Unbelievable !!!

[markjay]

In such an existential crisis - goals don't exist.
Maybe, an 'isolated tribe' could make it through without the depression of mourning luxury they never knew - but there is a shaky assumption there that their habitat survives.

The assumption is that humans are a highly adaptable-species.

Humans live in the Amazon forests as well as in the Arctic.

I am confident that 'humanity' will survive any changes to the planet in the coming millennia.

Whether modern society and civilisation will survive, is a different question.

 

[m80]

A pandemic that causes mass, but not complete, sterilization would slow the planets demise some.

Less screaming kids in the restaurants, bliss.
Less Chelsea tractors clogging the roads and pavements at school out time, joy.
Anybody know the balance between all the yutes that contribute constructively to societies and those that drain from them?
Although on balance it would seem that we all take more from the planet than we put in, pushing up a few roses can't convert that much Co2 surely.

 

[Bellow]

The assumption is that humans are a highly adaptable-species.

But won't even contemplate simple dietary change.

Humans live in the Amazon forests as well as in the Arctic.

Fast disappearing - both.

I am confident that 'humanity' will survive any changes to the planet in the coming millennia.

Only if they have the skill and resourcefulness - and a habitat some way amenable to existence.

Whether modern society and civilisation will survive, is a different question.

A bomb only explodes once.

 

[markjay]

Fast disappearing - both.

Because of pressures from the industrial society.

But if the reach of modern civilisation is in decline, these so-called 'primitive' societies will once-again flourish.

 

[Bellow]

Because of pressures from the industrial society.

Which show no real signs of abating.

But if the reach of modern civilisation is in decline, these so-called 'primitive' societies will once-again flourish.

Will they? Given what we know about too closely inter-breeding?

Does it even matter? We are just a species among many and many have expired before us. Without a belief (I don't possess) of some higher purpose, humankind will only have been the most intelligent species to have lived on the planet for a time. But not intelligent enough to realise the harms it created for itself early enough or willing to mitigate against them.
In the much longer term - assuming the planet will burn or freeze of its own accord - our obliteration was inevitable anyway. As I said, I don't see any 'higher purpose' in any of it.

 

[markjay]

Which show no real signs of abating.

Will they? Given what we know about too closely inter-breeding?

Does it even matter? We are just a species among many and many have expired before us. Without a belief (I don't possess) of some higher purpose, humankind will only have been the most intelligent species to have lived on the planet for a time. But not intelligent enough to realise the harms it created for itself early enough or willing to mitigate against them.
In the much longer term - assuming the planet will burn or freeze of its own accord - our obliteration was inevitable anyway. As I said, I don't see any 'higher purpose' in any of it.

....unless we propagate to other planets. An option you don't believe in, granted. But others do.

 

[Bellow]

....unless we propagate to other planets. An option you don't believe in, granted. But others do.

In writing my previous post, I realised that to me life is what happens day to day to day. And in a hospitable atmosphere that affords enormous freedom. I just don't see how anyone can covet spending so much time unable to do anything while hurtling through space in a rocket and on arrival having to be so encased just to survive. That to my mind is imprisonment. No thanks.

 

[markjay]

In writing my previous post, I realised that to me life is what happens day to day to day. And in a hospitable atmosphere that affords enormous freedom. I just don't see how anyone can covet spending so much time unable to do anything while hurtling through space in a rocket and on arrival having to be so encased just to survive. That to my mind is imprisonment. No thanks.

Equally, having seen the Golden Hind in the flesh and realising how tiny it was, personally I would have never endured spending months on end eating rotten food and drinking stale water while circumnavigating the world with Sir Francis Drake. Nor would I have served on a German U-Boat. Yet some did.

 

[Bellow]

Equally, having seen the Golden Hind in the flesh and realising how tiny it was, personally I would have never endured spending months on end eating rotten food and drinking stale water while circumnavigating the world with Sir Francis Drake.

But they had the option of returning to somewhere at least half way hospitable! And their destination did at least have breathable air.

Nor would I have served on a German U-Boat. Yet some did.

And they I suspect had little option but do so.

 

[markjay]

But they had the option of returning to somewhere at least half way hospitable! And their destination did at least have breathable air.


And they I suspect had little option but do so.

History records those great explorers who came back victorious with their crews, less so those who did not make it, of which there were quite a few.

And I think you are underestimating German patriotism during WW2. Those serving in the Kriegsmarine (and Luftwaffe, and Wehrmacht) were not necessarily subscribed to the Nazi ideology, but I think you'll find that they did willingly fight for their country (most of them did, anyway).

 

[Bellow]

History records those great explorers who came back victorious with their crews, less so those who did not make it, of which there were quite a few.

But realistically, comparing exploration of a benign planet with travelling from a merely slightly less hospitable than it has been known to be to one that is uninhabitable is a pretence too far. A pretence that distracts from what is required of us here.

And I think you are underestimating German patriotism during WW2.

Possibly - or maybe that's a can of worms I don't feel inclined to open.

Those serving in the Kriegsmarine (and Luftwaffe, and Wehrmacht) were not necessarily subscribed to the Nazi ideology, but I think you'll find that they did willingly fight for their country (most of them did, anyway).

Willingly or unwillingly, they fought. Not fighting? - can't see that as an available choice somehow.

 

[markjay]

But realistically, comparing exploration of a benign planet with travelling from a merely slightly less hospitable than it has been known to be to one that is uninhabitable is a pretence too far. A pretence that distracts from what is required of us here.


Possibly - or maybe that's a can of worms I don't feel inclined to open.



Willingly or unwillingly, they fought. Not fighting? - can't see that as an available choice somehow.

Setting the German troops' morale aside for a minute.... I personally think that for explores and discoverers of the ancient world, sailing into the horizon must have been just as perilous as space exploration today. Again, we only hear of those who made it... we don't know how many Phoenician, Viking, and Polynesian boats with their crews lie at the bottom of the respective oceans.

 

[Fastcar155]

But realistically, comparing exploration of a benign planet with travelling from a merely slightly less hospitable than it has been known to be to one that is uninhabitable is a pretence too far. A pretence that distracts from what is required of us here.


Possibly - or maybe that's a can of worms I don't feel inclined to open.



Willingly or unwillingly, they fought. Not fighting? - can't see that as an available choice somehow.

Hi and why did they fight , to feed their families.

 

[Bellow]

Setting the German troops' morale aside for a minute.... I personally think that for explores and discoverers of the ancient world, sailing into the horizon must have been just as perilous as space exploration today. Again, we only hear of those who made it... we don't know how many Phoenician, Viking, and Polynesian boats with their crews lie at the bottom of the respective oceans.

Nope.
The parallel for your case is the rocket exploding at launch, flight, etc. - machinery failure. Not one of the explorers you allude to sailed into a vacuum. Or an environment where the production of food was impossible. Or a zero gravity situation.

 

[Gollom]

We are going down to London to see a show next month and I think my S204 will attract the expanded ULEZ by about 1 street! Will be parking up where we are staying on the 3rd then moving again on the 7th to leave. Do they give a grace period for the first week or so? Do I have to pay for the full period or just when the car moves (i.e. 2 days) Curses!!!

 

[SW18]

We are going down to London to see a show next month and I think my S204 will attract the expanded ULEZ by about 1 street! Will be parking up where we are staying on the 3rd then moving again on the 7th to leave. Do they give a grace period for the first week or so? Do I have to pay for the full period or just when the car moves (i.e. 2 days) Curses!!!

There's no (official) mention of a grace period, though I do wonder if the first letter to the the non-compliant will be a warning rather than a fine. And if you are only just going to be in the zone, will you even get caught on camera? Not every entry point can have cameras, there are surely too many. I have not seen a forest of new cameras going up on every side street into the zone. But who knows, that could be risky...

So it might be safest to pay up (it's only payable on the days where you actually drive in the zone).

But, more simply, could you stay out of the zone and park a street or two further away?

 

[Gollom]

There's no (official) mention of a grace period, though I do wonder if the first letter to the the non-compliant will be a warning rather than a fine. And if you are only just going to be in the zone, will you even get caught on camera? Not every entry point can have cameras, there are surely too many. I have not seen a forest of new cameras going up on every side street into the zone. But who knows, that could be risky...

So it might be safest to pay up (it's only payable on the days where you actually drive in the zone).

But, more simply, could you stay out of the zone and park a street or two further away?

Thanks. The place we are staying (NW2) has private drive parking - not sure if I'd want to park in a random street or car park

 

[roviw1]

We are going down to London to see a show next month and I think my S204 will attract the expanded ULEZ by about 1 street! Will be parking up where we are staying on the 3rd then moving again on the 7th to leave. Do they give a grace period for the first week or so? Do I have to pay for the full period or just when the car moves (i.e. 2 days) Curses!!!

I would be inclined to pay the charge for the day you arrive and also for the day you leave. If the car is on a drive and not moved then no camera can " spot it " on the interim days. I know it will cost you 2 x £12-50 but it will give you peace of mind, wheras if you tried to avoid paying then I guess you could be liable for a £30 or so fine each time it is moved.

 

[Fastcar155]

Hi , can't members just open an account with Tfl ?

 

[Dippo]

Hi , can't members just open an account with Tfl ?

I don't think there are any special terms for MB Club members - anyone can open an account.