Diesel frozen

[dogan124]

Hii All,

It is freezing here as cold as below -20 C. Hence the diesel (even the type called Euro-diesel) is frozen! Engine didn’t start for 2 days. And today finally after re-charging the flat battery I was able to start it.

Now, what additives could be used in order to avoid the diesel from being frozen ? The private service of my golf says I should add a few liters of gasoline where as that of Mercedes says add up to 10 liters of kerosene (paraffin oil?) for a full tank. Both could be easy and practical but I don't want any harm to engine…

Any experience or suggestion about that ?

Thanks

Dogan/Turkey

 

[grober]

Its a paradox but when your battery is very cold (not frozen!! )its recommended that you warm up the electrolite by switching on your lights. The resultant low current will warm up the solution enough to carry the large current required by the starter motor. Thats provided the battery was charged before it freezes. A dead battery will freeze at about -10c If your battery is frozen you must warm it up before trying to jump start or recharge it. A frozen battery may have internal structural damage also. see http://www.repairfaq.org/ELE/F_Car_Battery.html#CARBATTERY_021 Cant talk from experience about adding petrol or kerosene to diesel but if you do it according to the manufacturers recommended proportions your engines should be ok at your age of vehicles. Of course its no good doing this after the fuel has WAXED UP in the injection system. Have you thought about the engine preheaters- electric or diesel burner you can get for these cars

 

[Satch]

Hii All,


Now, what additives could be used in order to avoid the diesel from being frozen ? The private service of my golf says I should add a few liters of gasoline where as that of Mercedes says add up to 10 liters of kerosene (paraffin oil?) for a full tank. Both could be easy and practical but I don't want any harm to engine…

Any experience or suggestion about that ?

Thanks

Dogan/Turkey

Use kerosene! Although it may be OK in older engines I would not put petrol in any diesel whatever the age.

But it is far, far better to use a low temperature anti waxing additive because you need quite a lot of kerosene in return for a very modest improvement in low temperature performance

Something like this:

http://www.kamco.co.uk/diesel.htm

 

[bolide]

Low temps

A 91 300TD will run on pretty much anything so I'd go by what the handbook says or use a proprietary agent as suggested above

-20 sounds pretty challenging!

Nick Froome
www.w124.co.uk

 

[Parrot of Doom]

I'm sure I read somewhere that on some engines there is a socket for a block heater?

 

[BonzoDog]

In the good old days when I worked in Russia, if you had a car, you left it running all the time and if you had a truck, you lit a fire under the engine in the morning. Russian technology is highly effective and robust.

 

[Dieselman]

I'm sure I read somewhere that on some engines there is a socket for a block heater?

There is and they are very common in Canada. They often appear on Ebay.com

 

[twice]

There is and they are very common in Canada. They often appear on Ebay.com

And where is the socket located on the engines? Mine for example is a 605.910 one.

 

[grober]

Auxillary heaters

These ELECTRIC heaters normally fit in one of the so called freeze plugs on the side of the block. these are thin metal plugs that fit in circular holes on the side of the engine block. this site in the USA lists some for mercedes. they run on 120 volts I THINK http://www.discountmbparts.com/MB_Block~Heater~Kit_list.html but there are plenty other sites offering them as well. If you dont want to do this kenlow used to offer an ELECTRIC system where you use the heater pipes instead. see http://www.kenlowe.com/pre-heaters/cars/whatwill.html Erberspacher and webasto also make auxillary heaters which BURN DIESEL FUEL see http://www.eberspaecher.com/en/heiz/tech/wheiz/funkt/funkt.htm These are fitted as standard on later high efficiency diesel engines. The Webasto one offers mobile phone activation if you want http://www.webasto.co.uk/general/en/am_automobile_3177.html

 

[Satch]

Block heaters etc are of help but in very low temperatures unless the fuel tank, lines and filters also benefit from some form of heating/circulation you still get the danger of wax crystals forming and plugging the filters/lines.

Operating a diesel in extreme low temperatures is not easy. Requires winter fuel, anti waxing additives, fuel heaters (including sometimes in-line fuel heaters, which are special fuel lines with an electric heating element running through them and will keep fuel running down to -40C) and fuel-water separators. Which is why in really bad conditions diesels never get switched off unless ancilliary heating is available.

Or of course you can adopt the slightly lower-tech Russian method of lighting a small fire under the vehicle


This is from the Exxon website

"What is low-temperature operability?

Low-temperature operability is a diesel fuel’s ability to perform at low temperatures. All petroleum distillate products contain waxy materials, which, at low temperatures, can crystallize and plug fuel filters. The cloud point of the fuel measures the first appearance of the waxes, although filter plugging will not typically occur until the ambient temperature is 5° to 10°F ( 2.7 to 5.5C) below the cloud point. There are several approaches, both operational and fuel-related, to ensure proper operability in cold weather.

Vehicle-related approaches include the use of fuel heaters, keeping the engine running, parking the vehicle in heated areas, etc. Each of these is designed to keep the fuel warm, above the point where waxing occurs. But each of these approaches has obvious drawbacks, as well.

The low-temperature operability of the fuel can be adjusted in several ways, as well. Blending a No. 2 fuel with No. 1 can lower its cloud point; this is probably the most common approach to dealing with winter operability. But, the use of Diesel Fuel No. 1 reduces power and fuel economy, and often is more expensive, so minimizing the amount of No. 1 Fuel in the blend is an important consideration. Another approach to reduce the filter plugging incidence is to use wax-modifying additives. These additives can give operability benefits equivalent to No. 1 Fuel blending without the power and fuel economy losses.

Note that, especially early in the winter season, water buildup in vehicle tanks, when it freezes, can also plug fuel filters or fuel lines. If you experience filter plugging problems when the ambient temperatures are between 10° and 30°F (-12 to -1C), the most likely cause is water, not the fuel itself.

What should I do in the winter to adjust for the cold temperatures?

We recommend that you purchase a diesel fuel that has been winterized for your area by mixing it with Diesel Fuel No. 1 or low-temperature fluidity improver additives. Non-winterized diesel fuel will not generally cause problems as long as temperatures are at or above 10°F (-12C). The addition of about 15% to 20% Diesel Fuel No. 1 to Diesel Fuel No. 2 will reduce the cloud point of the fuel by about 5°F (2.7C).

We offer winterized product in a majority of markets that experience severe weather conditions. If temperatures fall well below norms for the local area or you will be driving much farther north, additional Diesel Fuel No. 1 blending is recommended.

Why shouldn’t I just use Diesel Fuel No. 1?

While Diesel Fuel No. 1 has an advantage in low temperature operability, there are some disadvantages, as well. The energy content of Diesel Fuel No. 1 is about 95% that of Diesel Fuel No. 2 and will provide a correspondingly lower fuel economy. Diesel Fuel No. 1 is also lower in viscosity and provides less lubrication for the fuel pump and fuel distributor."

 

[dogan124]

Thanks for all the replies.

It was very informative to me.

By the way I had to add gasoline although I intended parafine. It was about 2 litres to both of the cars tank (golf's tank was full by 1/2 and mercedes's was 3/4). So far no problem and both starts well in the morning though the temps are no more colder than -10 these days.

-20's of cold was normal some 20 years ago. But now it is a surprise as many people couldn't start their car. Climates are changing I think.

Regards.

Dogan

 

[grober]

Cooking Oil Technology

It might also be possible to adapt some of the technology being developed for running diesels on cooking oil since its very prone to waxing. see http://www.frybrid.com/test.htm I know some Russian vehicles relocate their fuel filters and pumps close to the engine block for extreme cold operation together with aircraft type heated fuel lines. I,m sure I read somewhere about mercedes heated fuel lines but maybe in their commercial vehicles.