E220cdi....will I be dissapointed?

[ddavidm]

Hi folks.
Just bought a B180cdi for the Mrs to replace her VW Touran. It's a 2005 model with only 25k, leather, fmsh and panoramic sunroof. Hopefully collectinig on Monday.

Meantime, I'm after an E class and have been reading up as much as possible on these. I'm after a post 2006 facelift model, (prob 07/08) and found a nice looking silver saloon 220cdi AG 08 plate 60k FMSH comand, leather for sub £12k. Question...can split folding seats be retro-fitted and at what cost? I'd consider a 7 seat estate, which would be the sensible choice for me, but I do much prefer the look of the saloon, and think silver suits either varient best.

However, I'm wondering whether I'll regret not going for a 320cdi in terms of performance. I do like the look of the sport models with the larger alloys and bolstered seats etc, but they seem to wear 265 18" tyres (translates to 2-3 x the cost for new tyres compared to 16"). I'm not too bothered about the ride being a little harsher (I'm coming from an RX8 after all).

What are peoples views on this? I'm an ex e39 M5 owner, so do like a bit of grunt on occasion, and I'm worried that after the initial honeymoon period, I may regret not going for the 320.

My mileage will be sub 10k per annum, and the difference in economy between the 320 and 220 does not at least on paper seem to be huge. A matter of 4-5mpg only. Is that correct, real world? And I've been trying to figure out what additional std eqpt comes with the 320 over a 220.

Gearboxes...confused. Are flappy paddles std on all 320's of the above age? Are they a gimmick or do people like them? Also confused on gearbox options. Is the 7 speed std on this age? I think the 220 above wasn't 7 speed. I've seen some negative comments on the 7 speed box in terms of reliability, but does this only apply to pre 06 facelift cars ?

Help!, please!!

Many thanks

Dan

 

[Troon]

Flappy paddles are on Sports.
There are no W211 E220 CDI Sports.
Facelift W211 E220 CDI auto will be 5G, E280/320CDI will be 7G.

As far as grunt goes, that's so subjective you'd need to drive it to see. My E220 CDI S211 is such an improvement over my previous car (a rather gutless 1.8 petrol Mondeo) that it seemed like a rocket ship at first. Now I'm used to it, it's perfectly adequate and I'd rather have the better economy, lower VED and purported better reliability of the OM646/5G versus the OM642/7G over a second or two to 60.

Your views may differ given your past cars. Have an extended test drive to decide for yourself.

Equipment? See the brochure (PDF).

One point to note is that prior to 09MY, there is no audio aux in socket unless you have the full COMAND sat-nav system.

Economy: I drive fast but very smoothly and patiently and average a shade over 40mpg real measured, in an estate which is heavier and less aerodynamic than the saloon. Take a look at the spritmonitor comparison to see what others are getting.

 

[ddavidm]

Mark,

That's very useful info actually, thanks. As I'll be buying without a warranty, the reliability is a major consideration, and the the concensus seems to be that the 5G is pretty indestructable, and that's also why I'm only considering cars with a faultless service history. Of course, the 220 lump is very solid too.

Does anyone have a view as to whether chipping the 220 bring it up to 280 / 320 performance should I be so inclined in due course?

Thansk again

 

[prprandall51]

...the reliability is a major consideration....

Does anyone have a view as to whether chipping the 220 bring it up to 280 / 320 performance should I be so inclined in due course?

Thansk again

Seems that you have two opposing views there. If your top concern is reliability then chipping a 220 up to the power of the 320 may not be wise.

 

[ddavidm]

Noted, but the impression I had from reading the threads on chipping was that it's considered safe, and well within tolerances for the engine / gearbox and ancillaries without causing undue stress, no?

 

[Adam230K]

For the differences in consumption and power i'd definitely go for the E320 if I was you... you're gonna hate your driving life in a 220 especially coming from an E39 M5, because it really just doesn't feel quick in any way, 4cyl engines in an E-class body will feel lethargic...

 

[developer]

What he said ^^^^.

 

[Deleted member 37751]

Took this photo today in my E320 CDi Sport after a trip up the A1;

 

[ddavidm]

Shame your's isn't silver SPX, I may be tempted, especially with the child friendly additions!!

 

[Deleted member 37751]

You don't want a silver car, black is the new silver!

If you're ever in my neck of the woods, you are more than welcome to have a look over mine and a drive to see what you're getting.

If you drive the 320 after that, nothing else will do...

 

[Merc Owner 2B]

if you drive the 320 after that, nothing else will do... :d

+1

 

[Mr E]

For the differences in consumption and power i'd definitely go for the E320 if I was you... you're gonna hate your driving life in a 220 especially coming from an E39 M5, because it really just doesn't feel quick in any way, 4cyl engines in an E-class body will feel lethargic...

I certainly haven't hated the previous 8 years in the two E220s I've had (saloon and estate)...

Lethargic? Whilst not condoning daft driving, I have covered the 10 miles from the village to the town through winding country lanes in under 8 minutes. So the "on paper" numbers may not look too attractive, but in the real world it's more than adequate.

As regards reliability, the only major issue was the turbo on the saloon (which was done under warranty).

It'll be coming up to 250k miles in the two cars over eight years - in both cases they'll be given up with a tinge of regret as they've been great cars.

Would I have been happier with a 320? Hard to say, but the choice was based on economics and I've not had better cars than these two. The next one (just ordered) is an E250 Saloon - so a bit more grunt, but with better consumption and emissions than the current vehicle.

 

[Merc Owner 2B]

Recently test drove the new E220 CDi exec SE. Was very impressed with the engine when you consider my daily driver is the E350 CDi sport coupe.

 

[ddavidm]

Hmm.
Don't get me wrong, I love black. My current car is black, but it takes a LOT of work to keep her looking nice (especially with no garage). Also, black shows up imperfections far more than silver.

I am not infrequently in Yorkshire, (wife's parents near Halifax)...thanks for the offer SPX...if not got one by the next trip I may take you up on that.

I fear though that you might be right and once I've sampled a 320, there will be no question for me. Ultimately, the running costs do not look to be wildly different.

 

[st4]

Mark,

That's very useful info actually, thanks. As I'll be buying without a warranty, the reliability is a major consideration, and the the concensus seems to be that the 5G is pretty indestructable, and that's also why I'm only considering cars with a faultless service history. Of course, the 220 lump is very solid too.

Does anyone have a view as to whether chipping the 220 bring it up to 280 / 320 performance should I be so inclined in due course?

Thansk again

If reliability is more important than performance get the 220cdi. I wouldn't chip it.

The 320cdi is a fair bit quicker 6.8 to 60 vs 8.0 to 60 and 140mph vs 155mph and more mid range grunt. I came from an x5 4.4 to an e220 and I didn't suffer. Some cars are faster than others, that's life and a 220 isn't a very fast car but it's reasonably swift.

If buying over again as I've had both I'd go for the 220. Mine has had two engine faults in 30k miles totalling £2500 in my 320.

Agree the sport trim is nicer but buy a set of 18s off eBay and a Blistein b12 pro kit for your 220 and your laughing.

 

[developer]

If buying over again as I've had both I'd go for the 220.

I bet you wouldn't.

 

[D-18]

If you search the forum, you'll find several threads covering the comparsions between 220 / 280 / 320 E Class. There is no right answer, just go with the car which suits you best.

I had an E220, then went for an E280 because I wanted the extra refinement of the 6 pot engine - the extra power of the 280 is great, but that wasn't a big deal for me as I thought the 220 was perfectly adequate for real world motoring.

By all accounts, the 220/5G is a more durable combo than the 280-320/7G mix, but I prefer the 7G to the 5G.

 

[A210AMG]

8 seconds to 60 and 140mph is hardly slow... you should also I hope see at least 40mpg easily?

I guess if you never drive the 320 you will never know what you missing... In the same way I have the 'old' IL6 E320cdi and don't want to drive the newer one. My next swap will probably be the S212.

From what I see on trips to Europe, most european models are the E220's or C200cdi type cars. Real mile munching cars and on motorways they all cruise well...

Buying one second hand though...what would I do...

Well, given costs are about the same, mpg about the same? spec generally I would guess higher in the E320... its looking like the bigger engined car has the edge.

I guess the main benifit of the 220cdi would be its likely to have far fewer miles / age for age and also there appears to be very little that goes wrong with that model?

From my own exsperience It is nice to 'have' the bigger engined model even if 95% of the time you don't need it. There are times when a good prod on the go pedal really is quite nice and then if your sat in traffic and your in the 220 would you be thinking as a 320 pull up.... I wish I had gone for one of them.

Given the second hand prices of both models now, its not like buying new when maybe the purchase price and tax implication effect what you choose.


Difficult one.... I hazard a guess if you drive the 320 thats what you will get.

 

[WillDeBeest]

Ask me in a couple of weeks. I'm collecting a 2009 E220 CDI tomorrow after doing a lot of sums and deciding not to consider the 280 and 320. A lot of this came down to what the E220 is not. It's not - at least, the three I've driven haven't been...

...slow. It's 250cc, a cylinder and an automatic gearbox down on my old Volvo D5, and has an extra 300kg to pull, but at no point have I felt it was having to work too hard. My standards are not everyone's, of course, but I like a quickish car and this is, for me, quick enough.

...unrefined. The family bus we're replacing, a Toyota Verso, has a four-cylinder diesel that sometimes sounds like two iron bedsteads fighting over a spanner. It will probably never go wrong but boy, is it hard work to travel in. I've driven other four-pot diesels (a Mitsubishi Grandis was the worst) and winced at the noise, but the E220 is nothing like them. Only the hardest acceleration gives the sound a bit of four-cylinder edge; the rest of the time it's barely audible.

...a Sport. Most 280s and 320s are, and their enormous wheels make little sense on the congested, potholed southeastern roads on which I do most of my driving. Even if they were Continental billiard tables I'd baulk at the idea of £250 for a tyre. The 16" wheels on a 220 Avantgarde are just fine for my purposes.

...a seven-speeder. The 7G+ in the new E may be a gem, but I've yet to find the 5G in the 220 short of a gear, and reports here and elsewhere suggest it's the most reliable option.

Still, I've a lot to learn and I haven't even parked it on the drive yet. Happy to submit further reports as the family and I get acquainted with the new machine.

 

[prprandall51]

Noted, but the impression I had from reading the threads on chipping was that it's considered safe, and well within tolerances for the engine / gearbox and ancillaries without causing undue stress, no?

Any tuning is going to increase stress on the engine. 220 > 270 may not be pushing it but 220 > 320 seems to be wringing it out a bit.

Also, consider that your insurance premium increase as a result of chipping may well mean you might as well have bought the bigger engine, anyway.

Also, big engines are frequently as economical or even more economical at motorway speeds than small engines as they are working much less due to high torque at low revs (and the auto box / final drive gearing will be higher accordingly).