CDI engine into W124

[312 Sprinter]

The reason for this is simple when you think about it. A petrol EFI system throws a bit of fuel in every now and then (*) but late CDi engines use a short pre-injection followed by a number of very quick pulses of fuel at precise timings. This gives you a smoother burn and reduces the horrible combustion noise of high-pressure diesels. The timing of all this happens in a very, very short window which is why such high-tech injectors are needed

The diesel setup has to do all this within a 3D map and also manage boost and waste gate timing, manage torque output in low gears to stop blowing up the gearbox, manage torque output during shifts with autoboxes, manage idle & engine speed when the a/c kicks in & out, manage EGR, manage variable valve timing, manage rail pressure, & etc & etc

Manufacturers and the aftermarket have had years to come up with solutions for petrol engines. But modern diesels are serious high-tech sh*t and need lots of management to stop them going bang expensively

A friend has just spent about four months (hopefully) getting to the bottom of a fault on a Citroen HDi engine. It has at least two fuel pressure sensors, two fuel pumps, a fuel pressure regulator, two temp sensors, no MAF (strangely) and all the other sensors. When it refuses to run the ECU stores no fault codes so diagnosis is nigh-on impossible

I'd love a W124 E320 CDi but will wait for someone very clever (and with deep pockets) to make a kit of parts

* slight oversimplification

Nick Froome

Indeed.

I wonder if Mercedes sell any of the CDI engines in marinised form? If you could get standalone software to run it as a boat engine it would get round the issue of the feedback from the car CANbus.

 

[bolide]

I wonder if Mercedes sell any of the CDI engines in marinised form? If you could get standalone software to run it as a boat engine it would get round the issue of the feedback from the car CANbus.

Nice idea. IMHO this is exactly the kind of lateral thinking we need to solve this problem!

Nick Froome

 

[CRASH67]

NOT all CDI engines are run on can bus

 

[Iben]

As an owner of a diesel W124 I found this very an interesting thread, and whilst I can understand the want of better performance and fuel etc I always thought that the main benefit of my old 300TD was no turbo and no electronics, working on the theory that the main reason modern Mercs, BMW's, and other cars are often seen broken down on the side of the road is due to some electronic gremlin.

 

[bolide]

I always thought that the main benefit of my old 300TD was no turbo and no electronics

Agreed. And the main benefit of modern diesels is torque. Lots of it. Produced by... turbo & electronics

Nick Froome

 

[Druk]

if you insistant on a CDI engine a early 611 612 or 613 would be what to look at as they not CAN BUS
wheres 646 651 and 642 are i think

So if one wanted one of these engines for a project; which model of Merc were they fitted to?

 

[nick mercedes]

So if one wanted one of these engines for a project; which model of Merc were they fitted to?

202, Sprinter/ML and 210/220

 

[alexander patie]

how are those engines not on the can bus?!?! that is simply incorrect. both the 163 and 202 have can communication with various modules, crucially needing can comm with das3 to even start the engine. there is no cdi i am aware of that does not need can comm to run - please correct me if i am wrong.

 

[Nastynick]

Thanks guys for amazing response. Apologies for the late reply but I had disabled the email notification part on my profile inadvertently .

On reflection it would seem that it would be a money pit of a project. It was just a "What if?" pipe dream anyway but I never realised the electronics factor of it. I thought the biggest worry would be fabricating new engine mounts or similar.

So a follow up question to diesel W124 owners. what is the average combined mpg return? I commute 500 miles a week in a mk5 Golf GTTdi and get roughly 50-55 mpg even when I drive ahem, "enthuiastically" . If got myself a W124, I know I'm its not going to match my Golf, but would it be a sensible choice. I love these cars (especially the CEs) and can't get them out of my head.

Nick.

 

[Nastynick]

Has any of you fine people heard about or seen a W124 coupe with the E300TD engine fitted?

I keep seeing 230CEs and 320CEs for sale and very reasonably priced too. I would love to use one as my daily driver. But I'd need a diesel to make it viable. Unless I just get a petrol and use it at weekends and for best.

Thoughts, comments, views guys?

 

[trapperjohn]

Your love of the CE is quite obvious. Would not a saloon 124 diesel not fit the bill in any way?
A really nice dark metallic colour with alloys always looks really good.
Check my avatar, and nope she is not for sale.

 

[Nastynick]

John.

All the W124 variants are great cars. I'd love a saloon as much as I love the estate or coupe, but the lines of the coupe are perfect. If I could persuade the missus, there would be a W124 estate in Midnight Blue with pale leather parked on my drive in place of her V70.

If I had six numbers come in on Saturday, I'd be chasing a W108 300 6.3 in the above colour scheme.

 

[snoopy]

My 250D manual gets 60mpg on a motorway run.

Performance is crap but biofuel at 80p/litre isn't.

Engine simple, much cheaper parts and goes and goes (one you've changed the HG )

 

[Nastynick]

I'd want an automatic. But I'm interested in the idea of a 300TD engine in a W124. I would like to give it the pace it deserves combined with the frugality of a diesel.

Does HG mean head gasket? What happened there?

 

[snoopy]

Ruptured sending oil (and a lot of it) into cylinder #1. A known fault and 5 revisions of the head gasket made to fix it.

Affects 250 and 300D. Some do 500k miles no problem, mine got to 105k.

No matter the car rocks I'll never sell it. It's my fourth leg. :bannana:

 

[Nastynick]

TrapperJohn.

I can't get a close up of your car mate. It looks the nuts from the tiny avatar tho.

I'm a whisker away from getting rid of my golf and buying a W124 and a crappy diesel hatch to commute in.

The breadknife is going to kill me!!!!!

 

[Sorry Pete]

Hello Nastynic.

I love my W124 300D saloon, it has a non-turbo engine, and I'm trying to talk myself out of selling it for an S124 estate. I might sell it in the new year yet. Anyway, the point is, you can indeed fit a diesel into a W124 coupe. Here's the Youtube evidence:

MB W124 Diesel CE

He did the transfer himself and from the license plates, I think he's Dutch. I'm sure if you contact him by via youtube he'd gladly give details. The OM606 turbo, 24 valve diesel from the later, w210 e class will fit and run with the mechanical OM603 injector pump used in the W124 diesels. That would be the route I'd be inclined to head for as a compromise to the cdi route.

 

[V12]

I don't know if you've spotted this :
Mercedes E300CD 1996 24v Diesel Coupe on eBay (end time 21-Dec-10 19:50:16 GMT)

 

[bolide]

Just had a press release through from Simtek about their ECU setup for the 2.7 TDV6 Jaguar / Land-Rover / PSA engine. The complete kit (ECU, cabling, injector driver module, etc) costs £2950 + VAT

That's for an engine they expect to be a popular retrofit for older LR models. I imagine they will move on to other engines depending on demand

I think the price makes the job uneconomic but clearly Simtek thinks there is a market

Nick Froome