W211 E55 - Predicting Value over the next few years

[Will]

Interesting part of that is the # of sh*theaps that get bought up in the US to be shipped back across the Atlantic. I have not really seen the trend going the other way.

You're right, the MOT is pretty rigorous. That's one of the points I was making earlier. A car won't be £6000 one year and worthless the next right? There will be advisories, resulting in failures and after a while, it becomes a toss up as to whether one should sink the money into it vs selling it for scrap or close to scrap with a short MOT to somebody as a fixer upper.

Why do I think that # is £2000? To me, it's the # that makes sense as the bottom dollar. Nobody will scrap a £6000 car because no scrappy will give that much for it. Very few people would put £3-4000 into a £6000 car with differed repairs so the floor can't be £6000.

If it makes anyone feel better, the E55's seem to be holding up better than E63's as can be seen by 2007 E63 sales recordings from the same auction company. How are W211 E63's doing in the UK?

View attachment 99043

The trouble is, you can’t knock £4k off the value of a car that you think is worth £6k just because someone feels that it needs that amount spending on it. Doesn’t always work like that, and most of the time that work will be quoted at garage rates. When cars get to this sort of age they often fall into the hands of enthusiasts who will either do the work themselves, do it in stages or shop around for better prices on the parts and labour.

But like I was trying to say earlier, £6000 would (if any were available) buy a car with issues, that’s why it would be priced at £6000 and not £8/9k+. There aren’t any E55Ks available for £6000 either, it’s £9k at the bottom end of the market at the moment, and that to me looks like the sort of car that will still need money spent on it, if nothing else due to the typical stuff these cars need at that age/mileage.

Almost all of these cars will have some issues/deferred maintenance as you put it. Check out the MOT histories of most of the examples on sale and they will all pick up on stuff as to be expected for the majority of these older cars. There’s always some work to do next

This £2000 figure you keep mentioning is nonsense, because no-one would let a running M113K engined car sell for that amount. As a spares/repairs proposition, running but in need of TLC I would still expect one to sell for more like £5k, but as I keep saying I’ve never seen a single example sell that low either...hence you’ll be in for a very long wait with your £2000 figure that you keep repeating

Speculate all you like, but you’re wrong about the prices - and I speak as someone who’s bought and sold a couple of these cars in this country and followed the prices of these for some time now. I no longer own one so have no vested interest, but I think I have a good understanding for the market on these

FWIW, E63s are still fetching over £10k+ for early 2007/8 cars with high mileage (and no doubt some ‘deferred maintenance’), most are advertised £12-14k unless there’s something wrong with them (or more for very nice examples)

Cheapest one I can see on sale today is a 2007 car on eBay priced @ £11k with 131k miles and some documented issues, On autotrader it’s nearer £13/14k for cars with 70-90kish miles - typical examples.

What were you saying about cars depreciating quicker in the UK than the US again? You’ve just posted up data that simply doesn’t agree with you

 

[Alex]

In the country where "everything is cheaper" it's logical for cars to follow the same trend.

Saying otherwise is a wishful thinking.

 

[alabbasi]

The trouble is, you can’t knock £4k off the value of a car that you think is worth £6k just because someone feels that it needs that amount spending on it. Doesn’t always work like that, and most of the time that work will be quoted at garage rates. When cars get to this sort of age they often fall into the hands of enthusiasts who will either do the work themselves, do it in stages or shop around for better prices on the parts and labour.

But like I was trying to say earlier, £6000 would (if any were available) buy a car with issues, that’s why it would be priced at £6000 and not £8/9k+. There aren’t any E55Ks available for £6000 either, it’s £9k at the bottom end of the market at the moment, and that to me looks like the sort of car that will still need money spent on it, if nothing else due to the typical stuff these cars need at that age/mileage.

Almost all of these cars will have some issues/deferred maintenance as you put it. Check out the MOT histories of most of the examples on sale and they will all pick up on stuff as to be expected for the majority of these older cars. There’s always some work to do next

This £2000 figure you keep mentioning is nonsense, because no-one would let a running M113K engined car sell for that amount. As a spares/repairs proposition, running but in need of TLC I would still expect one to sell for more like £5k, but as I keep saying I’ve never seen a single example sell that low either...hence you’ll be in for a very long wait with your £2000 figure that you keep repeating

Speculate all you like, but you’re wrong about the prices - and I speak as someone who’s bought and sold a couple of these cars in this country and followed the prices of these for some time now. I no longer own one so have no vested interest, but I think I have a good understanding for the market on these

FWIW, E63s are still fetching over £10k+ for early 2007/8 cars with high mileage (and no doubt some ‘deferred maintenance’), most are advertised £12-14k unless there’s something wrong with them (or more for very nice examples)

Cheapest one I can see on sale today is a 2007 car on eBay priced @ £11k with 131k miles and some documented issues, On autotrader it’s nearer £13/14k for cars with 70-90kish miles - typical examples.

What were you saying about cars depreciating quicker in the UK than the US again? You’ve just posted up data that simply doesn’t agree with you

I'm posting sales at auctions, you're talking about cars listed for sale. Asking prices and sales prices are two different things.

Like I said, never say never.

 

[Will]

Have a look around at UK sold prices then, but generally values on the ‘63 are higher than the 55K in the 211 chassis.

Knock a chunk off the asking prices if you like, but it’s fair to say they’re holding above £10k unless they’re salvage cars or with major issues.

Auction wise I found these:

Brooklands Motor Museum 7th July 2018 Sale

Auction Details - Specialist Classic & Sports Car Auctioneers

www.historics.co.uk

Brooklands Motor Museum 19th May 2018

Auction Details - Specialist Classic & Sports Car Auctioneers

www.historics.co.uk

Not recent sales but gives you a guide of what they make at auction. Similar to private sales I think.

I sold a low mileage 2011 E63 (212 chassis) last year for £24750 to a dealer for a direct sale, large petrol performance cars are popular with enthusiasts in the UK and people pay good money for them even when they’re considered older cars, compared to where you are from

 

[Doodle]

Yeah but breakers are businesses , not charities. They need to make money and won't buy a 6000gbp car to yield 6000gbp parts. There's another thread going on right now about scrap values. You're welcome to check in on it.

Who said anything about businesses? In the UK they will often get their cars from alternative sources such as insurance write offs etc - Cat B territory. This is exactly where my A8 ended up.

 

[pmcgsmurf]

We seem to be going around in circles here.

I see no evidence provided of any W211 E55 clean running cars selling for £2,000/$2,000 or anywhere close other than these secret auctions.
Sounds like a bit of bad business by the auction house, if they opened it up as a public auction prices would go higher.

Best to end that discussion and get back on topic.

 

[alabbasi]

We seem to be going around in circles here.

I see no evidence provided of any W211 E55 clean running cars selling for £2,000/$2,000 or anywhere close other than these secret auctions.
Sounds like a bit of bad business by the auction house, if they opened it up as a public auction prices would go higher.

Best to end that discussion and get back on topic.

Yep, per my original post. I said it will happen. Topic was predicting value. My prediction is that prices will bottom out, probably at around 2k for the worse ones and when they are gone. Prices will go back up.

 

[Will]

Shall we just archive this thread and maybe we can bump it every year until Al finds us a few of these £2000 cars?

 

[pmcgsmurf]

Shall we just archive this thread and maybe we can bump it every year until Al finds us a few of these £2000 cars?

Sounds like a good idea. ^

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I'm reminded of a series of £10k cars I've known over time. E type coupes, Aston DBS, Porsche 928s, and a lovely M635. (Not from the same year).

All comfortably worth £25 to £75k now.

Did they go up in value ? Did they heck.

Most got scrapped, a few got totally rebuilt at enormous cost by people who loved them and who thought it was worth funding renovations either bit by bit, or as a big project.

 

[alabbasi]

I'm reminded of a series of £10k cars I've known over time. E type coupes, Aston DBS, Porsche 928s, and a lovely M635. (Not from the same year).

Nice, I paid $4500 for my M635, i need to dust it off. I'm pretty sure that was the bottom dollar on this car.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Nice, I paid $4500 for my M635, i need to dust it off. I'm pretty sure that was the bottom dollar on this car.

Get that duster out. That M635 is worth £60,000 with a bit of a polish. It is 60,000 miles and in excellent cosmetic and running condition, isn't it ?

1990 BMW M635 CSi | Essen 2019 | RM Sotheby's

1990 BMW M635 CSi for sale at RM Sotheby's Essen

rmsothebys.com

 

[alabbasi]

Get that duster out. That M635 is worth £60,000 with a bit of a polish. It is 60,000 miles and in excellent cosmetic and running condition, isn't it ?

It's actually in pretty decent shape. So is the 928 S4 next to it (which I paid even less for). They both have recent paint jobs and the M635CSI has a brand new leather interior. The problem with my shop is that I have one door in and out. Once a car is a few cars in. It never comes out.

Both are completely rust free.

M635CSI is still on its metric tires. I suspect it still has 1985 air in them.





Now we've gone completely off the rails

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

Now we've gone completely off the rails

Who needs rails ?

Start 'em up, drive them up to Chicago and get them shipped to Europe.

Biff Boff $60k in your pocket. How hard can it be?

Or are they really not quite in the same condition as high value auction cars? Which was my point.

(Accepted that Texas cars don't do the rust thing, but 1985 tyres is 35 year old tyres etc etc etc)

 

[alabbasi]

Or are they really not quite in the same condition as high value auction cars? Which was my point.

(Accepted that Texas cars don't do the rust thing, but 1985 tyres is 35 year old tyres etc etc etc)

I don't think that they're 60k GBP cars, but I think I bought them right. That might be because I know something about what I'm saying or I could be the Forest Gump of car buying. I have a set of 17" 2pc style 5 wheels, but it pays to keep the original wheels with it.

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I don't think that they're 60k GBP cars, but I think I bought them right. That might be because I know something about what I'm saying or I could be the Forest Gump of car buying. I have a set of 17" 2pc style 5 wheels, but it pays to keep the original wheels with it.

Understood. One day I'll get over to visit my brother just outside of Denton and give you a call to look see what you've got in there.....

 

[AaronE55Cripps]

I just cant see that happening.

Dont believe it guys. It could happen. With all governments pushing to hit emission targets I would definitely be worrying about it if I were you. It’s a clear sign that AMG’s are now building 4.0L V8 with turbos rather than big 5.5L or 6.2L. It’s all about the targets and reducing emissions.
living here in Ireland my road tax is 2000€/year. It might not go as high as 4500£ for UK drivers, I think that is a bit of sensationalism thrown in.... It’s with a heavy heart that I’m paying 500€ every three months to drive on crap roads but us driving enthusiasts are going to be continually pusnished for the foreseeable future for our love of the combustion engine.

sorry to be the bearer of such bad news but I think it’s likely to happen at some time in the near future unless you get Yourselves a petrolhead for a PM.

 

[AaronE55Cripps]

The thing is the ‘55k came in so many models that it doesn’t really make the E55 stand out - you also have the CLS55 and S55 four doors, then the CL55 and SL55 as well as others.

These cars appeal to a relatively small market of enthusiasts, if they were more popular then the prices would reflect that

I think they bottomed out at around £5/6k - as they would break for that amount, and are probably as much in demand for engine and gearbox transplants, brakes and stuff at that sort of price point.

You say you bought yours for a relatively low price (no doubt as a result of the write off in the history?) so I wouldn’t expect much different when you come to sell

Just be happy that you’ve got to enjoy a fantastic AMG V8 for a very low price relative to its new cost

Sorry I’m not sure I completely agree with this. Yes there were a fair few 55 / 55K models and variants and there are still a fair few left. But I think prices will at some point eventually start to slowly increase.

Personally I don’t believe in buying cars to leave them sat in a garage they should be driven and enjoyed. A car I love is the Lotus Carlton and I wish I had bought one of those when the prices were as low as 20k. Now you are lucky if you see one for less than 50k some are as high as 70k + that’s if you can find a decent one for sale. Wish I had bought one when I had the chance....

I think values are close to being bottomed out and im sure the 55 and 55K variants will have a rise in value over time. But I defiinately agree with enjoy the fantastic V8 and get out and drive it.

 

[Alex]

So to understand. In one post you're saying the combusted engine cars will all have scrap values due to tighter emmissions. And in another, that prices will start to creep up. I guess that clears it all up, @AaronE55Cripps. Thanks buddy!

 

[Bobby Dazzler]

Sorry I’m not sure I completely agree with this. Yes there were a fair few 55 / 55K models and variants and there are still a fair few left. But I think prices will at some point eventually start to slowly increase.

Personally I don’t believe in buying cars to leave them sat in a garage they should be driven and enjoyed. A car I love is the Lotus Carlton and I wish I had bought one of those when the prices were as low as 20k. Now you are lucky if you see one for less than 50k some are as high as 70k + that’s if you can find a decent one for sale. Wish I had bought one when I had the chance....

I think values are close to being bottomed out and im sure the 55 and 55K variants will have a rise in value over time. But I defiinately agree with enjoy the fantastic V8 and get out and drive it.

I think Will was making the same point, he said “bottomed out” which means no longer falling.