Indicators do you use them or not?

[robert.saunders]

How does use of hazard lights (on a motorway for example, to warn of a queue etc) turn into automatic high-intensity flashing brake lights in emergency braking? I note that some vehicles (lorries) on the continent have this feature and Mercedes are harping on about it too; I assume it's legal within the vehicle lighting regs for this country?

 

[st4]

How does use of hazard lights (on a motorway for example, to warn of a queue etc) turn into automatic high-intensity flashing brake lights in emergency braking? I note that some vehicles (lorries) on the continent have this feature and Mercedes are harping on about it too; I assume it's legal within the vehicle lighting regs for this country?

Depends if by high intensity you mean fog light then probably not. If there are no regs against this then it should be possible.

I always thought, and still do that brake lights should vary with the intensity of the pedal pressure with a light dab meaning a dimmer light and a hard application of the brake full on lights.

I imagine the high intensity flashing of the brake light would come in when the ABS was engaged, or the brake assist system.

 

[219]

I suggested this one to Mercedes about thirty years ago , just after ABS was introduced . My thought then was that an ABS equipped car would be able to stop so much more quickly than 'ordinary' cars behind and that the following drivers would need all the warning they could get . My idea was that the brake lights should flash when ABS was activated thus indicating the car was braking HARD , or braking on a poor road surface . The flashing brake lights being more conspicuous than a constantly illuminated one and also symbolic of the on/off action of the ABS system . Yet to be taken up , unfortunately .

Misuse of hazard lights annoys me too .

 

[whitenemesis]

I'm sure I've followed a car that had "active" brake lights. On gentle slowing the lights were steady but when he had to brake harder because the queue suddenly stopped the lights flashed rapidly

 

[st4]

I'm sure I've followed a car that had "active" brake lights. On gentle slowing the lights were steady but when he had to brake harder because the queue suddenly stopped the lights flashed rapidly

Was this a BMW, I heard they were persuing a similar intensity type system?

 

[Dryce]

This is a folly that a lot of people seem to fall into .

The putting on of a trafficator absolutely , categorically , definitively DOES NOT CONFER ANY AUTHORITY WHATSOEVER TO CARRY OUT ANY INTENDED MANOEUVRE .

Don't misread my words. I deliberately stated 'should' rather than 'must'.

The same people are the ones who come down motorway slip roads , throw on a signal ( which should NEVER be given to join a motorway : where else can you possibly be going ? )

I make no apology for always using an indicator in this situation. It's a signal to other road users who might otherwise be about to initiate an unexpected manoeuvre (eg. accelerate in lane 1 behind you, or move from lane 2 to lane 1 in your vicinity) of my presence and intention.

 

[whitenemesis]

Was this a BMW, I heard they were persuing a similar intensity type system?

I honestly cant remember

 

[Dryce]

I suggested this one to Mercedes about thirty years ago , just after ABS was introduced . My thought then was that an ABS equipped car would be able to stop so much more quickly than 'ordinary' cars behind and that the following drivers would need all the warning they could get .

I was under the impression that ABS doesn't shorten stopping distances and may actually increase them - it only confers an increased ability to steer the vehicle in a situation where the brakes would otherwise lock-up.

BAS on the other hand ....

 

[robert.saunders]

Is the flashing brake lights part of the new PRE-SAFE BRAKE on MB cars?

 

[Dryce]

I always thought, and still do that brake lights should vary with the intensity of the pedal pressure with a light dab meaning a dimmer light and a hard application of the brake full on lights.

Problem is perception of intensity, variations by vehicle or brake application, and the effect of visibility conditions.

What happens when a vehicle is stationary with brake lights on? Not a problem if they are dim in a queue of stationary traffic perhaps. But what if you are the last vehicle in the queue on a motorway ..... and in low vis?

 

[st4]

Problem is perception of intensity, variations by vehicle or brake application, and the effect of visibility conditions.

What happens when a vehicle is stationary with brake lights on? Not a problem if they are dim in a queue of stationary traffic perhaps. But what if you are the last vehicle in the queue on a motorway ..... and in low vis?

true, but if in last in queue of mway I may also apply the hazards, epecially in the situation where the whole queue may not be visible (i.e. a hill or corner). Hazards are for exactly that, making you more visible to other road users (when you are in an unexpected situation) and this in turn may keep you safer.

By the dimmer argument, you could also if you're last in line in mway just press the pedal in hard so the brake lights are brighter

 

[whitenemesis]

Is the flashing brake lights part of the new PRE-SAFE BRAKE on MB cars?

From the 204 owner's handbook


Adaptive brake lamps

Adaptive brake lamps are only available in certain countries.

If you brake sharply from a speed of more than 50 km/h or if braking is assisted by BAS, the brake lamps flash rapidly. In this way, traffic travelling behind you is warned in an even more noticeable manner.
If you brake sharply from a speed of more than 70 km/h to a standstill, the hazard warning lamps are activated automatically. If the brakes are applied again, the brake lamps light up continuously. The hazard warning lamps switch off automatically if you travel faster than 10 km/h. You can also switch off the hazard warning lamps using the hazard warning switch button more.

 

[robert.saunders]

Thanks - I found this info out too, which all seems rather clever

http://www2.mercedes-benz.co.uk/con...models/c-class/w204/overview/safety.0005.html

 

[whitenemesis]

How long before drivers "jack-in"(?) as in a direct connection from brain to car....

 

[ringway]

Which reminds me:..

Today in the village as I came out of a shop there was a black BMW 645 cabriolet parked in a disabled space with a traffic warden just starting to make notes on his HHT.

The blonde 30+ woman running over to him from the faddy 'nail shop' didn't look too disabled to me....

Did he book her

 

[219]

Don't misread my words. I deliberately stated 'should' rather than 'must'.

Should/must - makes no difference - the use of a signal in no way alters the rules of priority .

I make no apology for always using an indicator in this situation. It's a signal to other road users who might otherwise be about to initiate an unexpected manoeuvre (eg. accelerate in lane 1 behind you, or move from lane 2 to lane 1 in your vicinity) of my presence and intention.

Whilst other drivers ought not to put themselves into conflict with you if you are arriving into a gap ahead of them ( traffic should be able to merge smoothly without any inconvenience to anyone ) , it is the driver joining the motorway who has to adjust speed to match that of traffic already on the carriageway , even to the extent of stopping and giving way , if neccessary .

If , as you come down the slip road , you are ahead of traffic on the carriageway , then they will clearly be able to see you and , since you cannot go anywhere other than onto the carriageway , the signal adds nothing to your presence , position and speed .

Whilst I am sure this is not your intention , sometimes a trafficator signal given by a vehicle joining a motorway can be seen as aggressive by some drivers who will then 'close the gap' and this can be counter productive . Deliberate 'blocking' of another vehicle is both dangerous and wrong , but still you have to give way to them because , alas , they are on the main carriageway .

You will just occasionally get the driver who delights in 'blocking' you because you are in a nice Mercedes and he is jealous what's that about ?

 

[219]

I was under the impression that ABS doesn't shorten stopping distances and may actually increase them - it only confers an increased ability to steer the vehicle in a situation where the brakes would otherwise lock-up.

BAS on the other hand ....

ABS , by preventing lock up of the wheels either on an adverse surface , or on a good surface during VERY hard braking allows the car to stop in a shorter distance than one which is 'skidding' with wheels locked .

It also allows some degree of steering due to the fact the wheels are still rotating .

Another benefit is not getting 'flat spots' on your tyres where you might have skidded for a distance with wheels locked and scrubbed rubber of one part of the tread .

 

[st4]

Its interesting that we use the motorway example of joining from a slip road and I'd agree with Derek that its fairly obvious when you're going when your on the mway slip.

However thought should still be given to the signal, for example @ night time it may make a road user more aware of you joining or in adverse weather conditions when visibility may not be so good and the drivers on the mway may very well benefit from your signal.

merging onto a dual carriage way can be more hazardous than an mway, as when the slip ends, so does the road, in an emergency on an mway slip there is always the hard shoulder if you run out of slip and you're not on the mway.

 

[Dieselman]

I'm sure I've followed a car that had "active" brake lights. On gentle slowing the lights were steady but when he had to brake harder because the queue suddenly stopped the lights flashed rapidly

Probably just a Ford Escort with dodgy wiring...

 

[robert.saunders]

haha my old Sierra had that problem, good ol' Dad earthed that problem in the boot