What to do if you see a car for sale from a dealer that you know has been clocked?

[andymax]

In my opinion the advert mileage is genuine. The claimed MB dealer service history almost exactly matches the MoT records. The dealer history is easy to check.

I feel as though you are trolling. How can it possibly be genuine. I know the truth because I had the car inspected, have sat in it and actually driven the car. The new owner in the last year did at least 15,000 miles which he has taken off the clock. It only looks genuine because he was smart enough to match the car's previous history. The fraud would have been undetectable normally. Unfortunately the guy advertised the car for sale with a higher mileage last year and I had a pre-purchase inspection on it. Your opinion is not worth much when it encounters the facts. Just check the ebay listing item from last year - you can't fake that.

 

[Cmonyoureds]

Might the original 43,000 have been kilometres? If it was (and I don't know whether you can switch between kms and miles on a W220), that might explain the discrepancy.
Otherwise, as others have said, it seems a strange one to clock.

That was what I was thinking too.
I don’t get why anyone would want to clock a car of this age when it already has low mileage. There would be no difference in the value of the car with the altered mileage

 

[andymax]

QED

 

[poormansporsche]

@andymax

Whatever anyone says on here you have to do whatever you feel is the right thing to do and you should be applauded for it.

Just to note, I recently had my egr mapped out on my van. I met the bloke in a pub car park and there was 3 cabbies that he "dealt with" in the space of 10 minutes whilst I was waiting

They may also been having their egrs mapped but I very much doubt it !!!!

 

[geoffus]

I guess its more common than we thought.

Mercedes Benz S Class W220 W221 W222 Mileage Correction Service | eBay

When this is the issue we change a dashboard usually with second hand parts resulting in incorrect mileage for the vehicle. This is a job for professionals and we do the service for you. Why Correct Mileage?.

www.ebay.co.uk

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

I'd still suggest it's less common than it used to be, thanking to the MoT and service databases. A haircut can only be applied intrayear without being noticed on those MoT records. In the past you could just lose half your mileage, along with the MoT certificates, and no-one would know any better, unless they posted letters to previous owners.

 

[DrNick]

I guess this is just to hide a stretched service interval. However, if you do intra-mot haircuts every year, it soon adds up. It would be worth doing on something that can wear the miles well, especially with the price of second hand cars recently.

Maybe with modern cars we should just set it back to zero every service and buy and sell just on condition.

But I applaud the OP in trying to do the right thing. We are seeing too much of this attitude that “ there are more important things, it’s time to move on”
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”
The principle holds good, even if it is an old car!

 

[MikeInWimbledon]

But I applaud the OP in trying to do the right thing. We are seeing too much of this attitude that “ there are more important things, it’s time to move on”
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.”
The principle holds good, even if it is an old car!

OIG1736 is a 22 year old S500L which won't sell for £10k, even if it wasn't clocked. (Low mileage W140 S500's ten years older than this struggle to reach five figures)

This isn't "do nothing."

What has been done, successfully, is the introduction of an MoT history database, an online Service history database, electronic service logging within the car, and a range of websites such as HPI, which will report and highlight anomalies.

To "do more," there would be a burden of proof / evidence to ensure that crooks couldn't undermine a car's history and value by creating false higher mileage claims with the objective of damaging records and values.

With every additional bureaucracy, the cost and administration needs to be appropriate. (We live in a country where 750,000 cars are still rolling round our streets untaxed because we "can't afford" the bureaucracy to chase their annual tax payments.)

And, in the meantime, all the car manufacturers upgrade their anti-clocking devices with each new model release.

 

[SpikyMikey]

We live in a country where 750,000 cars are still rolling round our streets untaxed because we "can't afford" the bureaucracy to chase their annual tax payments.)

^This.
I've reported more than once a car that is parked on street locally and I know for a fact is being used on a regular basis. It has been untaxed and MOT expired for the best part of a year (I'd hazard a guess it isn't insured either). 3 months on it's still being used.

 

[Petrol Pete]

OP . Maybe download the Vinwiki app and put the details on there ? . Not even sure if it works in the UK but if it does the details will be in there for all to see. All that look I should say.

 

[ShaunB]

according to an app I have.
Last seen for sale 26/01/2021 @ £6500, mileage not available
05/08/2021 @ £12,999 36,777 miles
20/04/2022 @ £13990 32,000 miles


MOT history
24/01/2022 31,606
21/01/2021 28,984
28/02/2020 27,780
15/03/2019 27,200
22/03/2018 26,478

We know from the autotrader ad, its now £12,990 with 33,000 miles

 

[st13phil]

I've reported more than once a car that is parked on street locally and I know for a fact is being used on a regular basis. It has been untaxed and MOT expired for the best part of a year (I'd hazard a guess it isn't insured either). 3 months on it's still being used.

Your local council is probably too busy painting cycle lanes or closing through routes with planters to create LTN's...

 

[ToeKnee]

according to an app I have.
Last seen for sale 26/01/2021 @ £6500, mileage not available
05/08/2021 @ £12,999 36,777 miles
20/04/2022 @ £13990 32,000 miles


MOT history
24/01/2022 31,606
21/01/2021 28,984
28/02/2020 27,780
15/03/2019 27,200
22/03/2018 26,478

We know from the autotrader ad, its now £12,990 with 33,000 miles

Would you mind saying which app please?

 

[Will]

I’d be more worried about corrosion and issues with electronics and air suspension etc than the mileage on an 18 year old W220.

I think most people are with the OP here and I for one don’t doubt what they’re saying, just that I still maintain it makes little sense to clock a car of this age/value for just 10/15k miles, just so random and has pretty much no affect on the value whatsoever!

 

[ShaunB]

Would you mind saying which app please?

No problem. Don't know why I didn't just say in the first place
Its called TotalCarCheck - Android version

Previously Seen Adverts​ We have seen this registration advertised with the following details:
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	20 April 2022
Price	£13,990
Mileage	32,000 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	05 August 2021
Price	£12,999
Mileage	36,777 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	26 January 2021
Price	£6,500
Mileage	Not Available

 

[SpikyMikey]

Your local council is probably too busy painting cycle lanes or closing through routes with planters to create LTN's...

It's chronic understaffing/underfunding at the DVLA more like; but I take your point. TBF, there's no evidence of our local authority doing any of the above, but then nor is there any evidence of them filling potholes......
Sorry, gone off-topic for a rant.
As you were

 

[andymax]

No problem. Don't know why I didn't just say in the first place
Its called TotalCarCheck - Android version

Previously Seen Adverts​ We have seen this registration advertised with the following details:
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	20 April 2022
Price	£13,990
Mileage	32,000 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	05 August 2021
Price	£12,999
Mileage	36,777 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	26 January 2021
Price	£6,500
Mileage	Not Available

This is an awesome tool in the hunt for decent 2nd hand cars. Thanks very much for posting!

 

[ShaunB]

This is an awesome tool in the hunt for decent 2nd hand cars. Thanks very much for posting!

register an account and you get more details, I didn't realise there was an online version also until earlier.
Obviously its still immune to a bit of jiggery pokery like you've been describing.

Previously Seen Adverts​ We have seen this registration advertised with the following details:
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	20 April 2022
Price	£13,990
Mileage	32,000 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	05 August 2021
Price	£12,999
Mileage	36,777 miles
Description	Mercedes, Petrol, Grey, 4999cc
Date Seen	26 January 2021
Price	£6,500
Mileage	Not Available

Mileage Information​

Last MOT Mileage	31,606 miles
Avg. Annual Mileage	1,800 miles
Mileage Last Year	2,622 miles
Mileage Issues	No

Is OIG1736 on finance?​ If there is you stand to lose the vehicle if you buy it. Get a Gold check now
Road Tax Information​
12 Months Cost	£360
6 Months Cost	£198
Road tax rates are indicative (check with DVLA to confirm rates).

CO₂ Output	270 g/km (K)
Real World Fuel Costs​
What is the fuel cost for travelling these distances?
1 Mile	£0.50
100 Miles	£49.62
12,000 Miles	£5,954
Fuel costs based on Urban MPG figures.

MOT History & Mileage​

MOT Vehicle Description
Mercedes-Benz S-Class, Grey, 4999 cc, Petrol, 2004
Mileage Notes

• The most recent recorded mileage is below average for a vehicle of this age.
• The average is 126,600 miles. This vehicle has done 31,606 miles.
• We allow a +/- 15% variation of the average.

Date	Result	Details
24/01/2022 09:45	Pass	Mileage: 31,606 miles + 2,622 miles travelled since last MOT.
21/01/2021 14:13	Pass	Mileage: 28,984 miles + 1,204 miles travelled since last MOT.
28/02/2020 11:46	Pass	Mileage: 27,780 miles + 580 miles travelled since last MOT.
15/03/2019 13:25	Pass	Mileage: 27,200 miles + 722 miles travelled since last MOT. Advisory Notices Nearside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e)) Offside rear tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e)) Nearside front tyre worn close to legal limit/worn on edge (5.2.3 (e))
22/03/2018 13:35	Pass	Mileage: 26,478 miles + 987 miles travelled since last MOT.
15/03/2017 16:08	Pass	Mileage: 25,491 miles + 894 miles travelled since last MOT. Advisory Notices Osf tyre worn inner shoulder
18/03/2016 16:31	Pass	Mileage: 24,597 miles + 1,760 miles travelled since last MOT.
27/03/2015 12:13	Pass	Mileage: 22,837 miles + 1,446 miles travelled since last MOT.
28/03/2014 17:38	Pass	Mileage: 21,391 miles + 1,688 miles travelled since last MOT.
22/03/2013 16:13	Pass	Mileage: 19,703 miles + 1,804 miles travelled since last MOT. Advisory Notices Parking brake lever has little reserve travel (3.1.6b) Engine covers fitted obscuring some components in the engine bay N/s/f tyre wearing on outer edge
13/03/2012 09:56	Pass	Mileage: 17,899 miles + 2,436 miles travelled since last MOT.
16/03/2011 12:37	Pass	Mileage: 15,463 miles + 3,058 miles travelled since last MOT.
30/03/2010 15:57	Pass	Mileage: 12,405 miles + 1 miles travelled since last MOT.
29/03/2010 15:00	Fail	Mileage: 12,404 miles + 1,813 miles travelled since last MOT. Refusal Notices Nearside rear tyre has a cut in excess of the requirements deep enough to reach the ply or cords (4.1.d.1a)
03/04/2009 12:50	Pass	Mileage: 10,591 miles
31/03/2009 16:06	Fail	Mileage: 10,591 miles + 1,933 miles travelled since last MOT. Refusal Notices Nearside rear tyre has a bulge, caused by separation or partial failure of its structure (4.1.d.1b) Advisory Notices O/s/rear tyre has very bad cut to bead protector
13/03/2008 12:30	Pass	Mileage: 8,658 miles + 2,161 miles travelled since last MOT.
19/03/2007 15:57	Pass	Mileage:

 

[DrNick]

OIG1736 is a 22 year old S500L which won't sell for £10k, even if it wasn't clocked. (Low mileage W140 S500's ten years older than this struggle to reach five figures)

This isn't "do nothing."

What has been done, successfully, is the introduction of an MoT history database, an online Service history database, electronic service logging within the car, and a range of websites such as HPI, which will report and highlight anomalies.

To "do more," there would be a burden of proof / evidence to ensure that crooks couldn't undermine a car's history and value by creating false higher mileage claims with the objective of damaging records and values.

With every additional bureaucracy, the cost and administration needs to be appropriate. (We live in a country where 750,000 cars are still rolling round our streets untaxed because we "can't afford" the bureaucracy to chase their annual tax payments.)

And, in the meantime, all the car manufacturers upgrade their anti-clocking devices with each new model release.

I was alluding to more general things going in in the world, not specifically this car. Having seen the rest of the thread and the picture you provided it looks like a nice motor and maybe its only the most recent history that has been doctored (or the previous owners were more competent at doctoring!). If that's the case its still a mystery as to why anyone would do it, other than to make it look like its been a garage queen its whole life. As you say, unlikely to affect the value much but may make it more saleable.
Whatever, its still a bit naughty and I understand the OPs position and its a sad reflection on the world that no-one really cares. But that's where we find ourselves.

For the particular case of clocking, once we pay by the mile, it will all go away. Do I believe that ? No, not really. But by then government will claim the system is unbreakable and therefore no-one can fiddle it, so there will not even be a way of investigating.

 

[Teego]

I feel as though you are trolling. How can it possibly be genuine. I know the truth because I had the car inspected, have sat in it and actually driven the car. The new owner in the last year did at least 15,000 miles which he has taken off the clock. It only looks genuine because he was smart enough to match the car's previous history. The fraud would have been undetectable normally. Unfortunately the guy advertised the car for sale with a higher mileage last year and I had a pre-purchase inspection on it. Your opinion is not worth much when it encounters the facts. Just check the ebay listing item from last year - you can't fake that.

Please don't accuse me of trolling. I offer a considered opinion based on available evidence. 16 MB dealer services and 16 MoTs plus a change of owner in Feb 2021.