Merc Variable Valve Timing Vs Vanos

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owensmith

owensmith

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Hi Im new to this group just lookin for some unanswered questions! I have been wondering what is the difference between the merc and bmw valve timing as when you chip tune mercs and bmws they both act different the mercs seem to drink alot more but when you do it to a bmw they actually give you better mpg? anyone got any answers? I have tested 2 cars a V8 mercedes and an M3 straight 6 got 36mpg on the motorway but in the merc it gave me 24mpg? same speeds?

please can someone enlighten me!
 
I thought the M-B V8 lost variable valve timing in 1999 (when it went to 3 valves per cyl)?
 
owensmith said:
please can someone enlighten me!
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Possibly.
Two cars of dissimilar weight and output possibly driven through dissimilar gearboxes too.
When cruising at speed the major factor is aero drag at which point the Mercedes possibly requires less power to maintain speed, but once in town conditions the major factor is kinematic energy loss due to vehicle mass and drivetrain friction.

The V8 will have approximately 33% greater frictional loss than the I6, coupled with a slush box to really drag down efficiency.
The Merc weighs more than the M3 so requires more energy to accelerate at a given rate.

If one can't afford to run a Merc, buy a Beemer..;) :devil:
 
Is there anyway of changing timing of mercedes petrol cars to give the same type of performance and MPG of a BMW petrol car. I know if you increase power on diesels you can expect a considerable amount of MPG increase and I know also on petrol cars the only way to get better MPG is if the engine is running efficiently. but changing the timing and incresing power unless the BMW Range and MPG computer is not working correctly?
 
Both of our 4.3 V8's average 30mpg on the motorway .

No real way of chip tuning the 4.3 V8 of this vintage , you need to change eproms , you can't just remap.
 
Howard said:
Both of our 4.3 V8's average 30mpg on the motorway .

No real way of chip tuning the 4.3 V8 of this vintage , you need to change eproms , you can't just remap.
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Hi ,

This is incorrect the majority have communication via the K-line there are only a few wich are not able to be done .


15 BHP and 25 NM of torque

This is not the best engine to have if you are looking for economy . with a map you still may not even see 10% increase in consumption


Regards Gary
 
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I think to make it fairer you should do this experiment between an e430 and a BMW 540. Then you will see fairer results. Also make sure its a 540 after 1998 as the previous ones dont have a VANOS.
 
********* said:
Hi ,

This is incorrect the majority have communication via the K-line there are only a few wich are not able to be done .


15 BHP and 25 NM of torque

This is not the best engine to have if you are looking for economy . with a map you still may not even see 10% increase in consumption


Regards Gary
Click to expand...


Well , when i enquired about it at Ollys , that is what i was told ...

Another 15 bhp is hardly going to make any difference is it ? or 25 Nm of torque on something that puts out 400 Nm as standard ....

Not worried about economy , i'm doing my bit to destroy the Earth ...
 
No vvt on e430, fancy flaps in the inlet manifold but bog std valve layout.

As Howard says will do 30mpg at a steady 70ish, done about 1500 miles france recently 75 80 everywhere 27.7mpg.

I always thought and had heard bmw got worse mpg than mb.



Lynall
 
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Dieselman said:
From experience expect about 20% over-read on a BMW fuel computer.
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I've done some accurate calibrations on 2 BMW's and it's 8%.(petrol IL6 and V8)
You can go into the hidden dash menu and apply the correction factor.
Having done this the readout is remarkable accurate.

I'm not sure about modern Mercs but the old variable valve timing on my E320 only had 3 positions on the inlet cam whereas the BMW double VANOS has superior constantly variable adjustment on both.
 
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On Remap I found I had better throttle reponse, Speed Limiter was removed (never went over 140 thou) at higher speed 100+ fuel economy was better then 70. The 430 engine is the from the same family of M113 500, 55. And theres only 3 valves. I think the gearbox was mapped also as the gear changes where at different speeds!
 
Howard said:
Well , when i enquired about it at Ollys , that is what i was told ...

Another 15 bhp is hardly going to make any difference is it ? or 25 Nm of torque on something that puts out 400 Nm as standard ....

Not worried about economy , i'm doing my bit to destroy the Earth ...
Click to expand...


Was This @ A14 ?

Regards Gary
 
jaymanek said:
VANOS breaks a lot...mercs dont.
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Only on certain M-series engines.
I've never heard of mechanical failure on the BMW forums for IL6s.
The seals on the other hand do need renewal.
The procedure section of this website shows how to do it

http://www.beisansystems.com/

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The Vanos on my E39 M5 was replaced under warranty. Noisy gears and a failed pump.
 
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