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Whats your strategy for year 2030 / ban of ICE vehicles?

In the same way that they got into new large/expensive ICE cars, fleets took the brunt of new car cost, and individuals have traditionally bought them 2, 3 or 4 years later when they have been depreciated.

Whilst the tax breaks appear to benefitting business and those who many might see as needing the least support, those tax breaks are designed to create sizeable used EV stock and secondhand market.

I don’t know many people queuing up to privately buy a brand new Jaguar iPace with their own money, but I didn’t know many buying brand new BMW 530d either. Both are typically company cars.

By 2030 there will be oodles of used EVs kicking around at price points between buttons and shed loads.
Another joy / feature of the WfH trend is that “some say” company cars will be less common if fewer people are commuting daily.

Who’s to know if that will be sustained, but if people aren’t driving a few hundred miles to get to work each week, it seems likely that the company car fleet will decrease even further from the current three quarters of a million
 
There is no intention of having everyone in an EV by 2030 though, but enough to ensure a plentiful supply to trickle through to second, third, fourth, fifth owners.
200k a year isn’t a plentiful supply in a country of 35 million vehicles.

If that logic really applied, we’d all be running around in Focuses, Mondeos, Vectras and 318’s.

When the UK delivers 1,500,000 cars a year, only one in seven is a company car.
 
I know more than 100 people with an EV, and I’d estimate that of those:
  • Around 90% are company cars and 10% privately owned (or financed)
  • Around 80% between 30 and 50 years old, with 20% over 50
  • Around 70% are mostly used by male drivers and 30% female drivers
  • Close to 100% are premium and/or full-size, just a couple of city cars
  • Close to 100% have replaced a similar premium or city ICE car
  • Close to 100% have at least one more car in the household
  • Around 10% have more than one EV in the household
  • Close to 100% use an EV as their main car, including holidays
  • Jaguar iPace is by far the most common, with BMW a distant second
  • Tesla Model 3/Y is most popular when there is a free choice of EV brand
  • Porsche Taycan has the most positive and least negative comments
  • Close to 100% wouldn’t want to go back to ICE at all…

Sounds about right... however, where I live, there are tons of Model-3, only a couple of Model-Y, and not that many iPace. Oh and there's quite a few i3, too.
 
Another joy / feature of the WfH trend is that “some say” company cars will be less common if fewer people are commuting daily.

Who’s to know if that will be sustained, but if people aren’t driving a few hundred miles to get to work each week, it seems likely that the company car fleet will decrease even further from the current three quarters of a million

Not quite, things have changed recently, and with the EV BIK currently at 2% (it was 0% a couple of years ago....), company cars are now perks on salary sacrifice, even when not used for commuting or for work at all.

From the employees' perspective, it gives them the opportunity to drive a car that cost them nearly 40% less.

Even if they don't commute to work (because they work from home or because they use public transport), they can still get the company EV for the missus and it's all perfectly legal.

Obviously it's only possible where the employer is willing to offer this option, it involves admin so even if there's no direct cost to the employer, it's a gesture to the employees as the company will be absorbing the extra work (ordering, contract, finance, etc).
 
Sounds about right... however, where I live, there are tons of Model-3, only a couple of Model-Y, and not that many iPace. Oh and there's quite a few i3, too.
Aye, but you do live slap bang in the middle of the eight square mile congestion zone, so the £15 a day EV tax break is enormous for you.

The other 60 odd million don’t have this incentive to have an EV.

Unless you’re suggesting that we turn the whole of the UK into a £15 a day congestion zone?
 
Even if they don't commute to work (because they work from home or because they use public transport), they can still get the company EV for the missus and it's all perfectly legal

Understood. My point is that someone no longer driving significant mileages to work all year might prefer to take the taxed income rather than an EV, or two, parked on the drive.

(There are plenty of Dinkies around who take two company cars for jobs that used to take them in separate directions.)
 
From today's Times:

German car companies suffer heavy electric shock​


Germany’s three big carmakers have cut their European production by a fifth compared with pre-pandemic levels, amid competition from Chinese rivals and falling demand for electric vehicles.

Volkswagen, BMW and Mercedes-Benz were already struggling with long-term problems, ranging from rising energy and labour costs in their central European heartlands to malfunctioning software and a tricky pivot away from the internal combustion engine. Initially they were able to ride out the effects of the pandemic thanks to a backlog of orders, but a recovery seems to be running out of steam.

The three collectively made half a million fewer cars at their European factories between January and May than they had done over the same months in 2019, according to figures released by MarkLines, an analytics service, to the Handelsblatt newspaper. This equated to a fall of nearly 20 per cent.


Volkswagen, in particular, appears to be suffering. Of 93,000 vehicles in the battery-electric ID range made in Europe over the first five months of the year, only 73,000 were sold, according to the data.

Thomas Peckruhn, vice-president of the Central Association of German Vehicle Dealers, said a relatively healthy number of new registrations was belied by a darker picture emerging from order books. “New orders for electric cars are down by 30 per cent to 50 per cent on where they were a year ago,” Peckruhn told Handelsblatt.

The VW brand, part of the Volkswagen group, acknowledged yesterday that it was “experiencing a general reluctance to purchase electric cars, like other manufacturers are”.

Last month Ifo, the Munich-based economic research institute, found that while carmakers felt business was better than at any time since 2021, forecasts for the months to come were much more pessimistic.

Aggregate expectations slipped from positive territory to -14.1 points on its scale, indicating that car producers expect a fall in sales. Ifo said the sector was being “deindustrialised” as carmaking jobs left Germany, because electric vehicle production was less labour-intensive and costs were cheaper in east Asia or in European countries such as Hungary, Poland and the Czech Republic.

In addition, Chinese manufacturers including Geely and Nio are beginning to threaten German carmakers’ dominance on their home turf. In the first half of this year, they jointly made up only 7 per cent of electric vehicle sales in Germany, led by MG and Polestar, but the proportion is rising rapidly.

France is looking at trying to squeeze out heavily subsidised Chinese competition by scrapping state-sponsored discounts on electric vehicles whose manufacture involves more than a certain level of carbon emissions. It is unclear whether Germany could follow suit. At a meeting last month with Olaf Scholz, the chancellor, the three biggest carmakers are understood to have warned that Beijing could retaliate by imposing curbs on German cars.

Carlos Tavares, chief executive of Stellantis, the conglomerate behind marques including Peugeot, Citroën and Fiat, said that typically it cost 40 per cent more to make an electric car in Europe than in China. He said that trade restrictions “aren’t a real solution, just a temporary relief”.

Tavares, 64, told WirtschaftsWoche, a German finance magazine: “If our costs are too high, we just don’t have enough good ideas.”
 
But how do we get the other 34 million car users into EVs
Time will do that.....they recon only about 25% of cars will be EV by 2030 at current take up rates. But used ICE cars will just slowly be replaced by EVs as they fall apart or fail the MOT and you wont be able buy new ICE cars to replace them.......no one is expecting a massive change on Jan 1st 2030!!! You would notice no change if the law came in banning new ICE tomorrow.
 
Time will do that.....they recon only about 25% of cars will be EV by 2030 at current take up rates. But used ICE cars will just slowly be replaced by EVs as they fall apart or fail the MOT and you wont be able buy new ICE cars to replace them.......no one is expecting a massive change on Jan 1st 2030!!! You would notice no change if the law came in banning new ICE tomorrow.
Excellent news. When will you change to EV, what EV will you choose, and how much will you pay for it ?

MrsMiW will be keen to hear, because there's no replacement for her trusty Mx5 in sight. (Immaculate convertible on 35k miles and worth just £4k)
 
Most of the people I know who run their own business have switched to BEV's for the obvious tax reasons that MiW has pointed out.

A large number of the people that I know who choose to lease new or nearly-new family cars seem to have switched to hybrids.

Most of the petrol heads I know don't really care. They carry on running stuff that interests them, more often than not with an ICE lump up front.
 
Excellent news. When will you change to EV, what EV will you choose, and how much will you pay for it ?

MrsMiW will be keen to hear, because there's no replacement for her trusty Mx5 in sight. (Immaculate convertible on 35k miles and worth just £4k)
Never!!....Id rather walk. If I'm lucky I might be able to drive until, what?....2050 or so?......there will still be plenty of ICE around for at least 20 years past the 2023 new ICE ban for me to choose from......whether the Gov will allow it to be affordable to run one is another thing!
Most people are not car fans though and could not care less what powers there car.
 
Never!!....Id rather walk. If I'm lucky I might be able to drive until, what?....2050 or so?......there will still be plenty of ICE around for at least 20 years past the 2023 new ICE ban for me to choose from......whether the Gov will allow it to be affordable to run one is another thing!
Most people are not car fans though and could not care less what powers there car.
Quite

Most people aren't car fans, for sure. Sadly most people don't have easy access to home charging either, so they're also dependent on expensive roadside charging.

MrsMiW doesn't care what powers her car, or what noise it makes. But she does care for her convertible, even though she rarely gets her top off these days. She loves her lightweight, simple, cheap little car, so won't be keen to take over someone's company Skoda Enyaq or Tesla 3 any time soon, even if it would save her £600 in fuel and car tax.
 
Never!!....Id rather walk. If I'm lucky I might be able to drive until, what?....2050 or so?......there will still be plenty of ICE around for at least 20 years past the 2023 new ICE ban for me to choose from......whether the Gov will allow it to be affordable to run one is another thing!
Most people are not car fans though and could not care less what powers there car.

I think I'll end with something relatively new and efficient and something old and fun. With a **** off big engine in it.
 
Sadly most people don't have easy access to home charging either, so they're also dependent on expensive roadside charging.
I'm not sure what the figures are.....but I don't thing its "most".....especially outside the bigger cities.....and they have decent public transport to fall back on....unlike the rest of us.
 
Never!!....Id rather walk. If I'm lucky I might be able to drive until, what?....2050 or so?......there will still be plenty of ICE around for at least 20 years past the 2023 new ICE ban for me to choose from......
Yep - and most of them abandoned due to failure of an electronic component that is either unobtainable or punitively expensive.
whether the Gov will allow it to be affordable to run one is another thing!
The three possibilities that a government could effect to that end:
1) Restrict parts supply.
2) Punitive tax on petrol, diesel, LPG.
3) Punitive VED/road charging.

Would a historic vehicle (ie, 40+ years old and VED exempt) be immune to the third item. Tax exempt currently and immune to any road charging schemes?
 
Not at twenty or so years old......look how many owners on this very forum drive Mercs way older than that. My car is 14 years old and 170,000 miles.....its far from scrap!! My wifes Merc is 17 years old. There will always be a source of a suitable part somewhere. I would not mind betting that many of these EVs will have failed due to terminal ECU or software failure long before their ICE equivalent. How long will they even keep supplying software updates for these new EVs?
 
I'm not sure what the figures are.....but I don't thing its "most".....especially outside the bigger cities.....and they have decent public transport to fall back on....unlike the rest of us.
Who has decent public transport to fall back on?

And are you really saying that more than 20 million car owners have off street parking where they can charge their vehicles overnight, and where they can have a charger installed for their personal use?
 
Not at twenty or so years old......look how many owners on this very forum drive Mercs way older than that. My car is 14 years old and 170,000 miles.....its far from scrap!! My wifes Merc is 17 years old. There will always be a source of a suitable part somewhere. I would not mind betting that many of these EVs will have failed due to terminal ECU or software failure long before their ICE equivalent. How long will they even keep supplying software updates for these new EVs?

Shame on you. Tesla software won't go out of date any more than other software. Surely?

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Well in addition to that argument - my complaint is - that with no increase in the raw input pricing ('the wind') and nowhere else to sell the output - the price goes up.
Was having a look today and noticed that Octopus Agile prices have started going negative again recently. This means you are being paid to use electricity. The attached graph shows one day and the prices charged every 30 minutes. You can see that there were 21 30 minute slots where the price was negative, and at 1:30 in the afternoon, you were being paid 9.3p a unit to use it!
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