• The Forums are now open to new registrations, adverts are also being de-tuned.

A160 - Dirty Dipstick Test

Hi BlackT55AMG,
As a lay person when I saw those pictgures my first thoughts were the oil had overheated, especially as it is claimed the car is serviced at an authorised "agent"

Would the issues you have highlighted cause the oil to overheat to such a degree as would cause this staining? Yuk!!

Regards
John
 
Hello BlackC55,

Thanks for that information. It looks like you have access to some serious info sources; although I am not sure if this particular topic is relevant to my problem.

What you could perhaps assist with is in trying to find out how the engine ventilation system is supposed to work on the A160.

The A160 seems to have 2 breather systems; one from sump to inlet manifold and also one from tappet cover to air inlet pipe just upstream of the throttle housing.

Now, I can understand that the sump breather draws air OUT of the sump and into the inlet manifold via a fixed orifice. What I want to know is what the larger tappet cover breather does: Does it let filtered air INTO the tappet cover to flush the engine, or does it allow blow-by gases OUT into the air intake?

Regards....
 
Hi Glojo,

We also thought that perhaps in some distant past the engine had overheated; however on fully stripping the engine and studying it carefully I noted the following:

1. No local 'hotspots' indicated by different shades of colour in the metal,

2. No evidence of having been stripped and the head gasket was in good nick - left no mess behind on either of the metal surfaces.

I have arranged for an independent vehicle expert to come around and measure up the whole engine to discount any possibility that the 'knock' was from a worn component (remember, I am theorising that it was a hydraulic tappet that failed due to extremely poor oil). He will also closely examine as an 'expert witness' on my behalf. We will see what he has to say.

I will also weigh the 2 breather hoses and compare them to the weight of a new one to see how much rubber has been lost. (the new hose is rigid whilst mine are flaccid).

So..... Dare I ask....? Any stained dipsticks out there to report??
 
amliddle said:
Hello BlackC55,

Thanks for that information. It looks like you have access to some serious info sources; although I am not sure if this particular topic is relevant to my problem.

What you could perhaps assist with is in trying to find out how the engine ventilation system is supposed to work on the A160.

The A160 seems to have 2 breather systems; one from sump to inlet manifold and also one from tappet cover to air inlet pipe just upstream of the throttle housing.

Now, I can understand that the sump breather draws air OUT of the sump and into the inlet manifold via a fixed orifice. What I want to know is what the larger tappet cover breather does: Does it let filtered air INTO the tappet cover to flush the engine, or does it allow blow-by gases OUT into the air intake?

Regards....
Click to expand...

I doubt you will be able to find out this information. I doubt even WIS will tell you.
 
Hi BlackC55,

Thanks. I have WIS.... is that where you got that information you have just posted from?? I find WIS and real problem to operate! The manual for the manual is nearly 200 pages long!!!

Cheers..
 
Hi Malcolm,

You say that the car does not have an engine oil dipstick?? Well, I suppose that would solve the stained dipstick problem!
 
BlackC55,

I forgot to mention.... I can't access your .jpgs in your posting - it sends me to a log on site.....

Alan
 
amliddle said:
Hi Malcolm,

You say that the car does not have an engine oil dipstick?? Well, I suppose that would solve the stained dipstick problem!
Click to expand...

Many cars from the start of the computer reading levels one do not have a stick, and that is the one thing that I hate, I have always been able to see the colour and condition of the oil, I do not know if they are on the way back,, Black C55 would know
 
amliddle said:
What you could perhaps assist with is in trying to find out how the engine ventilation system is supposed to work on the A160.

The A160 seems to have 2 breather systems; one from sump to inlet manifold and also one from tappet cover to air inlet pipe just upstream of the throttle housing.

Now, I can understand that the sump breather draws air OUT of the sump and into the inlet manifold via a fixed orifice. What I want to know is what the larger tappet cover breather does: Does it let filtered air INTO the tappet cover to flush the engine, or does it allow blow-by gases OUT into the air intake?

Regards....
Click to expand...

The hose from the sump and timing case is the idle/part load breather, the one from the valve cover is the full load breather.
Both allow pressure out of the engine into the intake.

The hoses wont have actually lost any mass of rubber, just perished.

As far as the oil blackening goes just use good oil and perform a flush now and then with flushing oil to keep the sludge down. This is what's known as black death.
 
Why doesn't MB reduce the oil change interval down to 5000km if this is what happens at 15,000km?
 
Hi Dieselman,

Do you have any good references that I can read up on the theory behind the breather in this configuration? There are lots on PCV and PCV Valves but nothing on "full Load" and "idle/part" systems. I am going to 'go wild' this w/e with the pressure guage - get a few of them plugged in at various points on the motor and lined up next to each other, also a rev counter: Then I am going to video all the guages whilst I put the car under a few load conditions and then I will graph the results against time, showing rpm and pressure at the different points - might shed some light. But then again.... I might just go for a cold shower.....

On the loss of mass of rubber - don't worry.... these have definately lost mass - no doubt about it! Even the two engines that I have at different stages of "perishedness" are a different weight.

On the oil blackening.... Mobil 1 has been used at the 'correct' interval for the engines full 110,000km. I first noticed the stained dipstick just after I bought the car at 48,000km. As I said earlier - if this is a 'normal' state for a (petrol) MB engine then I think I will go back to Toyota and Nissan thanks!
 
Ive seen the same on non MB engines. What I have seen done is to run a diesel oil (delvac etc) for a few thousand to move the carbon, BUT some say this may be a bad thing if it is well stuck, leave alone ?
Sadly modern synthetics and fuel vapour (ethanol etc) may bee the culprits that turn hoses hard, rot them etc etc.
230K engines suffer from top brather hose failures and as seen recently the hard to get ones under the inlet manifold and the orifices there blocking causing the top end to breathe to heavy and contaminate the MAF sensors.

I also don not follow MB oil change guide lines or other OEs either.
My wifes A169 gets oil changed at 10,000 max. my SLK at 5000 to 10,000 depending on trips etc.
Both use mobil 1
There has been too much written re extended oil change periods.
It may be OK for the 1st owner (see gearboxes sealed for life... yeah, whos life)
MB or not I always change pcv, vac hoses etc when I think they are starting to deteriorate..

Now how do I get to the ones under my inlet manifold without removing it ... hmm

Bazzle



Bazzle
 
Last edited:
Bazzle said:
Ive seen the same on non MB engines. What I have seen done is to run a diesel oil (delvac etc) for a few thousand to move the carbon, BUT some say this may be a bad thing if it is well stuck, leave alone ?
Sadly modern synthetics and fuel vapour (ethanol etc) may bee the culprits that turn hoses hard, rot them etc etc.
230K engines suffer from top brather hose failures and as seen recently the hard to get ones under the inlet manifold and the orifices there blocking causing the top end to breathe to heavy and contaminate the MAF sensors.

I also don not follow MB oil change guide lines or other OEs either.
My wifes A169 gets oil changed at 10,000 max. my SLK at 5000 to 10,000 depending on trips etc.
Both use mobil 1
There has been too much written re extended oil change periods.
It may be OK for the 1st owner (see gearboxes sealed for life... yeah, whos life)
MB or not I always change pcv, vac hoses etc when I think they are starting to deteriorate..

Now how do I get to the ones under my inlet manifold without removing it ... hmm

Bazzle



Bazzle
Click to expand...

An interesting subject Bazzle.

Years ago (50s-60s) when rebuilding engines compressed air was the norm for cleaning oil ways, but of coarse it blew the debri into the corners were it came back into circulation a little later on. On My RR 1928 I used a hammer and chisel to clear the oil ways in the crankshaft.

The next problem that came in the late 60s was detergent oil and that would release huge quanties of muck and would end up in the valve gear. and years ago the pipes were all metal
 
Hi Bazzle,

What you say makes sense - you sound like you know your stuff. Unfortunately I took my finger off the pulse and was caught out: I have always done my own servicing, but in this case, thinking I was in the hands of those best able to look after my car and also thinking that this fancy computer in the MB workshop would selfdiagnose..... Well, it won't happen again!

I found a really good article on engine ventilation...

http://www.106rallye.co.uk/members/dynofiend/breathersystems.pdf
 
amliddle said:
Hi Bazzle,

What you say makes sense - you sound like you know your stuff. Unfortunately I took my finger off the pulse and was caught out: I have always done my own servicing, but in this case, thinking I was in the hands of those best able to look after my car and also thinking that this fancy computer in the MB workshop would selfdiagnose..... Well, it won't happen again!

I found a really good article on engine ventilation...

http://www.106rallye.co.uk/members/dynofiend/breathersystems.pdf
Click to expand...
Just read the article very good reading :):) thank you
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 1 (members: 0, guests: 1)
Back
Top Bottom