter "oh for gods sake just get past the bl....y thing" Legislation is not always helpful.

There is a huge swathe of 'drivers' out there that have zero comprehension when it comes to the width of what they are driving - witness them 'passing' parked cars.

From a cyclist point of view what do you feel is a safe gap. I assume it's speed dependent as many cyclists have no problem passing cars with less than a 1.5m gap.

I'll settle for non contact. I wave them past and still they take forever, slowing to my speed then accelerating away leaving a plume of black smoke with me. I've been known to occasionally utter "oh for gods sake, it's a bicycle I have - not leprosy" .

 

[Bellow]

1.5m is a safe gap. The problem with this is there are the same arguments trotted out whenever “cyclists” are discussed. The reason for the gap is safety. Pot holes. Sunken drains. Pedestrians walking into the road. Debris. Most of which car drivers can’t see as it’s their off side.

Fair point and it is as you find it. For me, cycling in a rural setting none of that really applies but the car driving is still rubbish. Perhaps that is why I can be more permissive re gaps - and if I were confronted with a pot hole, I'll just take it on the chin if there's no room to pass and slow instead.

 

[c63chris]

Fair point and it is as you find it. For me, cycling in a rural setting none of that really applies but the car driving is still rubbish. Perhaps that is why I can be more permissive re gaps - and if I were confronted with a pot hole, I'll just take it on the chin if there's no room to pass and slow instead.

Maybe the roads are better where you are but in Surrey/Sussex the country roads have terrible pot holes and you need to come right over at times. Slowing not really work either unless you mean stop as there’s invariably another car behind and if one goes they all go. We’ve all end up with punctures from being forced through pot holes and some friends have come off their bikes as a result.

 

[219]

Then there are some timid/dozy drivers that won't pass a cyclist unless they can leave at least 2.5m causing an inevitable queue behind them, usually with me in it. I've been known to occasionally utter "oh for gods sake just get past the bl....y thing" Legislation is not always helpful.

From a cyclist point of view what do you feel is a safe gap. I assume it's speed dependent as many cyclists have no problem passing cars with less than a 1.5m gap.

I encountered such a driver yesterday, a lone cyclist doing between 20 and 30 depending on gradient, quiet A road , I came up behind this Range Rover driven by a female who was following a few feet behind the cycle . Three , maybe four times there were clear stretches with no oncoming traffic where she could have easily passed him ; I held back expecting her to do so , but she just sat there . I decided I’d been patient enough so , following a right hand bend with a clear view down a 200yd straight I moved out , gave a ‘toot’ to let her know I was coming through ... and on came her trafficator as she pulled out forcing me to brake ; I blasted my horn loudly to wake her up , but even though she had the full width of the road available, she still scraped by leaving the cyclist less than 1m ; once she pulled in I got past both of them ( using the full width of the road ) and I saw her recede in my mirror , not going much faster than the cycle , on a NSL A road .

 

[219]

1.5m is a safe gap. The problem with this is there are the same arguments trotted out whenever “cyclists” are discussed. The reason for the gap is safety. Pot holes. Sunken drains. Pedestrians walking into the road. Debris. Most of which car drivers can’t see as it’s their off side.

Cyclists and motorcycles, yes I commit this sin too, have the same problem when filtering in. Filtering in is when you pass slow/stationary traffic. To some drivers this is an affront to them. It is allowed and encouraged under the Highway Code. The big difference is you can see the road ahead and judge if you can pass.

Filtering is just a warm , touchy-feely word for overtaking , something that is at best not specifically unlawful, but certainly not encouraged ; you won’t see police riders doing it unless on their way to a call .

As with all overtaking , there should be a clear view past the vehicles to be overtaken ( can you be sure they aren’t going to change course , could there be a hidden child crossing between them ) do you have a clear lane to pass them in ( making another lane with inches to spare is not acceptable, nor do you want to become ‘the meat in the sandwich ‘ should the gap close up ) and do you have a clearly sighted ‘landing zone’ into which you can return without interfering with anyone ? Running down the outside of traffic queuing for a red light and forcing your way in in front of the lead car by crossing the stop line against the signal is not only illegal , it’s downright rude .

I have well over 150,000 miles under my belt as an ex motorcyclist , and I never needed to indulge in that practice.

 

[PXW]

Lots of comments on here I can identify with, on both sides of the argument. As always it seems the minority damage the reputation of the majority. I’ve little time for the helmet cam warriors who can sometimes seem more interested in catching other people out than in completing their journey, and there seem to be increasing incidents of cyclists touching/banging vehicles as they pass - I really don’t get that, and it’s hard to imagine anything better to wind up a motorist! On the other hand I find myself wincing at how close many motorists get when passing cyclists. It really is OK to slow down behind a cyclist if you can’t safely pass, and it really could be some distance before a safe opportunity presents itself.

But whenever this topic comes up I find myself thinking back fondly to an incident some years ago when I was driving home from work. Mid evening, nice weather and going through the villages from the M4 through Eversley towards home. I was in a line of cars following a solitary cyclist. Must have been about six of us but with no chance to pass. The cyclist was working really hard but was going slower and slower up a hill. When he eventually got to the top a crawling baby would have outpaced him. It was actually quite funny and I think his personal CO2 output was probably greater than that of any of the cars following him!

 

[c63chris]

Filtering is just a warm , touchy-feely word for overtaking , something that is at best not specifically unlawful, but certainly not encouraged ; you won’t see police riders doing it unless on their way to a call .

As with all overtaking , there should be a clear view past the vehicles to be overtaken ( can you be sure they aren’t going to change course , could there be a hidden child crossing between them ) do you have a clear lane to pass them in ( making another lane with inches to spare is not acceptable, nor do you want to become ‘the meat in the sandwich ‘ should the gap close up ) and do you have a clearly sighted ‘landing zone’ into which you can return without interfering with anyone ? Running down the outside of traffic queuing for a red light and forcing your way in in front of the lead car by crossing the stop line against the signal is not only illegal , it’s downright rude .

I have well over 150,000 miles under my belt as an ex motorcyclist , and I never needed to indulge in that practice.

Really not sure what you are getting at here? Maybe things are different in Scotland but down here I can assure you that “filtering” is taught at motorcycle schools. Have just done a refresher course myself and sounds like you could benefit. Also the police riders here regularly filter to the front of stationary traffic and very often there is a marked area at the front by the lights for that very purpose.

 

[Scott_F]

We are sometimes guilty of building problems into our road network.

A few miles from me is a major arterial road heading into town which has three lanes. Lanes two and three are for general traffic whilst lane one has been a bus lane for years (big white lines, road surface painted a different colour, cameras watching etc.). The idea is that generally, but especially during peak periods, buses can progress unhindered by the heavy traffic in the other two lanes.

However, this is the UK and although we want to be oh-so-green we have to do it on the cheap so lane one is also a cycle lane.

Consequently, it isn't uncommon for a bus, unable to easily pull into a crowded lane two, to crawl along the bus lane at 10mph behind a lone cyclist whilst pumping out fumes and losing all of the advantages that a dedicated bus lane was supposed to offer. An aware cyclist may wait for a section of dropped kerb and dart up onto the pavement to allow the bus to accelerate away but there is no guarantee of this and they risk a penalty for riding on the pavement.

In countries such as the Netherlands and Denmark, cycle lanes are thoughtfully designed and properly constructed but over here the authorities are often guilty of crowing about their environmental credentials ("oooh look at us - we've built x miles of lovely new cycle lanes") but failing to do things as they should be done and doing nothing to encourage safe cycling that doesn't hinder other road users.

 

[SW18]

Not being a regular driver of country roads, I’m surprised to read of the behaviour of some riders (oblivious 2-3 abreast, etc) and the cluelessness of some drivers described above. But I probably shouldn't be surprised.

I urban cycle often and do wonder these days if the biggest menace is the ‘road warrior’ cyclists. It’s my observation that a fair proportion of altercations with motorists are at least to some extent brought on by the militancy of the cyclist involved. I’ve started to think of them as YAMILs (Young Angry Man In Lycra); they seem to set out on their journeys accompanied by a surge of adrenaline and actively look for confrontation that they can use to let off some steam. Recent examples were a cyclist in front of me who launched a torrent of sweary abuse at a bus driver who he perceived had cut him up. My view from 30 feet behind was that the bus driver did nothing odd, there was a van clearly visible ahead parked half on the kerb and the bus pulled out carefully using indicators. The cyclist would have seen it all coming if he hadn’t been cycling 2 feet from the back bumper of the bus, no doubt hidden from the driver’s mirrors. Another one was the cyclist yelling at a driver for not seeing him - seemingly not realising that it was virtually dark and he was unlit, wearing all black clothes. There are many more examples. I reckon that if motor vehicle drivers behaved like them there would be carnage and uproar, so it’s no wonder there’s an anti-cyclist sentiment. It’s a shame the minority taint the perception of the majority.

 

[219]

Really not sure what you are getting at here? Maybe things are different in Scotland but down here I can assure you that “filtering” is taught at motorcycle schools. Have just done a refresher course myself and sounds like you could benefit. Also the police riders here regularly filter to the front of stationary traffic and very often there is a marked area at the front by the lights for that very purpose.

I don’t drive bikes any more , and no plans to do so these days .

Wasn’t taught in the Edinburgh Motorcycle Training Scheme , nor by the police advanced riders , nor is it in my copy of Motorcycle Roadcraft . But then I know anecdotally that a lot of these ‘schools’ encourage students to exceed speed limits too , so clearly a lot of what they teach isn’t ‘right’ . And I can say that having done the Traffic Patrol Officer and Potential Instructor ( advanced driving ) courses at Tulliallan in the early 80’s , before going on to train assessors for IAM and LSD ( later RoSPA ) , and still current as an emergency response driver with the Fire Service .

Police riders almost always ride two abreast , taking up the same space as a car , as I said above unless needing to get through traffic for an emergency , and they wait in queues , just like cars .

While a careful and experienced rider might be able to make safe and cautious progress in some circumstances, many/most riders do not possess the skill and judgement to do so safely and for this reason I do not favour it .

 

[219]

Really not sure what you are getting at here? Maybe things are different in Scotland but down here I can assure you that “filtering” is taught at motorcycle schools. Have just done a refresher course myself and sounds like you could benefit. Also the police riders here regularly filter to the front of stationary traffic and very often there is a marked area at the front by the lights for that very purpose.

Oh , and the only advanced stop boxes we have here are for pedal cycles , not motor cycles , being as it is that they are linked to from the cycle lane on the left and only cycles have the exemption to bypass the motor vehicles stop line .

 

[E55BOF]

Meanwhile, in the real world down here in the crowded South, motorcyclists will regularly filter to the head of traffic queues at lights, if necessary pulling in a little at the head of the queue so that a) the driver of the first car can be in no doubt of your intentions, and b) when the lights change you will be away and gone. Rude? No, just sensible. Getting through the traffic is the point of using a bike to commute on, really...

 

[Deleted member 126251]

........ as YAMILs (Young Angry Man In Lycra); they seem to set out on their journeys accompanied by a surge of adrenaline and actively look for confrontation that they can use to let off some steam. .....

Too many VOMITS as well (Vile Old Men In Tights) ......old farts trying to show off ....

I personally avoid any cafe, restaurant or coffee shop that is cyclist friendly - after living in Oz where they are like a virus that arrives in packs, stinking up the establishments with their sweaty bodies and making a racket with their cleats and big mouths (so used to shouting to one another on the road).

I cannot think of a more selfish, self entitled, militant and obnoxious group of sports people.

 

[c63chris]

Too many VOMITS as well (Vile Old Men In Tights) ......old farts trying to show off ....

I personally avoid any cafe, restaurant or coffee shop that is cyclist friendly - after living in Oz where they are like a virus that arrives in packs, stinking up the establishments with their sweaty bodies and making a racket with their cleats and big mouths (so used to shouting to one another on the road).

I cannot think of a more selfish, self entitled, militant and obnoxious group of sports people.

LOL trolltastic