Whats the difference between the TDs and CDIs?

[NicDale]

Hi there, i'm looking at E Class' at the moment and i'm totally unsure of the difference between the earlier E300 TD's and the later E320 CDIs. I intend to use it to tow my mk1 golf to hillclimbs and sprints as well as a daily car for her and i've a couple of questions:

Are the CDI's worth the premium? Which is more reliable? Are the E220 CDI's a bit gutless?

If anyone can enlighten me it would be great!

Thanks in advance,

Nic

 

[Dieselman]

A TD engine is the indirect engine using a pre-chamber for combustion, a CDi is direct injection.

The main advantages for CDi are increased low down torque and better fuel economy, the disadvantage is reliability isn't as good by some margin.

On a TD engine you would be unlikely to suffer any major failure including the injection system or turbo, whereas on a CDi the chance of injector failure is much higher as is pump leakage or failure, turbos are not as durable and the intake resonance flaps can wear or jam.

A 220Cdi E class would be a bit gutless for towing.

 

[recycled]

and one uses common rail direct injection technology cdi while the TDi is direct injection.
Now though the latest audi and the new VW tiguan are using common rails but are still called tdi.

Always avoid the sdi [saugdiesel] though as they are normally aspirated and are rubbish.


Common rail direct fuel injection. It features a high-pressurefuel rail feeding individual valves, as opposed to low-pressure fuel pump feeding pump nozzles or high-pressure fuel line to mechanical valves controlled by cams on the camshaft

Tdi engine uses direct injection where a fuel injector sprays directly into the engine cylinder rather than the pre-combustion chamber prevalent in older diesels which used indirect injection

 

[NicDale]

Thanks, 300TD seems to be the more sensible choice then.

Thanks again,

Nic

 

[recycled]

The 300td is an indirect system i tihink. about 123bhp depending on year

 

[Dieselman]

177Bhp, 295 Lb torque from 1600-3600 Rpm, all years in the W210 body.

Normally aspirated multivalve is 136Bhp in W210 and late W124.

 

[recycled]

w210 body 136 or 177?

 

[Dieselman]

All Turbos are 177Bhp and are only available in W210 body.

The normally aspirated 24V engine is available in late W124 and early W210 bodies and pushes 136Bhp.

Sorry for not making my prevoius post read more clearly.

 

[bolide]

Have a look at the torque figures - they'll tell a tale

I'd think a 220 CDi would be fine and it's a newer, snappier engine than the old 300 turbodiesel. The old 606 engine has a good reliability reputation but watch for failed glowplugs as they like to snap when you try and remove them

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[bolide]

The normally aspirated 24V engine is available in late W124 and early W210 bodies and pushes 136Bhp

And, just to add more complication, this engine (606) is also available only in the W210 in a turbo version

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[recycled]

in order word, diesels without turbos are pretty much rubbish.
A normally aspirated 3.0l 24v petrol will push out way more than 136brake. even in the early 90's

Now please wait while i take cover

 

[Dieselman]

Now please wait while i take cover

You need to....


Talk about torque...

 

[glojo]

Hi there, i'm looking at E Class' at the moment and i'm totally unsure of the difference between the earlier E300 TD's and the later E320 CDIs. I intend to use it to tow my mk1 golf to hillclimbs and sprints as well as a daily car for her and i've a couple of questions:

Are the CDI's worth the premium? Which is more reliable? Are the E220 CDI's a bit gutless?

If anyone can enlighten me it would be great!

Thanks in advance,

Nic

Hi Nic
You first talk about the 320CDI and then go back to the 220CDi? It would be totally unfair to compare a 300TD to the 320CDI as they are different generations of technology. The 320 will go like a scalded cat when compared to the 300 and to put things in perspective, the E-class 320CDI is comparable in performance to the exact equivalent E-class 320 petrol engine. There might be a tenth of a second or so in performance figures and maybe the odd one or two miles per hour top end speed, but in reality the diesel is by far the better engine and has a very good reputation. The Police in some constabularies are using these vehicles in a response role and keeping them for sometimes as long as 300,000 miles with just main dealer servicing. I would suggest that you try to have a demonstration of this excellent engine before making any decision.

Be warned though the early 320CDI era vehicle's are prone to very bad bodywork corrosion as are all the other petrol and diesel powered Mercedes of this era.

Good luck
John

 

[recycled]

, but in reality the diesel is by far the better engine .

John

I very much doubt that.

 

[glojo]

I very much doubt that.

Don't leave us dangling,

Why

Official figures for the 1999 two 320's in the estate car

Total mpg
Petrol 26.7mpg and 0-62.5mph in 8.7sec
Diesel 35.8mpg and 0 - 62.5mph in 8.8sec

Cost new
Petrol £34,390 Top speed 143mph
Diesel £32,840 141mph

Maximum torque
Petrol 270
Diesel 470

As you can see the diesel powered estate car is over £1000 cheaper than the petrol. Compare the two vehicles now! The market speaks

John

 

[recycled]

I have not known mercedes to sell a better product cheaper
do not know about your figures but from the w210 era
jan 2000
i have torque
347 for diesel and 232 for petrol
speed 143- 147 for petrol
doubt if you can get 470 from a 320 cdi. the prop shaft would complain

any guesses for no diesel amg cars yet?

can you compare now?
There are no 320 petrols anymore
but you can compare 280 with the 320cdi though for marketing reasons they are not the same

 

[television]

I drove a 300TDT 124 in Sweden that was a nice car, and the performance was very good

 

[bolide]

I drove a 300TDT 124 in Sweden that was a nice car, and the performance was very good

Left-hooker only, unfortunately, for us in the UK

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[Dieselman]

I suspect that's a W124 TDT so only 136BHp. The W210 is significantly quicker.

I'm a little bemused by Glojo's comments of the 300Turbo being slow. The saloon pulls 0-62 in 8.5s and runs round to 137mph.
The 320 Cdi is about 8s and 145mph.

It takes more work to extract the performance as it happens higher up the rev band but when on song it can move pretty well for a barge.

This is the earlier 197Bhp 320Cdi not the newer 204/220Bhp version.

 

[Dieselman]

I have not known mercedes to sell a better product cheaper
do not know about your figures but from the w210 era
jan 2000
i have torque
347 for diesel and 232 for petrol
speed 143- 147 for petrol
doubt if you can get 470 from a 320 cdi. the prop shaft would complain

any guesses for no diesel amg cars yet?

can you compare now?
There are no 320 petrols anymore

Johns torque figures were in Nm..

And there was an AMG diesel SportCoupe C30..