diesel or petrol?

[219]

McDonalds do very nice ice cream , which goes down nicely in this weather .

 

[peter49]

There is no simple answer. As others have already said, it's very much a matter of horses for courses. Some of us simply couldn't live with the tickover engine rattle and the smell of fuel that pervades so much with diesels. Others have convinced themselves that the "savings" with diesels far outweigh all the drawbacks.

Then you get the technocops who tell us that the extra torque of diesels is way better than petrols' horses. But I think it's more about how both of those are delivered. And therein lies the rub. The differences are vast between manufacturers. For instance I was given a lift the other day in a neighbour's A5 3.0 TDi and I had no idea that it was a diesel - until I got out and heard it! Conversely a friend had a new E220 CDi on test recently and it was painfully obvious that the four pots were being fuelled with the funny stuff. It felt and sounded most unlike a quality prestige car at anything below 20mph. On the motorway it was fine though, albeit much underpowered. But even that was way better than the new A180 CDi I went in a few weeks back - it felt and sounded nowhere near as sophisticated as the 850 Morris Minor I had back in the 60s!!

In essence, it would take a hell of a lot to persuade me to buy diesel. There are millions who are delighted with them, but there are also millions who like McDonalds. Which brings me nicely back to where I started - horses for courses

You are comparing apples with oranges when you describe the performance characteristics of 4 pot and 6 pot diesel engines. They are incompable irrespective of the marque. I have never noticed a smell of diesel when re-filling. I'll make a point of checking it out next time I do, though that could be a couple of weeks along a 600 mile road!

 

[Charles Morgan]

An interesting one this.

I get no diesel smell , nothing at all, other than at the pumps, where you get a petrol smell with petrols too.

Ditto. You should smell my two petrol engined cars inside the garage though!

 

[Oli]

Ditto. You should smell my two petrol engined cars inside the garage though!

This is true, my bike smells a lot when I put it back in the garage after going out on it, heat and burned V Power in an enclosed space, it isn't that pleasant, still preferable to the smell of Diesel fumes though.

 

[markjay]

...other than at the pumps, where you get a petrol smell with petrols too.

Yes, but petrol smell is n-i-c-e....

 

[developer]

Yes, but petrol smell is n-i-c-e....

Petrol and Castrol R as an exhaust fume is the best .

 

[Charles Morgan]

It must be me, but I must say in the list of things I want to smell, diesel and petrol are both a very, very long way down!

Although I do like a hint of petrol in an aged German or Alsace riesling.

Nothing to add on the thread other than I was in a 4 pot Passat on Thursday which two people thought was a diesel, and turned out to be petrol. No shove, unrefined and very uneconomical, I'd have a 4 pot diesel over that in a heatbeat!

 

[Dryce]

Nothing to add on the thread other than I was in a 4 pot Passat on Thursday which two people thought was a diesel, and turned out to be petrol. No shove, unrefined and very uneconomical, I have a 4 pot diesel over that in a heatbeat!

Had a 4 pot diesel Passat a couple of months back and was underwhelmed by it.

OTOH had a 4 pot diesel C220 last month and it felt despite being a bit of a tractor about town that on the move it was a thoroughly nice motor car.

 

[markjay]

I now drive a petrol MB and a diesel Kia (both automatic).

Strangely, I like the Kia diesel. The engine is noisy when cold and a bit rough when driving, but oddly it actually suits well the utilitarian character of the car. The engine is torquey and pulls well from low rev (as you would expect from a turbo diesel) and it is actually quite fun to drive.

On another note... being concerned about clogged DPF, I looked it up on owners' forums. Interestingly people say that there's no need to rev the engine or drive it on motorways - if you use premium diesel fuel you'll have no DPF issues even if the car only ever does short trips. I wonder if this is actually the case.

 

[Dieselman]

True, however diesel cars are also more expensive to buy then petrol cars, both as new cars (diesel engine parts are more expensive to make) , and as second hand cars (due to lower depreciation).

So those who make their decision purely based on economical considerations should really look at all the factors including depreciation, cost of repairs (if not under warranty), and cost of fuel per litre, rather than just compare mpg figures before passing a verdict that one type of car is more economical to own than the other.

A quick look in Fleet News whole life running costs always puts diesels ahead, over any mileage.

 

[effbee584]

I am on my 4th Diesel Merc, a V6 CLS, before that, an in line 6cyl 320cdi*. In real world driving they are more than adequate, loads of torks and there's not many cars could beat either away from the lights. Economy on both is/was OK with 41ish on long runs. I really like the characteristics of the engines compared to petrol equivalents, they sound good when pushed a bit, which I hardly do because its not needed. I understand the appeal of a V8, but I would tire of the noise (and the low mpg), a 320/350 petrol would equate to mine so would be quiet I assume, but you would need to 'drive' them and use higher revs to keep up with a V6 diesel, all too tiresome for me. The V6 is unobtrusive from inside even from a cold start, and pretty quiet from outside when hot. Its a shame about the extra tax added to our diesel price, but that's rip-off britain. Its good to cruise in Europe using their cheaper fuel and is the reason you see so many big engined deisel cars there, often cruising at high speed.
If it's purely a cost comparison, maybe petrol would win, but the modern 3 litre diesel engines are great to drive, I prefer them to petrol equivalents and mated to a 7 speed box that never lets me down, good enough for me. Don't even consider a 4 cyl diesel, I have had two and you need to rev them to to get some performance which is noisy and less economic.
I liken my car to a 747 Jumbo jet, slow but comfortable while taxiing on town roads, but fast quiet and comfortable when at cruising altitude, where the distance is being covered.
A big engine MB (perhaps???? a BMW or Audi) is the way to go for a real world daily use family car, IMO.

* I had the engine chipped at 100,000 miles and wow, did it go, improved torque and economy, £360 well spent, for warranty reasons won't do it yet on the CLS.

 

[Dieselman]

Its a shame about the extra tax added to our diesel price, but that's rip-off britain.

Huh...??

Unleaded petrol 0.5795
Heavy oil (diesel) 0.5795


Kind of makes your statement a bit nonsensical.

 

[markjay]

...Unleaded petrol 0.5795
Heavy oil (diesel) 0.5795
....

Aha... you only provided the figures up to the fourth decimal point... let's have the whole thing then, what are you hiding there in places five, six, and seven...?

 

[flango]

 

[effbee584]

I am pleased to be corrected as regards higher diesel price in UK, not tax as I assumed, but higher cost of production, marketing and delivery to forecourts. So perhaps not a tax rip-off then but a fuel company cost, perhaps profiteering due to increased popularity?

As explained in the extracts for an OFT report .....
UK petrol and diesel sector
An OFT Call for Information
January 2013



Prices and margins in the petrol and diesel sectors
1.5 Before tax and duty, the UK appears to have some of the cheapest petrol and diesel prices in Europe, although after tax and duty UK prices are amongst the most expensive (see Figures 1.1 and 1.2 below). According to European Commission data, in November 2012 the price of UK petrol was around 14p per litre (ppl) higher than the EU average and the price of UK diesel was around 25ppl higher than the EU average. UK diesel pump prices are further out of step with EU prices than petrol prices because unlike most other EU nations - which levy higher taxes on petrol than diesel - the UK levies duty on both petrol and diesel at the same rate.


The elements of the price of petrol and diesel that are subject to UK competition – the gross margins for refining, wholesaling and retailing road fuel – are a far smaller proportion of road fuel prices. Over the past 10 years the combined gross margin for refining, wholesaling and retailing has increased by 3.4ppl for petrol and 7.2ppl for diesel. Taking account of inflation, this represents an increase in real terms of 14 per cent for petrol and 41 per cent for diesel. Much of the increase in the combined gross margin for diesel is explained by a 4.5ppl increase in the gross refining margin during the period. This is likely to be because demand for diesel currently outstrips supply in the UK and Europe.


Diesel is cheaper than unleaded in most of the EU , so someone is charging us in the UK too much! I don't see a supply shortage anywhere.

 

[Teflonso]

Some simple rules for petrol/diesel:

• If buying a drop-top, or if you like to drive with the windows open, buy petrol. Diesel will never sound right.
• If someone else is paying for your fuel, why on earth would you want an oil burner?
• If someone else is paying for your car, why worry about DPF problems?
• If you want long legged, lazy driving, buy a diesel
• If you are towing a tin snail - diesel
• If you get fed up of filling up more than once a week - diesel
• More cylinders = good. V6 diesel beats straight 4 petrol.
• Short journeys, limited miles - petrol
• If you want street cred with the baseball cap wearing, loud stereo fraternity - petrol. Don't even think about pimping a diesel.
• If you are a complete tight wad - LPG conversion.
• Allegedly, diesel is mroe expensive because UK refineries were designed to produce more petrol. If so, it's taken many many years and it's still not sorted.

.

 

[Terry_]

Petrol over diesel