Sudden loss of Mercedes.Me functionality

[JesefLeb]

I have the same problem,
But I had purchased the 'Remote & Navigation' package for 3 years which allows me to activate climate control (only available on hybrid model). I have 1 year left and this still works. So it seems like they will honour existing contracts.
The remote retrieval of vehicle status also still works. They just won't let me renew the 'remote' package for remote unlocking.
So clearly they still have the ability to remotely connect, presumably through a different network. they could easily find a solution if they cared at all.
I guess looking after their past customers is the last thing on their mind.

 

[markjay]

I have the same problem,
But I had purchased the 'Remote & Navigation' package for 3 years which allows me to activate climate control (only available on hybrid model). I have 1 year left and this still works. So it seems like they will honour existing contracts.
The remote retrieval of vehicle status also still works. They just won't let me renew the 'remote' package for remote unlocking.
So clearly they still have the ability to remotely connect, presumably through a different network. they could easily find a solution if they cared at all.
I guess looking after their past customers is the last thing on their mind.

This is the latest from Vodafone:

I doubt that MB switched to a different 3g provider. Most likely you are simply in an area where Vodafone have not yet switched off the 3g network.

 

[markjay]

Also, MB introduced the 3g modem in 2013, and switched from 3g to 4g in 2018, that's 5 years ago.

I don't know what revenue MB have from selling Mercedes me services to owners of 5 to 10 years old cars, but my guess is that it's not very much, and there's just no commercial viability for MB to invest in an alternative solution.

And, keeping in mind that the 3g modem (aka 'KOM Module') does not have a swappable SIM card, any change of GSM network would require at minimum reprogramming the 3g modem, or possibly replacing it completely - and how many owners of old cars will pay for that?

I know it's not a nice feeling when you're on the receiving end of a commercial situation that works against you, but ultimately car manufacturers are commercial organisations that are out to turn a profit.

As for customer care... there's a price to everything. Is it worthwhile for MB to keep happy owners of older cars? That's a good question. If you look at the posts in this forum, people recommend Indies over dealers, advise on how to buy pirated COMAND maps codes or copied Garmin SD-Cards, etc - I am not passing judgement, just trying to point out why the commercials just aren't there for MB when it comes to customer care for owners of older vehicles. Without the revenue, MB can't justify the expense.

 

[Connoisseur]

This can be chicken and egg. Evidence based learning means people do not trust Mercedes, because they have been kicked in the teeth by Mercedes previously. Loyalty is a two way street and after three years Mercedes dump people at will. Lexus take care of you for up to 10 yrs, and more, Kia commit to systems support for minimum of 7 years, Mercedes are not interested, tho’ prices are hi premium. So owners will do same, use pirated s/w, use independents, and where possible cheat, a la Mercedes. Mercedes like to blame Vodafone and 2g/3G switch off, but that is pure bull, MB were using 4g years and years go, they just couldn’t be ****d to support their volume customers. Lesson learned eh. I feel for Mercedes ev owners, now they will be in trouble when treated same.

It is a Mercedes commercial decision, and the USA class actions may find them out. Love driving the cars, nothing mor

 

[markjay]

This can be chicken and egg. Evidence based learning means people do not trust Mercedes, because they have been kicked in the teeth by Mercedes previously. Loyalty is a two way street and after three years Mercedes dump people at will. Lexus take care of you for up to 10 yrs, and more, Kia commit to systems support for minimum of 7 years, Mercedes are not interested, tho’ prices are hi premium. So owners will do same, use pirated s/w, use independents, and where possible cheat, a la Mercedes. Mercedes like to blame Vodafone and 2g/3G switch off, but that is pure bull, MB were using 4g years and years go, they just couldn’t be ****d to support their volume customers. Lesson learned eh. I feel for Mercedes ev owners, now they will be in trouble when treated same.

It is a Mercedes commercial decision, and the USA class actions may find them out. Love driving the cars, nothing mor

I agree with most of what you said, i.e. apart for "MB were using 4g years and years ago" - MB started fitting 4g modems to their cars in 2018, do it really depends on what you mean by "years and years go".

 

[Diesel Benz]

Mercedes had the 4G module available much earlier than 2018 although just an option initially. The W213 had the 4G option from the introduction, didn't check others.

This is not just an entertainment or convenience issue. eCall has been mandatory in the EU (I assume UK too) for years. Ignoring this safety feature for some cars less than 5 years old does not fit well to the safety image that MB advertises.

 

[markjay]

Mercedes had the 4G module available much earlier than 2018 although just an option initially. The W213 had the 4G option from the introduction, didn't check others.

This is not just an entertainment or convenience issue. eCall has been mandatory in the EU (I assume UK too) for years. Ignoring this safety feature for some cars less than 5 years old does not fit well to the safety image that MB advertises.

Fair enough, though the W213 was introduced as of the 2017 model year, so not a million miles off....

eCall because mandatory as of 2018. AFAIK by that time all new MB cars were already fitted with the 4g modem.

 

[Diesel Benz]

eCall because mandatory as of 2018. AFAIK by that time all new MB cars were already fitted with the 4g modem.

That makes things quite different, thought eCall was mandatory earlier on.

 

[Fastcar155]

Hi , as others have said it's the trust element regarding lack of customer services on out of warranty cars.
New Mercedes cars that go into the fleet are the back bone of the business model.

If the general public stop buying pre owned cars that would cause havoc in the motor trade but with insurance companies in some cases refusing to insure battery cars it I would not consider a battery car.

No doubt an insurance company will fill the void left may the majors and take a new product to market.

 

[Norris]

We have an expert who says they now can upgrade the communications module to 4G and all services can be re-established. Unfortunately the dealer network is not active but it should not take long before someone offers the same service in the UK.

Hello Diesel Benz, has there been any further advances on this 4G upgrade?

 

[Diesel Benz]

Hello Diesel Benz, has there been any further advances on this 4G upgrade?

Sorry if I was not clear, my comment was for a different market area, you must be interested about the UK market?

They do swap 3G modules to 4G in Germany too, makes several European countries.

 

[Norris]

Sorry if I was not clear, my comment was for a different market area, you must be interested about the UK market?

They do swap 3G modules to 4G in Germany too, makes several European countries.

Do you have contact details of the 'factory experts', that achieved this UMTS swap to LTE? or details of companies providing this service in Germany?

 

[Diesel Benz]

Do you have contact details of the 'factory experts', that achieved this UMTS swap to LTE? or details of companies providing this service in Germany?

Sorry, only know local experts and friends who have had it done in Germany (on a visit there).

 

[stompa]

Simple fix would be for Mercedes to allow the car to tether to a phone.

Could form an encrypted tunnel to mb servers via https or some other form.

 

[Diesel Benz]

Simple fix would be for Mercedes to allow the car to tether to a phone.

Could form an encrypted tunnel to mb servers via https or some other form.

The latest do that if you wanted to download updates or feed the internal hot spot from your phone instead of the built in modem but that is not enough for all Mercedes Me services. You would have to leave your phone to your car for remote connectivity and you would have to charge the car battery every time when parked (I believe the MBUX would have to remain active in order to use phone tethering all the time, plus keeping the phone charged).

 

[stompa]

The latest do that if you wanted to download updates or feed the internal hot spot from your phone instead of the built in modem but that is not enough for all Mercedes Me services. You would have to leave your phone to your car for remote connectivity and you would have to charge the car battery every time when parked (I believe the MBUX would have to remain active in order to use phone tethering all the time, plus keeping the phone charged).

If it can tether to a phone for WiFi then it could connect to home broadband too.

My brother had a mobile WiFi hotspot in his discovery using a cheap £2 per month sim.

Worked fine and was able to utilise all the remote features including demisting, remote start etc.

My s212 manual says the battery will likely need charging after 2 weeks of inactivity anyway, as do most modern cars with alarms etc.

For most of us, tethering to a phone would get useful paid extra services like internet radio, live traffic etc working, no tether then no use of these things advertised in the Mercedes me app.

 

[markjay]

Firstly, as things stand, Mercedes me does not connect to the (public) Internet. It connects to the Vodafone (private ) IP network and then routed to MB's central computer gateway. So having Internet access in the car via alternative means will not automatically replace the Mercedes me connection via the car's 4g modem.

The Mercedes me app sends remote commands to the MB central computer over the Internet, and these are then downloaded to the car via the Mercedes me connection (and not via the Internet).

Then, it is obviously possible - technically speaking - to replicate the Mercedes me functionally using the Internet and bypassing the Mercedes me 4g connection. However, there are serious security issues involved in doing so. It's not just a question of encrypting the data, but also for the car to be able to confirm the source of the incoming connection over the Internet. It can be done, but I'm not sure if car manufacturers will be too keen about it. It would be interesting to know if anyone has a car that supports remote commands sent over public Internet (and not via the manufacturer's dedicated 4g connection).

 

[BTB 500]

As an aside, I've had intermittent issues with the app getting data from my car (2019 W205, NTG5.5, 4G comms module) for the last couple of weeks. Coincidentally there was an OTA comms module software update on November 24th ...

I did a long trip yesterday and today the app still shows the car as being parked in Surrey rather than being back home. All the other data in the app is correct, timestamped at 20:51 when I got back. The day before we went to Birmingham and everything in the app was fine - we used it to walk back to the car park. But earlier in the week the app didn't update at all for a couple of days (with the car in use). I've emailed their support to see what they suggest.

 

[stompa]

Firstly, as things stand, Mercedes me does not connect to the (public) Internet. It connects to the Vodafone (private ) IP network and then routed to MB's central computer gateway. So having Internet access in the car via alternative means will not automatically replace the Mercedes me connection via the car's 4g modem.

The Mercedes me app sends remote commands to the MB central computer over the Internet, and these are then downloaded to the car via the Mercedes me connection (and not via the Internet).

Then, it is obviously possible - technically speaking - to replicate the Mercedes me functionally using the Internet and bypassing the Mercedes me 4g connection. However, there are serious security issues involved in doing so. It's not just a question of encrypting the data, but also for the car to be able to confirm the source of the incoming connection over the Internet. It can be done, but I'm not sure if car manufacturers will be too keen about it. It would be interesting to know if anyone has a car that supports remote commands sent over public Internet (and not via the manufacturer's dedicated 4g connection).

I’m fully aware of how Mercedes me connects and the use case with the private connection from Vodafone to Mercedes which is why I mentioned the use of the encrypted tunnels across the internet from the vehicles. Even though there is a private connection for the traffic from the car to Vodafone to Mercedes, Mercedes will still need to ensure that traffic is encrypted with proper controls like certificates at each end, revocation checking, certificate updates etc etc. even if it’s private it doesn’t mean it’s hacker proof, nothing to stop a hacker buying a wrecked Merc or just hiring 1 for the weekend and getting in to the Mercedes systems via that method, just another layer of the onion etc.

In my previous post I mentioned my brother had a discovery and had a mifi device in it using a cheap sim & all the car functions worked remotely via the mifi dongle.


I appreciate there are some things that Mercedes may want to keep very guarded via the private connection via Vodafone, but those features have stopped working for those with 3G only cars, & other features like live traffic (Here), internet radio (TuneIn) etc are not reliant on Mercedes servers, it’s disappointing that those non core Mercedes systems are rendered useless because the cellular technology has been obsoleted.

Looks very shortsighted of them to not build in capability for non core systems to connect via alternate means especially when competitors are offering fully functionality via other means.

Locking all car comms through the cars cellular connection means your dependent on that cellular company offering an ongoing service with wide coverage at a reasonable price, £11 a month is not reasonable when I’m already paying £8 for 30gbs on my phone.

 

[NewbieAMG]

Drove to Basingstoke a bit more than a week ago and ever since then, app is not updating with the latest data :/ I guess it's end of the line for older vehicles using the app?

called mercedes me support separately and the guy on the phone was very confident he knew what's going on. said he will send instructions via the email. well...delete the app and reinstall was his suggestion lol