Is the used car market getting back to "normal"

[MikeInWimbledon]

As a vehicle they were astonishing, ours just didn't work, then the dealer backup was just a shambles. The big issue being when something occurs to the car (accident etc) you are restricted to one of 12 centres in the entire UK which have either one or two employees trained to repair them. So the entire UK Taycan fleet has circa 18 trained techs to effect mechanical repairs in the entire UK. It's not parts that are causing the wait times, it's lack of trained techs and facilities.

They also aren't a patch on a Panamera for quality fit and finish, but then a Panamera is more money, quite a lot more money like for like.

Your neighbour is being generous with his numbers. Look on Autotrader at the number of Taycan's for sale at non Porsche dealerships, it's an eyeopener. Porsche don't want them unless you give them the car on an SOR arrangement.

For sure he was generous on numbers, it was a casual conversation along the lines of "these things have dropped in value."

And a chuckle that its been so much money for a garden ornament that barely goes anywhere, like so many top end EV's.

Quality and reliability? "Shurely shome misteak?" EVangelists have been saying loud and clear since day one that EV's don't require maintenance, offering a huge saving in running costs. No engine, no clutch, no drivetrain, barely any brake use. It's only sceptical old dinosaurs, like me, who've raised issues of innovation risk, software gremlins, adjustment, component availability, lack of engineering support outside the Main Dealer Centres, and the risks around new tech, and new production plant at the new factories.

Still, we can't take it with us, can we? If we didn't borrow and spend money on new vehicles that lost half their value in the first three years, we'd only give the money to the tax man or ex-wife.

And, like the £100k CL500, I bought at 7 years old for £20k, it'll be jolly good value for someone "brave enough" to take on a seven year old luxury car.

 

[Skd884]

A friend owns a model 3 performance had it three years done 40k miles not spent a penny on it bar tyres.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

(Pauses to check Autotrader: Two thirds off at 44k miles... Oooh, Matron!)

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

A friend owns a model 3 performance had it three years done 40k miles not spent a penny on it bar tyres.

Sounds great. So just the £28k in lease payments then? Bargain.

 

[Scooby_Doo]

I was discussing EVs with a friend who has a Nissan Leaf. His original EV Leaf had the smaller battery which meant a recharge when going home to visit his family 200 miles away. Went back to the dealer 6 months ago and was offered a Leaf with the larger battery for £30k and a very good p/ex for his current car. He recently had the his new Leaf valued at £14.5k , not very happy.

 

[Red C220]

(Pauses to check Autotrader: Two thirds off at 44k miles... Oooh, Matron!)

View attachment 145194

I really like the Sport Tursimo version of these.

 

[zipdip]

Well I know a few car traders and at the moment people are buying diesels,but they want under 3 year old ones,one of the traders said he can sell all the small engine petrol cars he can get in the sub 6 grand bracket,they all say they have no EV on their lots,the major reason seems to be that if there is a come back on a sale they have no idea who will repair them and how much it will cost

 

[Red C220]

For sure he was generous on numbers, it was a casual conversation along the lines of "these things have dropped in value."

And a chuckle that its been so much money for a garden ornament that barely goes anywhere, like so many top end EV's.

Quality and reliability? "Shurely shome misteak?" EVangelists have been saying loud and clear since day one that EV's don't require maintenance, offering a huge saving in running costs. No engine, no clutch, no drivetrain, barely any brake use. It's only sceptical old dinosaurs, like me, who've raised issues of innovation risk, software gremlins, adjustment, component availability, lack of engineering support outside the Main Dealer Centres, and the risks around new tech, and new production plant at the new factories.

Still, we can't take it with us, can we? If we didn't borrow and spend money on new vehicles that lost half their value in the first three years, we'd only give the money to the tax man or ex-wife.

And, like the £100k CL500, I bought at 7 years old for £20k, it'll be jolly good value for someone "brave enough" to take on a seven year old luxury car.

The biggest eye opener was servicing. Porsche charge the same cost for an annual service on the Taycan as my Ferrari main dealer does for my FF. For what exactly?

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I was discussing EVs with a friend who has a Nissan Leaf. His original EV Leaf had the smaller battery which meant a recharge when going home to visit his family 200 miles away. Went back to the dealer 6 months ago and was offered a Leaf with the larger battery for £30k and a very good p/ex for his current car. He recently had the his new Leaf valued at £14.5k , not very happy.

Again, it's bid-ask spread. And he didn't actually pay £30k for it, he gave up his old car, and they gave him a chunky discount on the headline £30k price disguised as a "very good p/ex."

 

[Dryce]

,they all say they have no EV on their lots,the major reason seems to be that if there is a come back on a sale they have no idea who will repair them and how much it will cost

Interesting. I hadn't thought about this aspect - but thinking about it I haven't seen any EVs on the local independent used dealer lots.

 

[Dryce]

The biggest eye opener was servicing. Porsche charge the same cost for an annual service on the Taycan as my Ferrari main dealer does for my FF. For what exactly?

And yet we are told EVs are simpler.

That said .... how much do Porsche charge to service the cars with VW clone drive trains and platforms compared with the equivalent VW?

 

[Red C220]

And yet we are told EVs are simpler.

That said .... how much do Porsche charge to service the cars with VW clone drive trains and platforms compared with the equivalent VW?

The same applies to the Taycan and Audi eTron GT. Same car two very different service charges for the same thing.

 

[ALFAitalia]

(Pauses to check Autotrader: Two thirds off at 44k miles... Oooh, Matron!)

View attachment 145194

Forgetting the miles.....it is knocking on the door of ten years old. Before all the COVID car price nonsense most normal cars had lost at least 2/3 of their value after 10 years. Not a Porsche admittedly.....but how much less would that be worth if it was a full EV??? Peanuts I would guess.

 

[KennyN]

I was discussing EVs with a friend who has a Nissan Leaf. His original EV Leaf had the smaller battery which meant a recharge when going home to visit his family 200 miles away. Went back to the dealer 6 months ago and was offered a Leaf with the larger battery for £30k and a very good p/ex for his current car. He recently had the his new Leaf valued at £14.5k , not very happy.

A workmate purchased a 2018 Leaf from the MD around two years ago for around £18k and recently got a WBAC valuation of £3.5k , he ain't a happy bunny either as he is now in negative equity even after two years of payments.

I will stick with the ICE vehicles I have for the foreseeable thank you very much.

K

 

[ALFAitalia]

WBAC is not its actual value....its only trade sort of money....retail will be rather more...perhaps £5 to £6K.......still not great obviously!

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

A workmate purchased a 2018 Leaf from the MD around two years ago for around £18k and recently got a WBAC valuation of £3.5k , he ain't a happy bunny either as he is now in negative equity even after two years of payments.

I will stick with the ICE vehicles I have for the foreseeable thank you very much.

K

And so you should.... but WBAC is no reliable measure of a car's trade-in or its retail value.

We can be sure it's lost a chunk - maybe £3,500 a year, down to £11k private sale - but WBAC are just nudging him away.

Offer WBAC a relatively new Land Rover Defender and they'll offer some stupid low figure too. They just don't want to handle the trade.

Your chum has still saved a fortune (two thirds?) on petrol and road tax these last two years, and will continue to save over an equivalent Focus or Golf...

 

[Skd884]

China’s Abandoned, Obsolete Electric Cars Are Piling Up in Cities

A subsidy-fueled boom helped build China into an electric-car giant but left weed-infested lots across the nation brimming with unwanted battery-powered vehicles.

www.bloomberg.com

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

And yet we are told EVs are simpler.

That said .... how much do Porsche charge to service the cars with VW clone drive trains and platforms compared with the equivalent VW?

As RedC220 essentially notes, the Taycan and E-tron are the same J1 platform,

with half their components being the same, the differences being the cosmetics, interiors and "frilly bits" that make a Porsche different to an Audi.

You'd always expect Porsche to be more expensive than Audi, whatever the product.

The coffee and the receptionists are cuter when you service a Boxster rather than an Audi TT.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

A workmate purchased a 2018 Leaf from the MD around two years ago for around £18k and recently got a WBAC valuation of £3.5k , he ain't a happy bunny either as he is now in negative equity even after two years of payments.

I will stick with the ICE vehicles I have for the foreseeable thank you very much.

K

But buying a car when used car prices were soaring and selling when the market is struggling - and selling to WBAC - will account for a lot of - but not all of - that.

Deoreciation will be heavy because used cars will lose the temporary appreciation and some - or all - of the depreciation that they would have suffered anyway.

Rhetorical question: In 2018 how much would WBAC have offered for a 2013 Nissan Almera? I wouldn’t expect it to be too much more than £3.5k either.

I can understand him being gutted though.

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

The biggest eye opener was servicing. Porsche charge the same cost for an annual service on the Taycan as my Ferrari main dealer does for my FF. For what exactly?

If your car is less than 7 years old then that’s cheating!

Only joking. I assume yours is probably on PAYG now as almost all FFs must be out of the inclusive period now.

I’ve not got any experience of Taycan service costs - I’d expect them to be pricy for what they are but surely the Taycan is below the major services on the FF.

How much are Taycan services?