C63 AMG - LSD Advice.

[Justin1600]

Just go easy, bud!

Agreed, don't jump in with two feet e320cdiowner. Take it a step at a time.

Don't want you to end up in the scenary

 

[Palmball]

This argument always rears itself every so often but the facts remain the same...if you want the best traction then you get the LSD!

The LSD allows more power to go to the wheels before any form of electronic intervention takes place. Therefore, if the traction control intervenes later you will get more forward movement.

Now admittedly, if you don't drive particularly hard or if you have nothing to compare it against then I understand why you'll feel no need to have it as the car will still drive perfectly fine.

For me, the main benefit was when the traction control was in sport mode or off. In a non-LSD equipped car, any sideways fun is hampered by the inside wheel simply spinning up....whilst the car will go sideways, it won't generate the same angles (it won't have the traction to do so) and it won't be as controllable.

With the LSD, the power is transferred to the outside wheel with the most grip, you get more power to the road and as such, more ability to control a nice slide.

I appreciate not everyone wants to drive like that but for me it was half the fun of owning the car and rarely did I go a day without going sideways hence I will always insist the LSD is essential!

Now, I have never driven a C63 without an LSD but lets face it, a C63 without an LSD is not going to miraculously generate a whole lot more traction than any other powerful RWD car without an LSD....and I do have plenty of experience in my girlfriends BMW 135i which has 300+bhp and no LSD. Compared to any car that I've had with an LSD (BMW M3, BMW M6 and 2 Mercedes C63's), the non-LSD equipped 135i is far harder to get into a nice sideways slide, far harder to keep there, generates more wheel spin and in normal driving has the yellow flashing light intervening a lot more (and it's nearly 200bhp down on the C63 PPP!).

All of this is largely irrelevant to me now what with my 4-wheel drive Beetle...that is far harder to get to go sideways as the thing just goes round, relatively fuss free and very quickly. It's all very efficient but it's also a bit anaesthetised...until it does let go and then you feel the fact you've got an engine hanging out the back!

Good to hear from you Andy! Hope you are doing ok?

Hi mate, all good thanks! I'm still missing that cold-morning bark of the 6.2!

 

[mika]

yep ...im definitely driving like a lady !

 

[Benjy]

Hi mate, all good thanks! I'm still missing that cold-morning bark of the 6.2![/QUOTE]

I don't think it will be too long bud before you will be back behind the wheel of a big V8 LOL.....

I know exactly what you are saying though I still can't get that smile off my face every time I turn that key especially from a cold start!

I still haven't had the balls yet though to switching that TC off on it yet though.

 

[Benjy]

yep ...im definitely driving like a lady !

I find that hard t believe mate.....ha ha ha ha!

 

[Palmball]

yep ...im definitely driving like a lady !

I still haven't had the balls yet though to switching that TC off on it yet though.

Come on chaps....at least use the sport mode and try balancing it on that.

Get it just enough sideways but not too much for the electronics to get involved...you'd be amazed how much more fun roundabouts can be and all in relative safety as if you do happen to sneeze and smash the gas into the floor, the safety net is still there!

 

[mika]

Come on chaps....at least use the sport mode and try balancing it on that.

Get it just enough sideways but not too much for the electronics to get involved...you'd be amazed how much more fun roundabouts can be and all in relative safety as if you do happen to sneeze and smash the gas into the floor, the safety net is still there!

Hi Palmball

I do use sport mode(on the g/box) and particularly like causing frantic rev matching under heavy braking
oh and with full ESP On its been possible to get the back to step out slightly albeit it steps back in very quickly

-but even my wife is partial to sport mode!she says its a bit livelier

 

[Benjy]

Come on chaps....at least use the sport mode and try balancing it on that.

Get it just enough sideways but not too much for the electronics to get involved...you'd be amazed how much more fun roundabouts can be and all in relative safety as if you do happen to sneeze and smash the gas into the floor, the safety net is still there!

I didn't know even how to switch off the ESP totally until reading this. Shows you my ignorance. So you hold the ESP button in....Guess what I'm going to be doing tomorrow he he he.....

So how you getting on with the Porsche mate, still loving it? One of the guys at work just bought one and absolutely loves it.

 

[Palmball]

Hi Palmball

I do use sport mode(on the g/box) and particularly like causing frantic rev matching under heavy braking
oh and with full ESP On its been possible to get the back to step out slightly albeit it steps back in very quickly

-but even my wife is partial to sport mode!she says its a bit livelier

Yes that blipping on down changes in sport is great isn't it! The trick is to learn to get a good slide in sport at just under the ESP threshold....I never managed more than 1/3 of a roundabout before either straightening up or having the ESP stopping the fun!

I didn't know even how to switch off the ESP totally until reading this. Shows you my ignorance. So you hold the ESP button in....Guess what I'm going to be doing tomorrow he he he.....

So how you getting on with the Porsche mate, still loving it? One of the guys at work just bought one and absolutely loves it.

Careful Benjy...the back end is violent when the traction is fully off! Don't go sticking it into a lamppost.

I wouldn't say I've ever loved the Porsche as such...I appreciate it for what it can do and the engineering excellence. Maybe I should have got a slower or RWD one as in the Turbo you have to go so fast to get anything other than grip...by which point it's going round bends so fast that anything other than grip is just an ejector seat out of planet life!

Its so damn effective that I dont think it'll come into its own until I get it on a track and/or over to Germany.

 

[mw_C32]

OP,

You van get a standard C63 that has the LSD fitted as an optional extra without all the other PP stuff. I know I had one, here is a link to one.....

Used - MERCEDES-BENZ - C CLASS AMG SALOON (C63 4dr Auto) - Mercedes-Benz of Weston-Super-Mare

 

[pagzzy]

I went with one as much as being a safety feature...As Palmball says it is an additional £1500 as an option on the 2010 models and didn't come with the PPP.

Good to hear from you Andy! Hope you are doing ok?

think £1560 now with the VAT increase lol

 

[SeeSixty3]

Hi see sixty

why are you changing the M3 ?

Hi Mika,

I actually sold my e90 m3 saloon in April and bought a z4m coupe which I am trying to sell now.

I found the m3 a great car but it just lacked that special feel, if you know what I mean.


Contrary to the c63

 

[SeeSixty3]

Thanks for all the pointers guys! I knew Palmball would have something to say on this

 

[Palmball]

Thanks for all the pointers guys! I knew Palmball would have something to say on this

Lol...yes, I'm quite passionate about it!

Came out of an E90 M3 you say....are you on e90post?

I had an E92 M3 a couple of years ago and never regretted the move to the dark side! Just don't expect the C63 to handle as sharply as the M3 (the weight of that engine does make itself felt on turn-in)....in every single other respect, the C63 is the better car as an everyday driver. The noise will have you hooked!

 

[Jack Wood]

Hi,

There seems to be a bit of confusion between Sport Mode on the gearbox and Sport Mode on the ESP system.

Sport Mode on the gearbox increases gearshift speeds, increases throttle response (I think), holds revs longer in each gears and changes down quicker under breaking. It has NO effect on the Traction Control System.

The other Sport Mode is on the ESP system.

The ESP button is in the centre of the dash, above the centre console. It has a warning triangle on it.

This ESP button has 3 settings.

Normal: This is default mode and every time you start the car it starts in this mode. The Electronic Stability Program (ESP) thresholds are set very low. Even the slightest amount of slip generated at the front wheels or rear wheels will trigger the ESP system and use a combination of cutting engine power and breaking individual wheels to reign in any slip. It is a very intrusive system and is actually working even when the little warning triagle on the dash isn't flashing.

ESP Sport: To enter this mode you press the ESP button once. You will get a warning triangle illuminated on the dash permenantly. You will also get a message on the centre binnacle to tell you that you just switched ESP into Sport Mode.
The result is that the car will now slide to much larger slip angles before the ESP will intervene and break wheels or cut power to control the skid. This is a great halfway house for those that want to feel the rear of the C63 move around more. It will allow quite big and smooth skidsd on roundabouts, but still cut in to sort it out if you overcook it.

ESP Off: Push and hold the ESP button for 10 seconds. This turns ALL ESP control OFF. The car is now 100% in your control. There is no intervention from ESP at all in any situation.
Unless you are very very used driving a very powerful rear drive car with no electronic aids at all I would not recommend the use of this on the road. It is OK for use in a large empty carpark to learn the limits of your car, but on the road there is the potential to end up pointing in the wrong direction, or in a hedge or someones front garden before you can even say "ESP"!



I hope that clears up a bit of the confusion.

Questions?

 

[mika]

cheers Jack it was as i had thought but nice to get confirmation
....im thinking about trying ESP Sport mode maybe...

 

[Palmball]

Thanks Jack, very concise as always. Sorry guys but I was not very clear and was only referring to sport mode on the ESP as the one that allows some nice (and safe) sideways action.

I can't seriously recommend holding the button down to turn off the ESP unless you really know what you're doing as it is very easy to do some damage...best to use the sport mode and practise within the threshold that the car allows. Indeed, it was almost a routine for me to select this mode everytime I drove the car as it just drives better!

 

[SeeSixty3]

Hi,

There seems to be a bit of confusion between Sport Mode on the gearbox and Sport Mode on the ESP system.

Sport Mode on the gearbox increases gearshift speeds, increases throttle response (I think), holds revs longer in each gears and changes down quicker under breaking. It has NO effect on the Traction Control System.

The other Sport Mode is on the ESP system.

The ESP button is in the centre of the dash, above the centre console. It has a warning triangle on it.

This ESP button has 3 settings.

Normal: This is default mode and every time you start the car it starts in this mode. The Electronic Stability Program (ESP) thresholds are set very low. Even the slightest amount of slip generated at the front wheels or rear wheels will trigger the ESP system and use a combination of cutting engine power and breaking individual wheels to reign in any slip. It is a very intrusive system and is actually working even when the little warning triagle on the dash isn't flashing.

ESP Sport: To enter this mode you press the ESP button once. You will get a warning triangle illuminated on the dash permenantly. You will also get a message on the centre binnacle to tell you that you just switched ESP into Sport Mode.
The result is that the car will now slide to much larger slip angles before the ESP will intervene and break wheels or cut power to control the skid. This is a great halfway house for those that want to feel the rear of the C63 move around more. It will allow quite big and smooth skidsd on roundabouts, but still cut in to sort it out if you overcook it.

ESP Off: Push and hold the ESP button for 10 seconds. This turns ALL ESP control OFF. The car is now 100% in your control. There is no intervention from ESP at all in any situation.
Unless you are very very used driving a very powerful rear drive car with no electronic aids at all I would not recommend the use of this on the road. It is OK for use in a large empty carpark to learn the limits of your car, but on the road there is the potential to end up pointing in the wrong direction, or in a hedge or someones front garden before you can even say "ESP"!



I hope that clears up a bit of the confusion.

Questions?

Excellent information.

Looks like 18inch wheels might be sensible

Might be getting through a few sets of tyres!

 

[1998K]

Hi,

There seems to be a bit of confusion between Sport Mode on the gearbox and Sport Mode on the ESP system.

Sport Mode on the gearbox increases gearshift speeds, increases throttle response (I think), holds revs longer in each gears and changes down quicker under breaking. It has NO effect on the Traction Control System.

The other Sport Mode is on the ESP system.

The ESP button is in the centre of the dash, above the centre console. It has a warning triangle on it.

This ESP button has 3 settings.

Normal: This is default mode and every time you start the car it starts in this mode. The Electronic Stability Program (ESP) thresholds are set very low. Even the slightest amount of slip generated at the front wheels or rear wheels will trigger the ESP system and use a combination of cutting engine power and breaking individual wheels to reign in any slip. It is a very intrusive system and is actually working even when the little warning triagle on the dash isn't flashing.

ESP Sport: To enter this mode you press the ESP button once. You will get a warning triangle illuminated on the dash permenantly. You will also get a message on the centre binnacle to tell you that you just switched ESP into Sport Mode.
The result is that the car will now slide to much larger slip angles before the ESP will intervene and break wheels or cut power to control the skid. This is a great halfway house for those that want to feel the rear of the C63 move around more. It will allow quite big and smooth skidsd on roundabouts, but still cut in to sort it out if you overcook it.

ESP Off: Push and hold the ESP button for 10 seconds. This turns ALL ESP control OFF. The car is now 100% in your control. There is no intervention from ESP at all in any situation.
Unless you are very very used driving a very powerful rear drive car with no electronic aids at all I would not recommend the use of this on the road. It is OK for use in a large empty carpark to learn the limits of your car, but on the road there is the potential to end up pointing in the wrong direction, or in a hedge or someones front garden before you can even say "ESP"!



I hope that clears up a bit of the confusion.

Questions?

Thanks a lot for this information, very clear.
Please just a question, do you know if this ESP off configuration (keeping ESP button 10s) is specially related to C63 AMG or will work also for poor no AMG Mercedes

Cheers

 

[SeeSixty3]

Hi yes 100% get one with a lsd

P/pack comprises

COMPOSITE BRAKES
10% STIFFER SUSPENSION
LOCKING REAR DIFFERENTIAL
ALUMINIUM TRIM
LEATHER/ALCANTARA STEERING WHEEL

Have you seen this one ? looks good value



Mercedes : C63 amg 59 reg performance pack lsd command

That's the one I bought in the end.......