What E300TD sold in the UK?

[greg123]

Hi,

I'm now after a W124 3.0 turbo diesel. Can anyone tell me what years/how I can tell? None of the 300D/E300D mention turbos in the adverts, Parkers indicate that ALL 3.0 litre W124's were turbo, those before about 1993 being lower power (no intercooler?) and the later 'E300D' badged ones running 147bhp.

Anyone got comments on this? It has to be as big on power as possible, also a 1st gear start if possible. So was thinking 1992ish 300TD Auto estate (also requirements).

Anyone got some guides? My current Volvo 960 has air con/cruise/leather etc and I'd like to keep that too, were they all options on the Merc and therefore pot luck what I would get?

Cheers, Greg.

 

[Dieselman]

No 124 version diesels were sold as turbo because the steering box is in the way.

TB turbos do a conversion, so you could add one if you wish.

Just looked in Parkers...no mention of turbo engines!

 

[Motard]

No 124 version diesels were sold as turbo because the steering box is in the way.

I have two 124 diesel owners manuals, one in English for saloons and my original one in Italian for estates. Both of them list 300D and 300D Turbo, TD Turbo for the estate.
The 300D has 80kw power and 185Nm of torque. The 300D Turbo has 105kw power and 267Nm torque.
A quick check on German sites found one or two for sale compared with 100s of 300Ds so they may be a rare beast.

Bob

 

[Anders]

No 124 version diesels were sold as turbo because the steering box is in the way.

You mean in RHD? The W124 3 litre TD is well known in Belgium, but alas only as LHD.

 

[Motard]

Anders,

There are lots of 300D 124s around both as estates and saloons, not many Turbo versions though as far as I can gather. The only reason I know they exist is because they are listed in my owners manual, never seen one.

Bob

 

[Motard]

Curioser and curioser!

When I wrote the preceding posts I had the English owners manual in front of me, now I have found the Italian one. Not only does it list the 300TD Turbo (type 124 193, 124 133 for English saloon) it also lists a 250D Turbo! This is type 124 188. Comparing the manuals one must assume the latter wasn't available in UK.

Bob

 

[greg123]

Well this is interesting. I have seen 5 UK turbo's on Autotrader, including two 3.0's. Parkers DOES list them online and also my UK haynes manual lists a 2.5 and 3.0 turbo. Does anyone have merc contacts and can find out how many of what were sold? I want a 3.0 turbo and would like to know the years it was made.

 

[Dieselman]

Well this is interesting. I have seen 5 UK turbo's on Autotrader, including two 3.0's. Parkers DOES list them online and also my UK haynes manual lists a 2.5 and 3.0 turbo. Does anyone have merc contacts and can find out how many of what were sold? I want a 3.0 turbo and would like to know the years it was made.

You aren't going to find a UK W124 TurboD! The first UK turboDs were the W202 C250 and then the W210 E300.

All references to Turbodiesels in English brochures and manuals are for US vehicles. This was MBs largest diesel sales area in the '70s and '80s.
They had W123 diesels and turbos and S class turbos.

Any referance to TD for a W123 or W124 means that it is an estate car. T= wagon.
Turbodiesels were denoted as TDT.

Sorry to spoil the party but this is fact.

If you have Autotrader ads that contradict this then please post the link.

Regards

 

[jaymanek]

Autotrader ads are often inacurate. Even some traders think the TD means turbo - it doesnt!
Dieselman is correct with the facts and the reasoning.

Jay

 

[greg123]

Well I have seen one 3.0 - 6 cyl advertised, around 1991 year with a 'factory fitted turbo' worth £4,500. So how does that work? It was RHD. I see what you are saying though, I can't find many others so I guess it must be correct. Annoying though, I coulnd't live with the non-turbo performance. C class is too new/expensive, guess I'm back to the BMW 5-series then. That 2.5 comes only in turbo and it goes very well. I really wanted the e-class though! How about the E250D's, did they do turbo's in them?

 

[Dieselman]

No E250 turbos.

Be aware that the BMW 2.5 litre diesels come in two forms. The td versions have no intercooler and the tds versions do.
A BMW 2.5 td will go no better than a MB 3.0 24v with no turbo.

The MB3.0 24v diesel is 136 BHP so is not really slow. 0-60 in about 10.5s.
BMW 2.5 td is 115 Bhp and tds 143 Bhp, but the Merc has more torque than either.

Also the BMW engine is short on both power and torque so needs to be given a lot of stick and revs to make things happen. This is tiring in a manual, but ok in an auto (apart from the extra noise, and I mean noise).

Test all models in question before taking the plunge.

In addition MB in-line diesel pumps will handle just about any fuel, where as the rotary pump on the BMW may not be strong enough for veg oil.

 

[Motard]

No E250 turbos.

First of all I know nothing about this subject other than what I see in the two owners manuals I have. Do you doubt they made E250 Turbos Dieselman or are you saying they didn't import them into UK? It isn't listed in my UK owners manual but it is in the Italian one. Gladly send you a photocopy of the relevant pages.
Makes sense about the market being for the US only. The cars listed in my manual (Italian one) are listed as 300TD Turbo and 250TD Turbo, not as 300TDT etc though I have seen them listed so in the US. Saw another 124 in the US listed as 300TDT 2.5, can't imagine what that is.

Bob

 

[greg123]

I don't doubt they make them, I have the owners bible and workshop manual as well as parkers, all give detailed listing for a 2.5 and 3.0 turbo. But I appreciate they may not have been sold here. Which is my issue, I couldn't cope with the non turbo power long term, my current Volvo estate runs 210bhp and I find that underpowered at times, that's 135mph and 8.4sec 0-60. I would of course be happy to trade some power for torque, I'm pretty happy with other turbo diesels I have had around the 100bhp mark but that was in escort sized bodies. For an E class I'd be wanting 150ish bhp to pull strongly. So now my thoughts are going toward the Omega with the BMW 2.5 or the BMW 5 series, that 2.5 can be tuned to about 200bhp without many problems. I would rather have had an E class though! If only I could get a 3.0 turbo.....

 

[Shude]

I just read that WDB124133xxxxxx refers to a 300 turbo diesel! They were sold in Australia, and Japan in RHD format but never in the UK, which is a shame!

 

[pepper&boulou]

Excuse my ignorance, but I thought all w124 E300D from 1993 on where turbos that's why they have the vents in the drivers side front wing. This is fascinating I 'am always amazed what you learn on the MBClub forums. FAB

 

[Dieselman]

I don't doubt they make them, I have the owners bible and workshop manual as well as parkers, all give detailed listing for a 2.5 and 3.0 turbo. But I appreciate they may not have been sold here. Which is my issue, I couldn't cope with the non turbo power long term, my current Volvo estate runs 210bhp and I find that underpowered at times, that's 135mph and 8.4sec 0-60. I would of course be happy to trade some power for torque, I'm pretty happy with other turbo diesels I have had around the 100bhp mark but that was in escort sized bodies. For an E class I'd be wanting 150ish bhp to pull strongly. So now my thoughts are going toward the Omega with the BMW 2.5 or the BMW 5 series, that 2.5 can be tuned to about 200bhp without many problems. I would rather have had an E class though! If only I could get a 3.0 turbo.....

The Omega uses a de-tuned version of the BM engine...err..slow. Only 130Bhp.

Why not buy an E300 and graft on a blower and a Alda diapragm onto the pump. Add an intercooler too if you want, then you have about 170 Bhp with about 260ft lbs of torque.
When you say you are short of power in your Volvo you mean torque for acceleration. Power only gives top speed. My E300 TD has 17Bhp and about 297Lb ft. 0-60.. 8.5s, 137 Mph top.

 

[greg123]

Good point. As power is strictly speaking the rate of doing work, it is only ever torque that turns anything and it's a large amount of torque needed to keep the axle turning (even at top speed!). But yes I see your point ;-) I'd love some more info on the Alda diapragm, do you have any? I'd certainly do that as a project, it's a) finding a fully loaded 300D for reasonable money (w124), b) finding/making a manifold cheap enough c) pump issues/mods that would perhaps sway me to something like the omega/5-series that already came with it all from factory and can make 190-200bhp with far less major work (boost, intercooler, fueling). As you say the BMW isn't amazing in the Omega tune but then it's no hastle to make it perform even better than an E300TD of later vintage.

Any more thoughts friends?

 

[greg123]

PS from your earlier post, the BMW came with Bosch pump as well - perhaps they came with a rotary too but there are Bosch ones out there so I could swap a pump even if the car I bought had the wrong one. There is one on the Veg group running on oil atm, Bosch pump.

 

[PJH]

Wot no diesels ?

My owners manual has engine info on
200E,220E,280E,300E 4 MATIC,320E,400E?,500E
but does not mention diesels at all.

 

[greg123]

Interesting, most of the diesels I see have no vents in the wing. But a FEW are advertised as 'turbo' or 'intercooler' and DO have vents in the wing, RHD. One was listed as having 'factory fitted turbo option costing £4,500 extra' and had the vents, another 300D same year no vents. So now I am pretty convinced they do exist...