Anyone here running a factory 208 6 speed manual?

[Pagz]

Hi Guys,

Is anyone here running a factory 6 speed W208?

I'm installing the system in a C36 (along with the updated trans tunnel bits to accommodate)

I would like to know how the 6-speed shifter(202/208 267 02 24) bolts to the transmission tunnel cross member?

The original bracket is not quite wide enough and has no pre drilled holes. EPC shows only one bracket was available(same for all 202/208)

On later versions ie W203, this bracket is integrated with the shifter.

Cheers,

 

[poormansporsche]

Dunno the answer but every manual conversion on any older merc I've ever seen have always used the 6 speed from a 203. I don't know whether that's because of availability or ease of conversion ??????

 

[Pagz]

The 203 is much more available!. The 208 6 speed is an nsg400, >00 208 also shares the same chassis as the 00 202, so would be direct swap in for this with M111.

Because the M104 sits ~20mm further back than the M111, it's not direct fit but not difficult to modify.

 

[Gollom]

Hi Guys,

Is anyone here running a factory 6 speed W208?

I'm installing the system in a C36 (along with the updated trans tunnel bits to accommodate)

I would like to know how the 6-speed shifter(202/208 267 02 24) bolts to the transmission tunnel cross member?

The original bracket is not quite wide enough and has no pre drilled holes. EPC shows only one bracket was available(same for all 202/208)

On later versions ie W203, this bracket is integrated with the shifter.

Cheers,

Just curious why?

 

[Pagz]

Why the manual or why the bracket?

Cheers,

 

[Gollom]

Why the manual or why the bracket?

Cheers,

Sorry, why transplanting a manual gearbox into a C36? As I said, just curious

 

[Pagz]

It's a balance of wishing the C36 originally had a manual option, and the challenge of achieving a functional system that looks original. it's really not an easy swap, as the ECU is smart and there are no great flywheel options.

Having built a 201 with 3.6 104 using 23/2.5-16V gearbox and C36 ecu, I really enjoy driving it!

722.6 is well suited to the M113 though.

 

[carat 3.6]

Sorry, why transplanting a manual gearbox into a C36? As I said, just curious

It's how the C36 should have been built, and the reason why it looses out to the M3 of the time in a big way. A tuned M104 with a 6 speed manual is a very involving car to drive, it takes on a different personality when you bin the auto gearbox.

 

[carat 3.6]

It's a balance of wishing the C36 originally had a manual option, and the challenge of achieving a functional system that looks original. it's really not an easy swap, as the ECU is smart and there are no great flywheel options.

Having built a 201 with 3.6 104 using 23/2.5-16V gearbox and C36 ecu, I really enjoy driving it!

722.6 is well suited to the M113 though.

Rennsport make a solid alloy flywheel that can be had with the correct timing gear for the C36 ecu, or if you can put up with the daulmass the factory flywheel is: 104 030 10 05.

I cant help much with the factory gear lever setup as I never use it, too sloppy for my liking. I much prefer to use the setup from an E46 BMW, which is very easy to adapt to the merc 6 speed.

Shout if you need part numbers for any of it.

 

[poormansporsche]

It's a balance of wishing the C36 originally had a manual option, and the challenge of achieving a functional system that looks original. it's really not an easy swap, as the ECU is smart and there are no great flywheel options.

Having built a 201 with 3.6 104 using 23/2.5-16V gearbox and C36 ecu, I really enjoy driving it!

722.6 is well suited to the M113 though.

I've been a passenger in a W201 with the C36 M104 / Getrag set up, new underpants were required

You did well getting a C36 ECU to work though I thought most people used a chipped C280 manual ECU ?

Shame the getrags have skyrocketed in value, I remember back in the day you could pick one up for 300 quid, now looking at 3 grand plus

 

[Pagz]

Rennsport make a solid alloy flywheel that can be had with the correct timing gear for the C36 ecu, or if you can put up with the daulmass the factory flywheel is: 104 030 10 05.

I cant help much with the factory gear lever setup as I never use it, too sloppy for my liking. I much prefer to use the setup from an E46 BMW, which is very easy to adapt to the merc 6 speed.

Shout if you need part numbers for any of it.

Thanks! I ended up building a flywheel to suit a E280cdi clutch for both the 16v getrag and .663 (the 280cdi is 440Nm from memory) the springs are a bit tough because it's from DM and has dual springs in the hub, I'm contemplating cutting the inner springs out as tricky as that may be, there used to be a place local that would re-spring/rivet them but no longer exists. ..think Luk quoted 3300Nm to the stops on this one. I did some testing with a big torque wrench, it's a lot firmer than the stock M103 240mm clutch springs. I went with only slight reduction in overall flywheel mass, wanting to minimise tortional vibrations eating the trans. \

I choose the more slopy shifter because much more original overall with additional trans tunnel parts and it matches the .663 lack of reverse interlock. I have the .664 also with the shorter shifter from slk350(was going to fit to M113 5.4 w202), the force required to get the .664 into reverse makes the direct linkage shifters necessary.

 

[Pagz]

I've been a passenger in a W201 with the C36 M104 / Getrag set up, new underpants were required

You did well getting a C36 ECU to work though I thought most people used a chipped C280 manual ECU ?

Shame the getrags have skyrocketed in value, I remember back in the day you could pick one up for 300 quid, now looking at 3 grand plus

I can agree, the 190e is fun car with this engine

The C36 ecu I use is from type without 02 sensors(has nitrogen oxide potentiometer adjustment for idle richness).

I built a timer to activate for engine start and when engine is started give ECU input for in gear, also im testing a signal generator to provide vehicle input speed for both front and rear axles, this has a bearing on deceleration enrichment and some torque limiting features like gear change. under some situations with rate of rpm decrease (ie when expecting the trans pressure switch to activate) the ecu will retard for the maxium period, this doesn't happen enough to be of much concern but I'm still working on it...the ecu is smart enough to know a clutch pedal switch is not in time with where S65 should be.

Ultimately the C280 manual ECU with C36 maps is the best way, unfortunately I don't have easy access to the knowledge required to obtain this setup.

 

[carat 3.6]

Thanks! I ended up building a flywheel to suit a E280cdi clutch for both the 16v getrag and .663 (the 280cdi is 440Nm from memory) the springs are a bit tough because it's from DM and has dual springs in the hub, I'm contemplating cutting the inner springs out as tricky as that may be, there used to be a place local that would re-spring/rivet them but no longer exists. ..think Luk quoted 3300Nm to the stops on this one. I did some testing with a big torque wrench, it's a lot firmer than the stock M103 240mm clutch springs. I went with only slight reduction in overall flywheel mass, wanting to minimise tortional vibrations eating the trans. \

I choose the more slopy shifter because much more original overall with additional trans tunnel parts and it matches the .663 lack of reverse interlock. I have the .664 also with the shorter shifter from slk350(was going to fit to M113 5.4 w202), the force required to get the .664 into reverse makes the direct linkage shifters necessary.

Nice work on that flywheel, I take it that was from a solid conversion kit looking at the center of it? The clutch plate looks the same as the sprinter one but has a different part number, you might have stronger springs in yours being from the 280 so if you wanted to go a bit softer try the van clutch plate. There is also a 5 spring clutch plate made by CIS but it is thicker than the LUK one so requires some machining to the flywheel face.

The reverse interlock is the only troublesome bit on those gearboxes when you do away with the factory shifter, I went through a few different setups before I found something reliable.

 

[Gollom]

Bravo to people who understand and can do things like this. Personally, over 70% went straight over my head - may as well be speaking Martian!

 

[Pagz]

Nice work on that flywheel, I take it that was from a solid conversion kit looking at the center of it? The clutch plate looks the same as the sprinter one but has a different part number, you might have stronger springs in yours being from the 280 so if you wanted to go a bit softer try the van clutch plate. There is also a 5 spring clutch plate made by CIS but it is thicker than the LUK one so requires some machining to the flywheel face.

The reverse interlock is the only troublesome bit on those gearboxes when you do away with the factory shifter, I went through a few different setups before I found something reliable.

Thankyou! I did a fair amount of testing on the diaphragm release distances and bearing travel in the .404 and .663 , then built the flywheel heights to suit!. they are made from a grade of billet chromoly - I forget which grade now but there was very few to choose from locally.
built some cad drawings and had a local machinist helped out with the majority on a CNC lathe, they also ground finished the mounting surface. later to save on costs I did the fiddley parts like magnet and counter sinks for the bolts and finally had the assembly balanced.

Thanks for the heads up on the sprinter and CIS plate, I will investigate!

 

[Pagz]

Bravo to people who understand and can do things like this. Personally, over 70% went straight over my head - may as well be speaking Martian!

fortunately this is a great place to learn

 

[Pagz]

Finally found a photo!. I know it's a long shot but surely someone has or knows someone with a wrecked one? could do with a few more parts if they do have.

Regards,