W204 C220 CDI vibration problem

[fuzzer]

W204 C220 Cdi

For those of you who have driven the W204 C220 CDI 5 speed auto...


Did you notice that around 30mph - 40mph when the box has stopped changing gear and is just crusing allong that if you reach even the slightest incline the engine labours quite violently and shakes the wheel?

Im trying to work out of it was just the demonstrator i had on an extended loan or if it was a Characteristic of the car.

Im interested on your thoughts.

Its almost like the gearing is too tall and the autobox has been programmed to change up as quick as possible and its only doing 1400rpm and its outwith the torque band and this the weedy 2.2 natuarally asperated bit has to pull 1.5 tonnes allong on its own without the help of the turbo and it doesnt like it.

I love the car , but the refinement of the engine/transmission isnt a patch on the bmw setup which i find very disappointing

 

[Rory]

Have you seen this thread (someone has already linked back from there):
http://forums.mercedesclub.org.uk/showthread.php?t=35719

I wonder if it's been done so as to get the lowest emissions (therefore best fuel consumption) possible in the EU tests?

 

[fuzzer]

ahh , thats the blighter.

So , wasnt just the car i was driving then. Seeing as i spend a lot of time at 30mph id need to be off my rocker to buy the car.

It makes it really uncomfortable to drive.

Can't complain about the mpg tho. Was getting 46 on the motorway at 70 and about 35-38 in town.

Personally i recon its to do with the 5 speed box. There seems to be a big jump in ratio size between 3rd and 4th.

 

[st13phil]

fuzzer, I've been contributing to the thread linked by Rory on the other forum and do not have the issue you describe with my W204. Rather than cross-post all my comments here, please take another look at my post #10 in that thread for details.

Did you notice that around 30mph - 40mph when the box has stopped changing gear and is just crusing allong that if you reach even the slightest incline the engine labours quite violently and shakes the wheel?

Im trying to work out of it was just the demonstrator i had on an extended loan or if it was a Characteristic of the car.

After reading your post I took the car for another quick spin and let it settle at ~38mph on the flat just before an incline and engaged cruise. It quite happily pulled with no vibration until the incline steepened into a hill at which point it downshifted and continued - all with no vibration.

So, in summary I'd say that there was an issue with the demonstrator you drove and that it's not a characteristic of the car. However, it appears that there are at least three other W204's that are exhibiting similar traits (Paul Rickards', philb's and the bloke who posted on What Car's reader reviews), so the problem isn't unique to your demonstator. Either that or I've got the only good one and all the other W204's have a problem

 

[fuzzer]

hmm , seems a bit of a lottery.

What i don't want is to be left with a car with the vibration and to be told that its just the way it is ...

Compounding this i was wanting to do a factory collection too i can't see the dealer being much interested after ive put 3k miles on in a week.

The problem was so bad i would reject the car tbh

 

[st13phil]

I must admit that when I read two stories about this issue while awaiting delivery of my car (my dealer's demo didn't exhibit the problem), I was starting to get a bit concerned. However, more than 250,000 W204's were sold in 2007 which is a pretty large number (I accept that these are not all 2.2 diesels with the 5-speed 'box, but that model must represent a substantial proportion of the total) and there have now been 4 examples of this issue posted on forums. Bearing in mind that t'internet tends to be a place where people who have a problem with a car turn these days, if this were widespread I would have expected to see lots of "me too" posts by now. Having said all that I quite understand your concern and if I had a W204 that exhibited the problem as you described it and if both the dealer and MB sloped shoulders, I would have rejected it too. Frankly, what puzzles me is that your dealer was happy for one of their demonstrators to go out on loan with such an obvious fault

If you're still interested in the car then I'd talk to the dealer and see what they have to say about it when you tell them that you placing an order is contingent upon them demonstrating that a) another demo car doesn't exhibit the fault and b) that they can demonstrate that the original car is fixable.

To be honest, whilst I'm very happy with my car, if I'd had the experience with a demonstrator that you have then I'd be cautious about committing to purchase though

 

[jaymanek]

The A160 CDI my uncle owns has the CVT auto box, this does exactly what you describe, but its normal as ive driven a few that do it..

 

[Rory]

hmm , seems a bit of a lottery.

What i don't want is to be left with a car with the vibration and to be told that its just the way it is ...

That would seem to be standard practice with Mercedes - it you're unfortunate to get a car with a subtle issue then they just say "some do it and some don't"

Compounding this i was wanting to do a factory collection too i can't see the dealer being much interested after ive put 3k miles on in a week.

The problem was so bad i would reject the car tbh

They would probably tell you to run it for a while and "see how it goes".

I had a Mondeo TDCi deisel auto on extended demo a few yrs ago and exhibited similar traits - I had to manually select 3rd at 30MPH. Leaving it in auto the engine was trying to run at 1000RPM.

 

[fuzzer]

ah well , at least i know its not just me.

Im going to drive the new 177bhp bmw 2.0d engine this week.

Ill let you know how i get on.

 

[Aoraki]

I've had a W204 for about 4 months now, and I only have praise for it. No signs of the problem you had observed, in fact I thought what a good g/box it was.

 

[Kobus Louw]

Not the only odd one in the world?

I am driving a new C 220 CDI. I have surfed the net in search of some indications as to somebody having the same experiances I am having with this vehicle? I have now found this forum and some mentioning of this problem in Australia. The vibration problem I have is exactly the same as all the links I have picked up.

Herewith my route I have taken to try and rectify the problem:
1) Vehicle returned to dealer for re-programming (which took 1 week!!) Problem not solved!
2) Vehicle returned to dealer for valve body replacement. I must admit there was an improvement but still not 100%.
3) Had the vehicle back to the dealer as the Head Office technical specialists wanted to have look at the problem. They did not want to drive the vehicle and insisted that I drive it. After driving around where I can feel the vibrations and the not so smooth gear changes (you need to be very sensitive to pick it up) they declared that the vehicle is normal!.
4) I then took another C 220 CDI from the dealer and as I drove of I immediately commented to them that the gear changes is much smoother and could not feel the vibrations that promminently.

My conclusion on this situation is that MB will not admitt (the Head office technical guy did admitt they are having problems with the programming and valve bodies) that the gearbox /engine match is not perfect and that I will have to live with this!

This is my first MB and I am not happy with what I got, I now need to either accept this or get rid of this vehicle!

By the way I am from sunny South Africa!

 

[Dieselman]

See if they can lock out the torque converter lock up clutch as it sounds like it's biting a bit too hard so causing vibration to be transmitted.

There will always be a threshold of acceptable vibration and this will be worse with a torquey 4 cylinder engine, especially at low revs. It may well be classed as normal.

 

[zabeer1961]

My 2008 220CDi done about 2000km.
I'm experiencing the same problem .dealer tried software patches twice within this month and torque converter adoptation was also done.
No help.
Dealer wants me to wait one more month to see if there are anymore software patches from MB.
Oh, by the way I'm in India !

 

[SEM]

I've been out and tested the speed that you indicate, but i'm not getting any of the same problems (yet), tried in all 3 modes. Mine is also a Dec as per the other thread has about 4k on it now. 2nd to 3rd gear change at 2500rpm

 

[fuzzer]

See if they can lock out the torque converter lock up clutch as it sounds like it's biting a bit too hard so causing vibration to be transmitted.

There will always be a threshold of acceptable vibration and this will be worse with a torquey 4 cylinder engine, especially at low revs. It may well be classed as normal.

ive had 4 220 cdi engines in 202 ,203,210 and 211 bodies and none of them vibrate like this , its not what youre saying , its down to a design problem or some sort.

 

[Kobus Louw]

Well I have just recieved an reply from MB Head office in South Africa where by they declare the vehicle 100% to specification. This is what I have expected they will say as I have never once got the feeling that they are serious in trying to rectify the problem. The feeling I got was that they are trying to make me feel like I am the only one having this problem! I have mentioned to them the fact the I have picked up all of the links on this forum regarding this exact problem. Most of the motoring magazines in RSA that I have read where they have tested this specific model have had the very same feeling after driving the vehicle!

Their aswer to that" One must be carefull as the journalist might be bias to certain brands" So after what I have expected to be a reputable brand and great quality vehicle I have to now accept the fact that I will have to live with this problem or get rid of the car as MB is not willing to address this issue!

Kobus Louw.

 

[Rory]

Well I have just recieved an reply from MB Head office in South Africa where by they declare the vehicle 100% to specification. This is what I have expected they will say as I have never once got the feeling that they are serious in trying to rectify the problem. The feeling I got was that they are trying to make me feel like I am the only one having this problem! I have mentioned to them the fact the I have picked up all of the links on this forum regarding this exact problem. Most of the motoring magazines in RSA that I have read where they have tested this specific model have had the very same feeling after driving the vehicle!

Their aswer to that" One must be carefull as the journalist might be bias to certain brands" So after what I have expected to be a reputable brand and great quality vehicle I have to now accept the fact that I will have to live with this problem or get rid of the car as MB is not willing to address this issue!

Kobus Louw.

Do any of the local magazines have a good reputation for helping sort out problems with manufacturers? It might be worth contacting them and asking for assistance - they also may not take kindly to be being accused of bias, although I would tend to keep that comment in reserve for now.

 

[Kobus Louw]

My last resort!

I have as I have told MB that I will do spread the word regarding the poor and terrible performance of the "100% within MB specification" transmision problems to the local motoring magazines and every body that would like to listen (especially the BMW and Audi guys!).

I have given MB RSA a last chance to look in to the problem and they have once again failed to respond as they have closed the case and would like me to accept that the vehicle is 100% up to standard. Every Km that I am traveling with this vehicle is in disgust and disappointment as I cannot accept the poor performance of this automatic transmision. This is the worst car I have ever driven with an auto box!!

I have now handed over this most disapointing situation over to the motor industries ombudsman in RSA to see if they can work something out with MB.

I have to admit that I have made a very bad choice in purchasing this vehicle and that my dream of owning a MB have turned into a nightmare!!

Greetings from sunny RSA.

 

[Rory]

You're not the first person to complain about this issue, and it certainly makes me unsure about changing my 4 yr old C270CDi for a new C220CDi.

 

[Petje]

There's someone on a Dutch MB forum who has the same probs, they have fitted a new torque convertor, update the software and the problem is solved. Software update must be done when the engine is cold.