3D modelling

[W210 Fan]

Does anybody how how to model in 3D, I can use solidworks but it is not very good at modelling bodywork and a friend has asked me to design him a rally puma for use in a french series, to start with I need a space envelope to work within,

has anybody modelled one before?

does anybody know if you can get the data out of a game and save it as an IGES or more CAD based format?

any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks

 

[glojo]

Does anybody how how to model in 3D, I can use solidworks but it is not very good at modelling bodywork and a friend has asked me to design him a rally puma for use in a french series, to start with I need a space envelope to work within,

has anybody modelled one before?

does anybody know if you can get the data out of a game and save it as an IGES or more CAD based format?

any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks

Give Andy_K a pm

Regards
John

 

[stats007]

To do it properly you want something like Maya or 3DS Max - though any 3D modelling package such as Autocad or similar would be possible.

Do you know what format you need the model file to be in?

Game data is normally seperated into custom geometry and texture/shader information and will more than likely be in a binary format that is of no use.

 

[andy_k]

did someone call?

Modelling ford cars is a bit of a no no unless you have a licence - they will come down on individual modellers like a ton of bricks.

I've had a threat of legal action from them in the past which would have cost me many thousands to contest because I built an unlicenced model of a Capri for a game. I for one won't be bothering to cross swords with them again

They are incredibly strict about protecting their name and image in cyberspace. Look on TurboSquid and you won't find any Ford (or Volkswagen) models on there due to these threats.

To get the model licenced (which is possible) you'll have to go to Ford directly and tell them what you intend to use it for before laying out money building the model

To add to my comments, there are several ways of extracting data from games but you are on really dodgy ground. If you extract someone elses car model from a game and use it you are contravening lots of people's copyrights. Ford, the original modeller, the game company who will have optimised the mesh for their game engine, the game's distributor, publisher etc etc will all be queueing up for a slice of you

sorry I realise it's not much help but that's about as much as I can offer at this stage

Andy

 

[stats007]

You can build models so long as they don't have a commercial application, so if it's for 'home' use then I wouldn't worry about it.

Forza allows you to add any graphics you like to it's licensed models - trademarks in this case don't apply.

The reason the Gran Turismo series doesn't have any damage or deformation is because a lot of manufacturers won't let you represent their cars in anything other than perfect condition.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

So is he asking you to design a real car for him to race in a real race series?

If so, why does he want it modelled?

 

[andy_k]

define "home use" though....

If I build a model of a Ford and display the final render on my (or any other web site) it ceases to be for home use - Ford could quite reasonably argue that I am using their copyright and brand illegally to advertise my own business - they did use that argument with me as part of their collection of threats but in a lot more complex terms.

Also, the original poster specified this model was for use in a series in France - I assumed (rightly or wrongly) this was a commercial project and that would include using the images to go around gathering sponsorship or team advertising if it were for a real racing team.


I'm guessing that all the models in Forza are licenced and you are allowed to tweak the graphics - at the end of the day that's slightly different to what I came up against. A rough analogy would be, in the "real world" I could buy a Ford and paint it any colour I liked but i couldn't build a car and legally call it a Ford

andy

 

[stats007]

Home use is just that - to play in a game at home.

I'm with you though - it's a bit of a non-starter.

 

[W210 Fan]

The car will be racing in a french series if we ever get the money together, playing with CAD in the evening costs nothing and we can do some rough costing once we have the engineering model layed out. The reason for CAD modelling before building is that we can lay everything out without cutting metal and then I can do all the stress analysis on the chassis on the PC without building one and crashing it in real life,

At the end of the day the car will not be branded a ford all the other cars are based on other road cars body wise but are called whatever the builder wants to call them,

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

playing with CAD in the evening costs nothing and we can do some rough costing once we have the engineering model layed out. The reason for CAD modelling before building is that we can lay everything out without cutting metal and then I can do all the stress analysis on the chassis on the PC without building one and crashing it in real life

Sounds like serious stuff.

 

[W210 Fan]

thanks bobby, its what I do at work so its a busmans holiday

 

[andy_k]

your requirements have just got a whole lot more complex - to build a model that could be used in those conditions would require a stack of data - as far as I can tell, that's going to be a lot more demanding than just building something that looks right.

Please correct me if I'm missing something

Andy

 

[stats007]

You can get the majority of the data from the manufacturer, brochures etc - or various websites.

 

[W210 Fan]

Andy - its what I do at work everyday, been designing squaddie proof vehicles, aerospace stuff and race winning cars since the late 90`s, I have lots of crash data from stuff I have tested and lots of textbooks, the really difficult part is designing in all the handling attributes I want without the luxury of cash for NRE (Non Recuring Engineering - testing) I have to hit the ground running with no roll oversteer or bad bump steer and what have you,

http://www.marktheengineer.com/CHASSIS.htm

this is what I have done so far, the important bit is the squidgy human at the controls hence the safety cell to stop me dying if it crashes, notice a lot of the tubes end where others do to spread the force around, to load the page you may need to install a small add in but then you have 3d capability to spin it round etc, the engine will be a semi stressed member and the back end is not finished which is why there is not many tubes there yet......

 

[SEM]

Hi

There are some good sites on how to make your 3D car but it can be very time consuming. I've modelled some Concepts cars for the exhibition stands. I've never had any comback from any of the companies involved, especially if they want to see their "product" on show.

Take a look for Car Blueprints like this one http://www.suurland.com/

 

[andy_k]

agreed with what SEM says, yes it's time consuming.

If you just need it to align your chassis can't you work on orthographic views and use background pictures?

You complicated the matter (and immediately ruled me out) by asking for a Ford, virtually every other make of car model can be bought on the internet

Good luck

Andy

 

[andy_k]

I meant to add have a look around here

http://forum.racesimcentral.com/

maybe someone will have a low poly version which will be of some use to you

Andy

 

[SEM]

No Ford Pumas anywhere on the net in any 3D form.
Cant you buy a Focus instead?

There is a low poly model in Colin Mcrae 2 rally game. I've done this once and the models are poor but the skins are ok

 

[W210 Fan]

this muppet I know (I say that I actually hold him in high regard) wants a Puma, I have got some pictures from the owners manual which gives you side, top and front elevation, then traced round the lines and scaled it up, how to create a car body in 3 easy commands!!! it will do as a space model right now, I dont even know right now if I can package all the tranmission, cooling packs etc I want yet so lets see what fits where

 

[stats007]

From what I can tell the body is the easy part in your project. I can't see you're going to be able to design much else from theory without some form of iterative simulation - or by trial and error.

There are a couple of good books you can buy:

Fundamentals of Vehicle Dynamics
Race Car Vehicle Dynamics

Good Luck!