Fuel Price Increase

[scumbag]

an excllent story or diatribe depending on your view. it does add to the argument about fuel price even tho its not directly connected.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/weekend/story/0,,1099739,00.html

and some words by others in a big house

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm199900/cmhansrd/vo000315/halltext/00315h05.htm

and the other side

http://www.foe-scotland.org.uk/press/pr20021107.html

and those north of the borders view
http://www.scotlandoffice.gov.uk/our-communications/release.php?id=2983

 

[lil.smartie]

If he keeps going I'll just have to sell you all Smart CDi's 80 mpg (easy 80 mpg!) anyone.....

lol

Kate

 

[prprandall51]

All flights from the Scottish Highlands and Islands are exempt from duty.

Funny, that.

That's perfectly fair. In the highlands and islands, air travel is the only form of transport available so the residents shouldbn't be taxed for it.

No..... hang on, there's something wrong there. I live in Surrey and my nearest bus stop or train station are nearly three miles away. And the services on both are intermittent, slow and expensive. So my car is my only form of transport, as well. But the government are taxing my car usage to the hilt and are about to push the sword in even further.

Hmmm, now what proportion of this government's ministers have come from north of the border? And, in the last election, which country's votes enabled a return to power for Tony?

As you said, Satch, "Funny that".

Philip

 

[jeremytaylor]

If he keeps going I'll just have to sell you all Smart CDi's 80 mpg (easy 80 mpg!) anyone.....

lol

Kate

I'll swap you my Brabus for one!

 

[Dieselman]

If he keeps going I'll just have to sell you all Smart CDi's 80 mpg (easy 80 mpg!) anyone.....

lol

Kate

Just as a matter of interest how much for one?

 

[Dieselman]

The 4x4 thing always gets to me, take for example a ML270 cdi is it not the same engine thats in a C270 cdi?

I don't understand your comment. 4x4 use more fuel by nature of being heavier and having greater drive train losses.
The 270 is no longer made so I took the Co2 data for C320 estate and ML320, both in automatic form.
The C has a rating of 199g/km and the ML has a rating of 249g/km or 25% more.

Maybe this explains the issue with 4x4.

 

[pammy]

I don't understand your comment. 4x4 use more fuel by nature of being heavier and having greater drive train losses.

But this is where it is flawed as not all 4 x 4s use more fuel than all non 4 x 4. The Bugattie Veyron srpings to mind but seriously, my Edna uses more fuel than some 4 x 4s. It's actual consumption that should matter mesaured with emissions. Similarly not all 4 x 4s are big and heavy - not related to certain saloons. It's all relative

Either way - they are high and I can't see round them so they should be taxed more for that

 

[BTB 500]

4x4 use more fuel by nature of being heavier and having greater drive train losses.

And being less aerodynamic (greater frontal area etc.).

 

[PJH]

And being less aerodynamic (greater frontal area etc.).

Makes you wonder why some are made to be able to reach 150mph.

 

[lil.smartie]

Just as a matter of interest how much for one?

£7750 for an 05 plate with air-con, heated cloth seats, soft-touch, glass roof, CD player and about 30,000 kms.

And any time now we are expecting a couple of Cabriolets in don't know much on spec but they have air-con and are about 6 months old and expected to be around the same price!

Kate

 

[Dieselman]

But this is where it is flawed as not all 4 x 4s use more fuel than all non 4 x 4. The Bugattie Veyron srpings to mind but seriously, my Edna uses more fuel than some 4 x 4s. It's actual consumption that should matter mesaured with emissions. Similarly not all 4 x 4s are big and heavy - not related to certain saloons. It's all relative

Either way - they are high and I can't see round them so they should be taxed more for that

Really. Do you have any examples of 3.2 litre V6 petrol 4x4 that use less fuel than your SLK?

One can only compare apples with apples.

It is actual consumption that matters, that's why the Co2 levy comes in, less mpg = higher Co2 output.

 

[DieselE]

There was an interesting little snippet in the Daily Mail yesterday. Apparently the last three months have been the warmest for that period since 1731. Records began in 1659. I don't suppose that the fuel consumption of 4x4s was much on an issue in 1731!

It's always possible that the current warming cycle is not influenced by man as much as we think. Mind you, with finite fossil fuel resources it's good housekeeping to try and reduce the rate at which they're being used.

 

[Spinal]

Really. Do you have any examples of 3.2 litre V6 petrol 4x4 that use less fuel than your SLK?

One can only compare apples with apples.

It is actual consumption that matters, that's why the Co2 levy comes in, less mpg = higher Co2 output.

Our "monster" is not a 4x4. In fact, its a 2-wheel drive chryslers... during city driving (or shall we call it parking...) the MPG consumption is 10-15mpg... I have a feeling there are 4x4's with a much better consumption ratio...

 

[marcos]

People now throw stones at me and my beloved car, why didn't I get the CLS?
Oh that's right it would get absolutely ruined on the sites I go on, wouldn't be able to carry all my equipment, wouldn't seat all my family ( new sprog due in July so thats five, and to think I was so close to getting a CLSphew ) and wouldn't be so versatile.

Marcos the Leper

 

[WLeg]

No matter how we look at it taxes on luxury goods are always going to be higher than those on essentials. Andy

True, but is a car a luxury item, or an essential item.....

For me, now, living in the country (well, small village), where there is no school, only 1 postoffice/shop, and a bus service to the station / next town once every 2 hours, I think that a car, if not 4x4 is essential.

When I lived in Islington and worked in Paddington, it WAS a luxury.

 

[WLeg]

slightly off topic....

Will the 4x4 tax include cars such as any of Audi Quattro range, some porches ?

 

[Dryce]

It is actual consumption that matters, that's why the Co2 levy comes in, less mpg = higher Co2 output.

Consumption and MPG aren't quire the same thing. High MPG and low mileage probably equals low consumption.

And the stated MPG and CO2 emissions are meaningless because it's
possible to drive a high MPG/low CO2 car like an idiot.

I know a few people who seem to rack up a lot of miles and get
appalling MPG averages in normal cars. They're not as visible as
the 4x4 brigade so go unnoticed but are probably the real culprits.

 

[silverarrow]

the govt has no cash and the revenue from north sea oil has dropped so tax has to go up.
you watch interest rates up next year bu another 0.25 and then 0.25 in may.
we will go into a recession just like 1992,when $2 to the £.
hose prices canonot keep this rate of rise and fuel house and car will keep rising.ummm umm hung parliment !!!!!!!!!!!! next election

 

[scotth_uk]

It's always possible that the current warming cycle is not influenced by man as much as we think. Mind you, with finite fossil fuel resources it's good housekeeping to try and reduce the rate at which they're being used.

May I suggest the film "An inconvenient truth - a global warning"?

 

[andy_k]

True, but is a car a luxury item, or an essential item.....

For me, now, living in the country (well, small village), where there is no school, only 1 postoffice/shop, and a bus service to the station / next town once every 2 hours, I think that a car, if not 4x4 is essential.

When I lived in Islington and worked in Paddington, it WAS a luxury.

wherever you live a car is a luxury because no matter what we all say there is always an option, OK it may not be very attractive and it may take a couple of hours longer but it's still possible.

The trouble is that the car has become so integrated into our lives that it's now seen as a right to own one or that it's essential.

In your case if none of the children in your vilage could travel to the schools in the area then the education authorities would have to open a school in your village (just like they did before everyone drove their kids to school) or provide a bus service picking up kids in the outlying vilages.

do you need to shop in the village for anything more than essentials - you could do your weekly shop on line and have it delivered

You don't need a car to get to the station, you could use a bike. You choose to use a car because it suits you and because it's easier. That's doesn't make it an essential, it's a luxury and therefore like any other luxury it's taxable.

Andy