4 cylinder diesel Merc engine

[gIzzE]

^^^ All just good old rhetoric.

It is just my opinion on it in the same way you have yours. It is the way I view how things are changing.
I even put a next to me saying 'we simply disagree'.

Anyway, the way the F1 is going, maybe the Renault owners are starting to worry more about getting some crappy Merc engine than we are the other way round?

Edit: And anyway, wasn't that the point of the post, the Merc engine is crap?
Why wouldn't it be a good thing to put a better engine in the car?

 

[John Jones Jr]

Edit: And anyway, wasn't that the point of the post, the Merc engine is crap?
Why wouldn't it be a good thing to put a better engine in the car?

Now, your going one pace forward & two back.

Agree to disagree

 

[gIzzE]

Edit: OK.

 

[John Jones Jr]

Just read my previous posts. As I never implied the four pot diesels were good nor did I imply that a better engine should not be fitted. So, ask yourself why did you need to make that edit comments in post #41, thus my last comment. Argue with me, fine but at least read all my posts first.

 

[gIzzE]

I sort of jested that maybe Renault owners were more concerned than Merc owners with the way the F1 was going, and then when I posted I thought, actually, that was the whole point of the original post. I was answering myself and not you.

I don't want to 'argue' with you. Hence why my next post says 'OK'.

I now agree with everything you say, you have swung me round to your way of thinking.

Anyway, you and I don't have an opinion, you drive a W201 and W202 and I drive an old W163. What we think matters not a jot.

 

[Deleted member 37751]

Having just read you two arguing, what is the result then; gIzzE is going to stick a Mercedes grille on a Clio and John Jones JR thinks Mercedes should still be making 600 Grossers?

 

[Druk]

Where does that ultimately leave MB? Well in the worst case basicly like an army that has left its fortified bastion up on the hill to scrap it out on the soggy field below on their opponent's terms.

That's a very good analogy given that we're on the 500th anniversary of Flodden: and look what happened to the losers on that occasion.



.

 

[derekcotton]

Have had a French car,they should stick to making wine Merc is not perfect but better than French,I used to do airport tranfers in an E Class next time you are at Heathrow look at the cars dropping off,its nearly all Merc E & S class not French

 

[grober]

If 30 years ago you told Mercedes owners that the majority of engines they had in their expensive upmarket saloons were based on a diesel engine to be found in the majority of Mercedes light commercial vehicles they would not have been happy. While the OM651 may be " robust"---- leaving the timing chain and injector problems aside for a moment most reviews characterise it as noisy and rough in comparison to the opposition.
While one can admire the "economies of scale" that the use of a single engine over a wide range of vehicles may bring to a manufacturer one is left wondering about the long term wisdom of such a strategy- the phrase "brand value dilution " comes to mind.
Never mind I believe the next generation of modular MERCEDES engines will include a straight six cylinder motor. Hooray!

 

[Vlad]

That little 1.5 diesel engine from Renault is a cracking little engine. Refined, long lived and great eonomy. I can understand why Mercedes chose it. The 1.6 Renault diesel is meant to be even better.

As for the Nissan/Renault side of things....Renault supplies the diesel engines and Nissan do the petrol engine development for the Group.

As a reminder Mercedes also bought in know-how on the 1.8 Kompressor engines from Mitsubishi. Like a lot of manufacturers there is a lot of co-development, buying in of rival manufacturer engines to keep costs down.

Mercedes in turn supply Infiniti with the diesel engines for their European range of larger cars.

 

[tron]

The Citroen HDI engine is a little cracker, smooth, quiet and frugal (and based on a forty year old Simca design.) Mercedes have already castrated themselves with the original A class which was everything required to drive their loyal customers off to Munich and now Ingoldstadt. Supposedly a premium priced product in the same bracket as a Golf, they are now virtually worthless. A Renault/Nissan engined MB will finally convince people that it is a faded, ordinary BRAND (a word I do not use as a compliment,) and not a premium product.
Old ones will, of course be sought after as ever they were but nobody will care about the new cars. BMW could get away with a Peugeot diesel in the "Mini" but to the public Mercedes-Benz is about a Mercedes engine, an engine that you cannot wear out.

 

[Piff]

Back in 1989 I had a new Volvo 440 which underneath had a renault engine. My boss had a 480 withe the same engine.
At the time I lived on a busy A road with limited visibility from my drive. From a standing start the engine had a flat spot so from spotting a gap in the traffic & pulling out, the engine would die half way across the A road before picking back up again - a few heart stopping moments. I took the car back to the Volvo dealer many times & they tried changing various sensors before giving up & declaring it a "charactaristic" of the engine. Reading between the lines it seemed that the engine was not correctly mated with the car electronics or gearbox.
My boss queried why I kept taking the car back & complaining. When I described the fault to him he said " oh yes, mine does that but it isn't realy a problem" - he lived in a town & only ever pulled out into slow moving traffic.

My point is, if a manufacturer choses to buy in an engine from anothe manufacturer, that manufacturer has to be very careful to correctly mate that engine to their car.

 

[Piff]

Back in the 1980's I can remember the boss of the previous firm I worked for buying a Mercedes 230. At that time there was talk that mercedes could not be considered a premium brand as they also made taxi's & lorries.........